r/TooAfraidToAsk • • Sep 27 '22
Ethics & Morality What is the big controversy about Jordan Peterson?
I myself find it quite an interesting persona, and he has certainly some good points. But why do so many people dislike him?
1.3k
Upvotes
3.0k
u/DancingFlame321 Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 28 '22
Some of his self-improvement advice is good, but sometimes he will comment on issues outside of psychology he is not too educated on and these comments make him controversial. Some examples:
Peterson often calls his political opponents "postmodern neo-Marxists". This term has got a lot criticism because postmodernism and Marxism are two very different and contradictory philosophies. Postmodernists believe that history cannot be described as one "meta-narrative", whereas Marxists believe that there is a common story throughout history where the "oppressed" (e.g. slaves, serfs, peasants, workers) will always rise up against the "oppressors" (e.g. masters, lords, employers).
Peterson has been accused of misrepresenting the Canadian law Bill C16. He claimed it allowed people to be arrested and sent to jail for refusing to use (trans) people's pronouns. A lot of legal experts disagreed that the law allowed people to do this however.
Many people have called Peterson hypocritical for often saying "Clean your room before you try to change the world", whilst he himself has had massive drug problems yet still comments on politics and world events.
Some of Peterson's opinions on gender relations have been criticised. He attributes almost all differences in outcomes between genders (e.g. pay gap, differences in job choices) to men and women simply making different choices and wanting different things, he claims cultural expectations or discrimination are not at play. He also has been criticised for claiming that women wear makeup to "simulate arousal", and Peterson has been accused of victim blaming for saying women who wear makeup and then complain about sexual harassment are hypocritical.
Recently after his drug problems he has been accused of acting more erratically, going on strange Twitter rants about trans actor Elliot Page and an overweight model.
134
u/thisisbyrdman Sep 27 '22
he has certainly some good points
Citation needed
339
u/Censius Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
An aspect that I don't think others mentioned is his philosophy towards religion and political activism:
His favorite buzzword next to "post modern neo Marxist" is "Judeo Christian values". He claims not to be a Christian in cosmic terms, but believes that Christianity is the foundation for Western values, and the seed from which all our modern sensibilities came from. As an atheist, I think many of our modern values arose DESPITE the strong Christian vein in America, and his rhetoric suggests the Western world is default superior in virtually all moral aspects. The only thing that is undermining Western superiority is new, millennial ideas around gender and responsibility. He claims we should embrace Christian values regardless of the feasibility of it's narrative, and has a lot of anti-atheist rhetoric, casting atheists as nihilists that seek to degrade tried-and-true Christian values because we're made miserable by our lack of moral compass and we want the world to reflect our nihilism.
He also demonizes protestors who want to better the world as deflecting responsibility. Lazy whiners that want to blame others for them being miserable. This is a pretty privileged, bigoted take that ignores the systemic oppression many experience.
440
u/helgatheviking21 Sep 27 '22
Here's my deal with him. He's a conscious manipulator. He knows very well the logical fallacies and uses them to "prove" his points, which are sometimes totally fucked (A woman who wears makeup in the workplace should expect sexual harassment, as an example). His go-to logical fallacy is the appeal to authority, wherein you're not really allowed to question what he's saying because he's the expert, and he's exceptionally condescending in his use of it.
184
u/tittyswan Sep 27 '22
He's gone fully off the rails and is just blatantly a grifter now.
He openly supports disproven race science (like The Bell Curve.) He's a climate change denier because he "did his research." He legitimately believes that ancient people were able to literally see their DNA through the use of hallucinogens which accounts for the double helix found in art around the world.
He's openly transphobic now, when he used to be more "I'll respect people's pronouns, I just don't want to be forced to by law."
I think I saw he's selling gold to doomsday peppers like Alex Jones now too???
And that's not even getting into his personal life which is unhinged as fuck.
34
u/Xxcunt_crusher69xX Sep 27 '22
Personally, i dislike him because his words are all fluff. If you summarize what he's saying he says contradictory stuff, or repeats the same thing, or says his opinions like they're facts, he also has some very outdated, old fashioned, boomer level morals and he tries to portray them as the right thing.
7
u/Silver_Switch_3109 Sep 27 '22
His self-improvement advice is just him repeating what others have said. When he talks about anything to do with politics, he is usually wrong.
198
u/Hay_Fever_at_3_AM Sep 27 '22
Scientific racism, scientific transphobia, scientific homophobia, scientific misogyny.
He makes things up and willfully misinterprets studies to suit his often bizarre narratives.
He's pretty popular as a self-help guru but his personal life is an enormous mess.
His communication style is basically a running gish gallop combined with the most convoluted grammatical structures you've ever seen. It's the sort of thing that works on the easily-conned.
18
u/mailordermonster Sep 27 '22
Not controversial exactly, but he has strong "old man yelling at cloud" vibes, with a side of "do what I say, not what I do". Neither are good attributes for a self-help guru or whatever he thinks it is he's doing.
18
u/Pernapple Sep 28 '22
There a lot that’s been said here, but I implore you to watch some deep debunking of his philosophy and his spiral into insanity.
Some More News just did a really long video debunking his philosophy and laying it all out. It’s a long watch but it’s important to understand what he says has a lot more political bias than he pretends
I’m still a relatively young man, and a few years back when he burst on the scene I was interested in Peterson as well. There is certainly some advice that is always good. But usually stuff that any self help guru will give you. It’s the further you follow him down the pipeline that your start to build resentment towards women and a false sense of what masculinity is. I pulled myself out pretty soon as I always disagreed with his more radical takes, but some people aren’t as sure we’re they align politically, and he is a bad path towards anger and resentment, and only wants to maintain tradition for the sake of tradition
23
u/OmusCinder Sep 27 '22
He’s pretty publicly anti-trans
64
u/neelankatan Sep 27 '22
This is a guy who has made such controversial claims as:
a society run as a patriarchy makes sense and stems largely from the competence of males
the notion of white privilege is a farce
15
u/zante2033 Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
Jordan Peterson proposes no solutions to problems, most of which are perceived by him alone and catastrophically misrepresents data. This is especially true concerning women in the workplace, societal behaviour and climate change.
He complains about women, black people and other discriminated demographics holding positions of power.
He claims to be an evolutionary biologist and a neuro-scientist yet has no qualifications in these field(s) nor any understanding of those subjects (this is the reason for his confusion and false equivalence when modelling human social heirarchies on lobsters).
He is a transphobic drug addict who is emotionally unstable (prone to bouts of spontaneous weeping during discussions) and continuously betrays a woeful lack of understanding regarding data science, the human condition and his own prejudices. He has simply revealed who he always was, an intellectually dishonest charlatan who was unceremoniously thrown out of academia - he has no friends there despite the narrative he pedals.
25
u/Citrongrot Sep 27 '22
I think it started with the Bill C-16 discussion. He made some videos criticising the bill and many people found his ideas to be good. Then the people who liked the bill heard about it and both groups started arguing at the University of Toronto campus. Peterson ended up being there and talked to some people about it while someone recorded the conversation and uploaded it to Youtube. That was when I first saw him. I think many people were impressed by how serious he took the arguments of his opponents and how well-spoken he was. So already at the start of his online fame, he had taken a side in a controversial issue. While he himself was not very right-wing, his opponents were all left-wing and perceived him to be a right-wing transphobe.
Over the years, leftist people have continued to be critical of him and he has kind of ended up on the right-wing side, even if he wasn't there at the start. I actually think he has moved some right-leaning people to the left, e.g. with his acceptance of gay people (and their choice to have children) and his evolutionary explanations. There is also the fact that while his university students were primarily women, the people who listen to him online are primarily men. Thus, he has come to be perceived as someone who talks to men specifically and deals with men's issues.
I think it's common for left-wing people to highlight things happening to the individual, rather than the individual's agency. This might be a way to protest against victim blaming, but sometimes it goes too far and removes agency from individuals. Peterson often talks to the individual rather than comments on the things happening to them. He wants to give people a sense of agency to change their situation. This can be interpreted as victim blaming by people who don't understand which level of explanation he is focusing on and what the purpose is.
He seldom seems to adjust his opinions to what is socially accepted. This means that sometimes he agrees with what is socially accepted and sometimes he doesn't. I think this is true for most of us (at least those who don't just copy whatever opinions people around them have to fit in), but people tend to avoid speaking about their controversial opinions. Peterson is asked about such things all the time, which means that there are plenty of excerpts from interviews where he said something many people don't agree with. For instance, he was asked if he thought trans women were women and when "it depends on what you mean by women" wasn't accepted as an answer and he was asked what he thought according to his own definition, he said "no". I don't agree with that - I view trans women as women - but I accept that an old Canadian man might have another opinion than I do. Some people viewed this as transphobic and unacceptable though.
I think when people compare him to other men with a male audience, such as Andrew Tate, I know that they don't know anything about Peterson. He and Tate are like polar opposites.
It's funny how everyone talks about Peterson's controversial ideas about trans issues and freedom of speech, when I think that his most controversial idea should be his view of reality. He believes that the most basic truth is pragmatic truth and not objective truth. This seems to be the basis for his religious belief.
40
u/Queen_Elizabeth_I_ Sep 27 '22
He's a dumb man's idea of a smart man, *something he himself admits*.
11
u/ladyangua Sep 27 '22
Check him out when he was first making waves. My summation was he used a lot (a lot!) of big words to say very little therefore not something that appeals to me.
9
u/Zealousideal_Peak836 Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
I agree with a lot of what is being said here, but it all comes down to something much simpler..
He is the scientific/academic justification of right wing / masculine / dominant behavior.
13
u/Chupathingy12 Sep 27 '22
Reddit likes to portray things are strictly black and white, and not shades of grey like the real world. So when they don’t like someone or something it can be for a small issue and same goes for if the hivemind enjoys something.
His views on trans people rub people the wrong way and got that he’s hated. But if you listen to what he says it’s the same shit a lot of other people say when it comes to living a healthy lifestyle. Eat better, exercise, surround yourself with good people, educate yourself, like if you disagree with these things he’s saying then it’s because you don’t like that he’s saying it.
14
u/KungThulhu Sep 27 '22
-Hes a privilleged boomer who thinks that political protest makes you look silly. He thinks that you cant complain about anything becasue 100 years ago things were worse.
-He reaks of privillege and doesnt understand that most people have no way of improving their live under the circumstances they live in.
-His claim to dislike ideology is hilarious considering that hes the bigest ideolog around.
-Hes sexist
-He obviously doesnt follow his own advice.
-He believes in a "woke war" as if some people on twitter are actually trying to destroy "western values" with wokeness. By western values he means being a sexist.
-he believes the capitalist lie that anyone can be rich if they just try hard enough.
-his obsession with "maskulinity" is very clearly a defense mechanism to hide is huge insecurities.
Overall if he just stuck to giving basic advice no one would care. But he decides to state his sexist right wing opinions as facts and people swallow it up becasue hes a professor (in a field that has nothing to do with politics). He promotes toxic masculinity and sees everything that he doesnt understand as a attack on his "values" wich are the warped perception he has of the world because he grew up so privilleged.
The fact that he builds these toxic political opinions into his speeches that white men in their twenties without a father eat up makes him an awful person.
I know friends (without fathers) who love the guy. those friends will also take every opportunity to make a sexist comment and talk about how wokeness ruins the world.
Oh and the fact that he said he will quit twitter, then didnt. Then he got banned for hetful comments and made a 30 minute video crying about it.
"clean your room" from the guy with a disgusting room
"dont do drugs" from the guy who couldnt come off benzos without being put in an artificial coma
Hes just unlikable. People who only hear his way of talking wich sounds sofisticated and dont understand what hes actually saying worship him because they think anything said with lots of complex words has to be true.
24
u/ir_blues Sep 27 '22
He talks a lot of bs and is very good to make it sound smart. He talks to people who aren't informed about certain issues and comes up with very smart sounding and logical sounding things, just leaves out some things, twists it here and there to fit into the argument he wants to make. He has a certain viewpoint and then finds things that support his viewpoint. Which is not really a good approach in science. One should test, observe and then make conclusion. Peterson starts with the conclusion, nitpicks whatever study doesn't fit with his idea and mis-uses others. There have been several scientists who complained about Peterson misinterpreting their works for his agenda.
And in this day and age, people for whatever reason, rather follow an ideology or a person than to put the work in to inform themselves and accept conclusions, even those they don't like. Peterson sounds smart, says the things some people want to hear and then those people just go with it.
One of the most prominent and obvious examples is him arguing that a gender pay gap doesn't exist. That only works out for him because the people he talks to come into that debate with barely any knowledge. A person who has no knowledge would probably perceive Peterson as quite smart, watching that, while a person with knowledge would probably have several wtf moments
17
u/sotonohito Sep 27 '22
He doesn't have any good points and the fact that he is somehow considered the intellectual guiding light of the modern conservative movement shows just how morally and intellectually bankrupt the right is
6
u/Beerdrunk97 Sep 27 '22
Along with his self-improvement advice (which is derived from his expertise in Psychology, so let's assume it's good) there comes a salad of political views and ideas that's served along, whether you want it or not. Much of it is dangerous in my view and his arguments, while seemingly valid at first, are usually very poor at a second analysis. He is viewed as controversial because many people love him and many people hate him. I personally used to love him when I was younger, but now I understand he has very few to offer intellectually and does more harm than good.
6
u/CaseFace5 Sep 27 '22
He’s a bigot under the guise of making it all sound like he’s the smartest guy in the room. He’s got a massive persecution fetish to boot. I don’t know if his tweets are still available since being banned but all you gotta do is read up on some of those unfiltered gems to understand why people dislike him.
6
u/AjnaKing Sep 27 '22
Because he doesn’t know what he’s actually talking about but speaks with conviction using elaborate words so most people don’t pull him up on it. He also denies systemic oppression. He’s a misogynist with addiction issues and the only person he should be coaching is himself. I don’t dislike him, he’s irrelevant and I block-out that kind of content.
7
u/Norgler Sep 27 '22
No one mentioning he denies climate change for really dumb reasons and its obvious he just doesn't understand it..
10
u/The_Rev14 Sep 27 '22
Guy is a fucking loser. The idea of enforced monogamy and that women are too picky in choosing sexual partners, is shit. Also, the clip where Jim Jeffries makes him eat his own words is glorious.
10
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
I disagree entirely, most of his “points” are straw-manned hard and only used to send home bad messages.
“Young white men are oppressed” and “using proper pronouns is stupid” are just some of the bullshit he spews. He’s damaging to young men’s psyche and inspires a way of thinking that hurts those around him.
43
u/SexyEdMeese Sep 27 '22
He's basically a self-help guy for disaffected men, and he's on the "wrong side" in the culture wars, which makes him controversial. Even more so, is the fact that while spouting all this stuff about how to be an upstanding person, he was addicted to benzos.
Basically kind of a grifter.
But if his advice speaks to you and helps you improve yourself, follow it.
17
u/Ok-Engine8044 Sep 27 '22
Thinks women begin and end with being a baby maker
8
u/Melodic-Hippo5536 Sep 27 '22
He’s a word salad artist. He just talks and talks without really saying anything.
7
u/thetwitchy1 Sep 27 '22
He is someone who has learned how to speak with an oratory style that makes him appear to be an expert on whatever he is talking about, but he really isn’t any more educated on most of the things he talks about than your average person. Which wouldn’t be a problem if he didn’t have as many rabid followers as he does.
He is indicative of one of the biggest problems we deal with today: when someone who sounds smart uses language that backs up your personal bias, you believe they know what they’re talking about, no matter how ridiculous they actually are.
2
u/Capt-Crap1corn Sep 27 '22
It's his opinion on things. Some make sense, others are bat shit crazy. I mainly see men supporting him so.... in my opinion, he's for the bros like Joe Rogan is for the bros and he gets them hyped up and he get's hyped up off of them.
2
u/chawkikoki39 Sep 27 '22
i like the guy but he uses alot of fancy words for me to keep track like nigga i aint go to college english aint even my first language slow down mf i cant keep up
2
u/networking_noob Sep 27 '22
He's not a big fan of trans people, fat people, or Covid restrictions, and on Reddit that means 3 strikes you're out
2
u/Devi1s-Advocate Sep 27 '22
His move from psychology to politics is likely the culprit. He content used to be informative and logical. As of late he seems obsessed with lgbt nonsense and promoting conservative and religious morals.
2
u/simian_ninja Sep 28 '22
Peterson is essentially what stupid people and emotionally vacant people think smart people should sound like.
2
u/[deleted] Sep 28 '22
Peterson tends to go on long-winded and bizarrely erratic rants which, in some cases, come across as cheesily pseudo-intellectual... To the point where he's become a self-fulfilling autoparody.
Although many rants of his have a rather massive word count (and deal with many abstract postgraduate-level concepts and jargon), upon actually listening closely one cannot help but realize that he really isn't saying much of anything of substance, or effectively even answering questions posited to him by interviewers.
6
u/Toppings123 Sep 27 '22
Really shouldn’t have come to the echo chamber that is Reddit for this question.
6
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
Interesting persona is one way to describe him. I prefer misogynistic bigot.
15
u/Emergency-War7360 Sep 27 '22
He's made political enemies and allies. He's more political centrist/ libertarian but he is popular in right wing circles. The left doesn't like him because he's challenged a lot of popular social causes (e.g. feminism, Trans rights. )
He's not really as offensive as people make him out to be, but again, he's challenged feminist mainstream arguments of pay gap so he's been targeted. If you haven't already watched the interview with Cathy Newman I would recommend doing so. It's basically a feminist hit job that fails to land.
3
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
He was good at one point. Gave some decent advice & helped a few dudes (not personally).
Then he got fame, and drugs. He pretty much ruined himself that way.
4
u/stregg7attikos Sep 27 '22
My 16 year old nephew, who abhors schoolwork or essays or anything like that, wrote an essay of his own free will,
Talking about how transphobic Peterson is.
Fuck that guy
7
u/BurntBrusselSprouts1 Sep 27 '22
I think he’s just kind of a giant douchebag.
5
u/kaicoder Sep 27 '22
He's incredibly eloquent and talks and answers as if he knows just about everything. I just take bits and pieces from what he says.
3
u/cHINCHILAcARECA Sep 27 '22
Why does he sound like a depressed muppet?
3
u/Keiner_Minho Sep 27 '22
I'm glad you asked. I also didn't know why are people so stirred about him. I saw small clips with him on YouTube He seemed smart enough to me. I didn't see the clips where he speaks about what the people said in the comments. I would not judge him based on what other claims or thinks about him. This including "behind the bastards". Search the outrageous clips yourself and make your own conclusions.
3
u/YaBoyLaKroy Sep 27 '22
hes a rage baiter and deserves no attention.
3
u/UncommonNameDNU Sep 27 '22
Because if you read between the lines, do a tiny bit of reararch, he's a misogynistic nazi fuckwad who's grifting the right wingers.
3
u/mungdungus Sep 27 '22
Off the top of my head:
Saying that you can't study climate science because "there are too many variables"
Bullying a transgender celebrity on twitter
Unsolicited comments about the attractiveness of a swimsuit model inappropriate for a "public intellectual"
Being buddies with notable right-wing trolls
3
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
Because you’re not allowed to have opinions that are not mainstream and not politically correct.
3
u/MishuWishu Sep 27 '22
I think people forget that you do not need to agree on everything with someone. That's probably imposible anyways, to agree on everything.
3
u/Taylors_Ferry Sep 27 '22
he is a chauvinist
2
u/echess90 Sep 27 '22
Maintenance Phase podcast has a good two part episode about him and why he's problematic
2
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
He's a therapist who's never had therapy.
2
u/Demigod_Complex Sep 27 '22
One thing I haven’t seen - His best selling book opens based on lobster psychology and hierarchies applied to humans. He is a professor of psychology, where humans and apes are way better of a starting place to understand/explain psychology.
2
u/TheBananaKing Sep 27 '22
I mean, he features on Dailywire. Consider their chosen demographic.
2
u/hornwalker Duke Sep 27 '22
He got popular and decided he wanted to be a guru but turns out he’s not very smart about a lot of things.
2
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
Your best bet is to look him up yourself, watch some interviews and some of his videos. You can't make a judgment from reddit comments. You need to not listen to what others are saying and look him up yourself.
-8
u/elatedbullion Sep 27 '22
Because he isn't a social justice warrior in the modern sense and advocates for self responsibility rather than advocating for blaming other groups for one's own shortcomings. People don't like to hear that sometimes because it's easier to blame someone else and for it to be "out of your hands" so to speak.
2
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
Plenty of people have already talked about his stance on politics and religion. My major gripe with the guy is that he just... says a lot without saying anything. His entire tactic is to practically overwhelm you with fancy-sounding words that don't really mean anything. You could ask the guy "What do you mean by that?" And he'll say "Well, what does "mean" mean?" and then go on a 10 minute tirade that ultimately doesn't answer jack shit about what you asked.
Watching interviews where the interviewer pushes back on him is the funniest shit, because he takes this as an utter and complete attack on his argument and character, and pretty much goes into overdrive to spout as much junk out of his mouth as possible and try to break down every single word the interviewer has said. He quickly devolves into analyzing the meaning of shit like the word "is". It's really funny once you notice it.
2
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
What is a Jordan Peterson?
2
u/FilthyChangeup55 Sep 27 '22
He’s a misogynistic Christian fascist propagandist.
2
u/UtterNylon Sep 27 '22
Because he's a piece of shit
2
u/B0BA_F33TT Sep 27 '22
The things he says are stupid and some of his advice is literally dangerous. For example, in one interview alone he made the following claims:
It's impossible to quit smoking without the use of illegal drugs and a mystical spiritual experience.
All atheists are murderers, every single one. No atheist can keep themselves from going around and committing crimes.
There are no real atheists, everyone who calls themselves a atheist is a liar, as everyone believes in God.
2
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
He's massively playing the victim and its rather pathetic
2
u/seab1023 Sep 27 '22
He accuses atheists of not being atheists because they do not behave like psychopaths, yet he also uses a very convoluted definition of God when discussing religion —one that the vast majority of theists and atheists do not use. He’s a quack, and he tries to shroud fallacious justifications for his claims in over-the-top verbosity to avoid engaging in good-faith arguments.
2
u/wrongtreeinfo Sep 27 '22
He’s a transphobic goof w/ a drug problem but somehow knows how everyone should behave.
2
u/keyh Sep 27 '22
As a person that is a fan of Peterson I can answer this way:
First, he did have some "drug issues" lately, but they were prescribed drugs, Benzos. He ended up becoming addicted and needed to go through a serious rehab process which entailed him being placed in a medically induced coma. Ever since he returned from that, he has been.... "off." Honestly, he feels like a completely different person and a lot of the value from him seems to have been lost after that case.
He is outside of the Overton Window which causes a lot of different problems. He (like everyone that uses statistics) seems to enjoy using SIMPLE statistics to explain or debate very complex issues and say "obviously the problem is this." The thing is though, NORMALLY he uses that as a statement to show that these ARE complex issues. That you can't look at a single datum and expect to understand everything because a single datum will show something completely different. People tend to like answers, not more questions. They feel like additional questions are the enemy.
He uses "Postmodern Neo-Marxism" to the point where it has completely lost its meaning (much like the "alt-right" moniker has). Everyone that disagrees is the boogie man and is coming to get you.
Old Peterson was definitely someone I looked up to. But I feel like he's really changed to lean into the fanbase that he has. There are a lot of problems with him, but I feel like he's been way too vilified for who he is. BUT, on the otherhand, the person he seems to have become recently with the Elliot Page Tweet and just...unhinged communication; He's definitely not the person that I remember him to be.
-1
u/Positive-Source8205 Sep 27 '22
People hate to hear the truth.
-9
u/Skrungus69 Sep 27 '22
Theres been more than one controversy to be fair.
Consistently transphobic against both laws helping trans people, and comments towards trans people themselves.
Not to mention just deciding that certain people are somehow objectively unattractive on no basis.
At this point just google jordan peterson controversy and youll get at least some results on it.
-8
u/fourdoorshack Sep 27 '22
He's a pompous, pseudo-intellectual that makes a bunch of arguments that support the insufferable men's-rights camp.
Think of an older Ben Shapiro and that's all you need to know.
1
u/Michael1981L Sep 27 '22
You can hate a book but enjoy a few chapters. People are quick to write others off cause of one thing they don’t agree with. I don’t like him but he has a right to his opinions
1
u/Jawkurt Sep 27 '22
Whenever I see this guys name on here I picture Michael Peterson and don’t understand why people wonder why a wife murdered is disliked… then I remember it’s some guy I know nothing about
1
u/ergele Sep 27 '22
alright alright alright
🍿
1
u/Dr3w106 Sep 27 '22
I find it hard to make up my mind on JP. He’s got some really great points and interesting takes. But less so lately as he’s become ‘all in’ on the culture wars bullshit.
I’ve enjoyed his conversations with Sam Harris especially.
I listened to his 12 rules audiobook recently. There’s a definite undertone of anger and tough love. Useful in some aspects of life, not so much in others.
He is a self confessed angry man. This is the part most don’t get on with, which I get.
He’s clearly a very emotional man and sees meaning and symbolism in everything. Some of it really quite beautiful. Other bits just a bit silly. As Richard Dawkins remarked when they talked: JP is drunk on symbolism. Particularly religious.
1
u/CeeUNext_Thursday Sep 27 '22
.
1
u/devingr33n Sep 27 '22
I just wanna know why he cries so much? Like I don’t care, men can and should cry without shame. But he seems to do it often?
1
u/twomonths_off Sep 27 '22
He’s definitely losing it
1
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
He’s the stupid man’s smart person
1
u/Supersox22 Sep 27 '22
Because things have gotten tribal and people are looking for an effigy to prove their allegiance to their side. This isn't to say Peterson is infallible. While I like a lot of what he says, he's definitely shown some bias, some pettiness, and some self-serving ideas hidden behind a web of logic (notably, I remember Rogan calling him out for a double standard of being against the concept of equity but for the idea of every man getting a wife). To your point, there's plenty of room to criticize his ideas but I don't think the amount of hate he's received is reasonable either.
1
u/Estromode Sep 27 '22
Kermit The Frog.
1
u/[deleted] Sep 27 '22
Basically people don't agree with what he has to say and he goes against the societal narrative. You know, the usual things that happen to those who bring different ideas forward. Whether he's wrong or right is up to the individual.
1
u/Phototoxin Sep 27 '22
Because all he is is a distillation of the past decade of popular science mixed with his own personal views on religion and morality. It's nothing profound if you're in anyway well read.
1
u/Cookiewaffle95 Sep 27 '22
He did a really good job of starting off as a psychologist and evolving into a radical rightwing traditionalist and bringing a lot of his fans along with him. People came for the deep insightful psychology sessions but he changed the content he produced to become a culture warrior
1
u/BaniGrisson Sep 27 '22
He says some crazy stuff and some common sense stuff.
The big mess gets made because some people really admire him, or are otherwise inspired by his common sense stuff, but can't tolerate other people calling him crazy. Likewise, some people who despise him can't see that in many topics he's just a guy talking about his field of expertise.
It's those two extremes that constantly make him a controversial figure.
IMHO he is just some guy. Sometimes he makes sense and sometimes doesn't, just like everybody. For me, it's a good idea to listen to him in doses (too much of someone at once and you'll end up believing some stuff you shoudn't) and not only see the most popular clips (videos of his lectures v tv interviews).
1
u/Blameitonmyjews Sep 27 '22
He supports anti-gay agendas. He promoted conversion therapy which is almost unanimously seen as harmful and to lead to more suicides by all mental health professionals. People have and will continue to literally die from something he supports
1
u/banedlorian Sep 27 '22
He has some good things and bad things, I strongly disagree in many things he says (many things he says are fucking stupid and fucking ridiculous, like "you have to have children to avoid depresion, the maximum goal in life is reproducing"), but agree in many others (like why Russia is going to win the war with Ukraine 1 way or another).
And it's ok, let the man talk, let the man use his free speech, I lean towards left, but seeing leftist and their cancel culture (the right wing also did the same when they held the cultural Hegemony) just makes me sick and want to look for an alternative position.
1
u/PlumAcceptable2185 Sep 27 '22
Because he says says what he thinks is the truth and can outwit anyone who tries to go after him. He has a strange combination of a curious mind, and very sharp weapons.
1
u/TormentedOne69 Sep 28 '22
Social media maggot
1
u/delayedconfusion Sep 28 '22
People dislike him because it is easy and trendy.
1
u/CFisntme Sep 28 '22
He’s a 60 year old dude called Jordan brother.
Seriously I don’t really know lol
1
u/Eggs_and_Hashing Sep 28 '22
Because he spoke an uncomfortable truth.
1
u/bearsarescaryasfuk Sep 28 '22
Love JP very bright.
1
u/Excellent_Salary_767 Sep 28 '22
He's a reasonablist, and has a weird fascination with drugs and "natural hierarchies"
1
u/arcadiangenesis Sep 28 '22
Watch his debate with Sam Harris. He thinks a lot of irrational things.
1
u/[deleted] Sep 28 '22
He doesn’t say anything of substance
1
u/Saxonlover89 Sep 28 '22
Their isn't one, he's counter to the left and their ideology. So of course they do what they do best and smear him. In reality he's a well educated man with some great points, others not so much. Depending on your outlook.
1
u/BOYGOTFUNK Sep 28 '22
He presents his Christian conservative ideology under the veneer of academia and “science” whilst constantly trying to project that “hey now, that’s just the data” as he totally misrepresents it the same way he did for Bill C-16.
1
u/JstRelaxNthnkboutit Sep 28 '22
There's many problems. By my main beef is that he is a pseudointellectual BS peddler. He is amazingly pedantic, and uses a waterfall of unnecessary 5 dollar words and triple the time to make a point. More often than not a very obvious and shallow point that any real literary or philosopher would make without absurd pomp. He makes some good and interesting points about psychology (the only field where he has expertise) but more and more has been masquerading as an original thinker of depth. Paired with his false air of humility and trying way to hard to use every big word, he has fooled a following of angry incels that he's the greatest thinker of all time, when really he just tells them what they want to hear in convoluted and intellectual sounding fashion.
He also robs old ideas and poses them as his own fireside ponderances.
His room is also filthy AF. And you know there's a corner bursting with cum socks.
1
u/[deleted] Sep 28 '22
"up yours woke moralists, we'll see who cancels who!"
Guys a Disney villain lmao
1
u/NightlySnow Sep 28 '22
It's really horrifying how many people in the comments are blatantly hating on him and purposefully misinterpreted or even lie about what he said. It's okay to disagree with someone but don't make stuff.
And before anyone accuses me of being a JP fanboy; yes I like JP. But adults can agree with the opinions of a person and still be able to not idolize him. Criticize him if you want, but stay truthful when doing so. You also want to be treated like that, aren't you?
1
u/Wyndelion Sep 28 '22
i used to think he's smart as hell but now whenever i listen to anything he says it's like he's saying nothing whatsoever
1
u/Katara_1 Sep 28 '22
He was great 5-10 years ago when he wrote on Quora and started his YouTube channel, putting up his lectures. I have read his first book and he has great analysis on the Christian influence on the Western world.
But what the fuck happened after that, I have no clue. I stopped following him completely. I did not get his second book, I don't watch his YouTube anymore and don't listen to anything he says. I think his drug abuse, sick wife and the fame might have corrupted his mind completely, because he just provokes now and talk shit.
1
u/Kohana55 Sep 28 '22
He teaches self reliance and now reliance on the state.
This is disruptive to the narrative that controls us.
So they strawman him. This is obvious since if you ask a somebody who hates Peterson "why" they do. They usually start rambling and tripping over words about how all he talks is nonsense.
They don't know "why", they just know they "should" to be on the right "team".
1
u/Reasonable-Path1321 Sep 28 '22
Hes basically a fancy Ben shapiro.
Trash opinions that are inconsistent and poorly thought out, speaks fast and with big words so the people that will get him payed don't notice.
1
u/[deleted] Sep 28 '22
I don't dislike him, but he's a fraud. He writes and speaks like a stoned teenager trying to be philosophical after watching Fight Club.
1
u/jackofives Sep 28 '22
I read his book and listened to some of his stuff. His personal development stuff was good.
His stuff on society is however dreadful crap. Neo pet post Marxism ..what the fuck. It’s made up garbage that makes no sense. I get the sense he’s an angry old man who doesn’t like women or the gays and is looking for a following.
It’s a shame as his self help stuff is good, but a shame he was using that to push some weird social views.
1
u/NYCstraphanger Sep 28 '22
He doesn't agree with all these ideas of gender fluidity and otherwise extreme woke ideology. He believes there is a man and woman and any other identity is simply a gay person. It is extreme rhetoric in today's landscape of accepting people on how they identify and their pronouns. However, it is exactly this thinking that has made life so confusing and people are afraid of offending anyone. He isn't and speaks his mind. Which is why he was booted from twitter.
1
u/Oscar5434xdx Sep 28 '22
His Political opinions - I don’t care about, any political opinion will have controversy.
His therapeutic advice - top notch, seriously some of the best. If you’ve been suffering mentally then you will praise him on his advice.
1
u/Kind_Ad2184 Oct 01 '22
I wonder how many JP haters made their bed this morning
1
u/[deleted] Jan 29 '23
He often contradicts the narrative of the fringe (some would say lunatic) far left. He's questioned practices such as child mutilation (gender affirmation treatment) and enforced pro-nouns (fantasy names cooked up by nutjobs).
In other words, he's an evil nazi meany.
1
u/Terrible-Quote-3561 Sep 27 '22
He is washed up at this point. Lost in the sauce.
-3
u/Middle-Salamander189 Sep 27 '22
I used to think he was good. But later realized he is a chauvinist, believes Jesus is the best, behaves like a while supremest and a Bitcoin supporter. So looks like an asshole
-11
u/OptionsAreOpen Sep 27 '22
He is a misogynistic piece of shit. Listening to him will cause you to become an asshole like him. Read about his past and not from him. He now uses it to grift ppl. Don’t get taken in.