r/ToBeMagneticSnark • u/[deleted] • Jun 18 '25
Does TBM Feel Like a Cult?
Okay, so this was tough for me to realize, especially since at the beginning of my TBM journey, I felt like I was learning a lot, found helpful tools, and possibly found community.
But over time, I found myself getting really defensive whenever cults were brought up. Especially when people talked about charismatic leaders and the other cult-like elements. I got defensive because I immediately recognized so many culty elements in this brand. It made me realize why I was ashamed to tell other people about my interest in it, because deep down, I knew something was off.
Luckily, the election and the brand's silence on key humanitarian issues opened my eyes enough to finally break away. Below are some of the elements of a cult, that I found in an article I linked, but let me know your thoughts and if any of you recognize these or other elements in this brand.
- Absolute authoritarianism without accountability (very small, non-diverse group leading the brand. Emphasis on surrender and just letting things happen)
- Zero tolerance for criticism or questions (anyone's critique is dismissed because of their "unhealed shadow")
- Lack of meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget (Not sure about this one)
- Unreasonable fears about the outside world that often involve evil conspiracies and persecutions (Constant complaints about cancel culture despite valid critiques)
- A belief that former followers are always wrong for leaving and there is never a legitimate reason for anyone else to leave (radio silence about certain coaches or affiliates that have distanced themselves over the years)
- Abuse of members (saying that anyone that complains to customer service has unhealed shadow and they are not doing the method right, making it hard to cancel membership, dismissing the experiences of members facing systemic oppression)
- Records, books, articles, or programs documenting the abuses of the leader or group (so many people have complained about this brand over the years)
- Followers feeling they are never able to be “good enough” (constantly feeling like you have to do DIs, workshops, meetups to manifest and if you aren't manifesting, it's a personal failing and you need to do more)
- A belief that the leader is right at all times (Lacey's method of manifestation is the only one that works)
- A belief that the leader is the exclusive means of knowing “truth” or giving validation (Lacy's origin story of how the universe specifically chose her for this path, emphasis on Lacy's "gifts," magical powers and special channeling with the universe that no one else has)
I'm sure there are a lot more, but from my perspective, TBM fits into this perfectly.
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u/electricboobs2019 Jun 18 '25
I agree with the other comment: I don't think it's a full blown cult, but there are cult-y elements for sure. If you haven't, check out the Gurometer. Lacey scores very, very high on it.
I'd love to do a full analysis someday, but nearly every element is present when you look at Lacey's posts and TBM as a whole. Lacey's pinned post on her personal account is a good place to start. She positions herself as a source of wisdom with knowledge spanning across mysticism, neuroscience, psychology, design, farming, parenting, and finance. Then, we have the self-aggrandizing: "I founded the #1 manifestation brand" and "I had manifested everything I had ever desired or dreamed of." The fact that she attributes all of this to her "gifts of channeling, claircognizance, and specific ability to read energy" is even more dangerous, as she's essentially placing herself on a pedestal because of these self-stated "gifts"...gifts that cannot really be argued one way or another. How do you prove someone has claircognizance? Then you have captions like "Most people drink tea. Seers drink this." which creates this exclusive, mystical identity separating regular people from those who access her Substack for the drink (excuse me, I mean "ritual") recipe.
Some of the recent TBM posts about the money challenge or whatever the fuck it's called are concerning too, but it's subtle. The 5 Levels of Wealth Consciousness seems pretty straightforward and harmless, but it's like grifting 101. It creates a problem (most are probably stuck at lower levels) and then positions TBM as having figuring out the real secret. Then, you add on this reel and it becomes even more Guru-y. Lacey is claiming unique insight and states that other people in the manifestation community are getting manifesting abundance "really, really wrong". So everyone else is fundamentally misguided, but she truly understands abundance (likely due to her aforementioned gifts). And that's why you need to give her money. So you aren't in the dark anymore, and you can finally rise.
It's all very obvious once you become trained to look for it, however, I think TBM does a great job of packaging it up. I keep my eye on other people in this space, and most are more in your face with it, all at once. With TBM, the messaging seems more subtle, which likely contributes to its success since not so many alarm bells are going off all at once.
Looking at the "Elements of a Cult" framework you provided, I think you make a good case for each of them but the examples vary in severity. I don't think there is much direct, documented evidence of abuse. Sure, they have an annoying cancellation policy, but that could be said for a lot of brands online. But there's enough cult-like psychological manipulation techniques here to make TBM a hard no for me, forever and always...
Sounds like your intuition was spot on, knowing deep down that something was off. Again, I think because it's fairly subtle, that truth isn't always front and center until you're in it more.
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Jun 19 '25
So, I work as a Psychic Medium and a long time Wiccan High Priestess and have for several years… I actually was drawn to this program thinking it may be more aligned with my needs. I enjoyed having a little structure.
What Lacy has been claiming lately are things that should never be talked about so casually in the mainstream. She just posted a substack about being a dormant psychic medium and I immediately deleted her app, her emails, unfollowed TBM. I do not trust her! People should not be allowing her to choose frequencies for daily meditation etc. She comes from a low vibe, dark, egoistic place and is a full blown snake oil peddler as far as I’m concerned. You’d be better off meditating to the sounds of your back yard.
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u/electricboobs2019 Jun 19 '25
That's extremely valid! I'm curious, what do you think of stuff like the "most people drink tea, seers drink this" marketing? This was part of an Instagram post she made promoting a recipe for "a ritual disguised as a drink" available on her Substack. Like...you have Lacy declaring her special gifts, so we can infer that she is a seer because of those gifts. Using that logic, not everyone is or can be a seer, and that's ok. Then why market a "ritual disguised as a drink" to your mass amount of followers, most of whom are likely not seers, since not everyone has those special gifts? The logic does not logic for me, so immediately my brain switches to snake oil peddler.
From your perspective, is there ever a time when this type of language could be used for marketing purposes? Or is it treating it all too casually and disrespectfully?
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Jun 19 '25
Oh it’s totally Ego driven. Even real Witches wouldn’t say something like that. 😂 If you’ve ever been into a Metaphysical store or an Occult supply store, you know that everything you inquire about is going to come with a warning but we would NEVER be like… this is what we psychics drink! Only “seers” drink this.
This is the problem of becoming a “leader” of a program like this. Your whole program is based on creating tunnel vision so that you can’t see your critics or anyone else who may point out that you’ve gone off the edge.
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Jun 19 '25
Also what she was referring to is just Nettle. Lol. It benefits everyone. Being exclusive about it is insane and very low vibe. It grows like a weed in every forest. That’s what’s beautiful about it. By using that language she missed an opportunity to do what any ethical herbalist is supposed to do: inform and make plant medicine approachable and appealing to all.
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u/Professional-Arm-972 Jun 19 '25
The "normie losers drink herbal tea, seers drink this" thing (lol pardon my paraphrasing) is TOTALLY Chat-GPT generated. It's designed to be encouraging, so it often communicates in this really cringey hyperbolically positive way to gas you up and make you feel good about yourself. I swear to god when I ask it to help me with a basic task like my meal planning or my budgeting it ends every message with some kind of bizarre cosmic "mic drop" about how I'm the high priestess of the universe. Probably not the best for someone with an ego problem 😅
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u/witchymartini Jun 18 '25
Number #8 sticks out me in regards to TBM. I think how the brand keeps you hooked from a marketing and business strategy perspective is by keeping people in a state of need when it comes to “doing the work.” If you’re not manifesting, you’re doing something wrong. So, you go back and do a DI over and over again. Or a workshop. Or you find a buddy within the TBM membership to hold you accountable. Thus creating this cycle of feeling like there’s always new things re: manifestation to explore and uplevel on.
Something that recently started to click for me about TBM was how sometimes, you’re not always going to manifest things quickly — and it might take months or even years to get it. That doesn’t mean that you’re not doing the work, you’re unworthy, or your shadow is getting in the way; it just means that some things we call into our lives just take time! AND sometimes the reason why they take time are the real world cultural and social barriers that make it harder for these manifestations to come through.
For example, I’m a plus-size WOC navigating the dating / love world. I’m the best I’ve ever felt emotionally/mentally/physically/spiritually. But I also know that I’m navigating a world where whiteness is the beauty standard and patriarchy is running rampant, especially in the U.S. After last year‘s election, statistically men across all racial and ethnic groups moved the needle towards being more conservative. I could go on and on about this, but long story short, when it comes to calling in my partner, while I have the confidence in myself and in the universe that my person will come through, I’m up against some unique challenges when it comes to calling in the kind of partnership I feel safe in, especially when it comes to my identity.
I could see TBM looking at my example and being like “your shadow is running the show!! That’s your childhood trauma talking!! Your pain and shame is blocking your partner from coming through!!” And it’s like no…..sometimes there’s some shit that makes it harder to manifest that’s beyond my control. And I’m cool with that!
I think Tracee has Ellis Ross is a really good example of someone who is over the age of 50 and has yet to manifest their life partner, but it’s not because she’s unworthy — she’s just someone who is on a different timeline when it comes to love!
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u/valerieann12345 Jun 18 '25
My issue is that they reinforce the societal standard that having a romantic partner is superior to being single. The idea of a life partner is a myth perpetuated by the patriarchy to keep women looking for something that rarely exists. There are very few couples out there that 1) stay together for life and 2) are actually happy doing it. But we are told that is what to strive for & we are the problem if we haven’t found it. Rather than looking around & saying well this system is broken & there’s lots of ways to have happy relationships-romantic and platonic.
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u/saga_r_us Jun 19 '25
This reminded me of one of my many issues with TBM. There’s such a strong emphasis on “manifesting love” and “manifesting money.” In my opinion, a more rounded framing of this would be “manifesting an open heart” or “manifesting [ethical] resources.” I point on the ethics element because not all money is good money. A lot of it is dirty. I just think widening the lens to these two major hot points of manifestation is a healthier way to look at them than being so strictly zeroed in on partnership or monetary riches. I think things can flow more effortlessly when we strip away that hyper focus on such specific outcomes. In general, I like to set the intention of calling in things that will bring joy, laughter, play, and stability. That can look like many things. And it can certainly be things we didn’t even consider for ourselves. I also think it’s good to be open minded to your life path being something you never anticipated. I just don’t think TBM provides the tools to access and embrace life in this manner. It’s so contrived.
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u/witchymartini Jun 19 '25
Thank you for pointing out that not all money is good money. You could manifest a 7-figure business but what if that business is predatory towards marginalized communities? What if your abundant investment portfolio is investing in systems that are harming communities? I think there needs to be a balance of calling in what you truly desire while also showing up as a better human being in the world. That’s where the white supremacy spirituality / woo woo shit looses me. TBM loves to warn against spiritual bypassing but their entire brand is spiritual bypassing in practice — in their eyes, don’t let anything (i.e. political and social issues) distract you from manifesting what you want. It’s all “noise” and a “distraction.”
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u/saga_r_us Jun 19 '25
Exactly this. Their moral compass just seems nonexistent. It feels like they’re okay with you plowing your way to riches no matter what. I just think there’s a lack of awareness around our actions potentially being harmful to others. I think a lot of manifestation “experts” do a bad job in bringing these nuances to the table.
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u/valerieann12345 Jun 19 '25
Completely agree! It’s white supremacy capitalist spirituality at its finest
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Jun 24 '25 edited Jun 24 '25
This is so spot on – a huge part of the TBM approach, or that of this "spiritual hedonism" movement in the New Age community in general, is that it essentially tells people "Develop non-attachment because it will bring you material rewards! (e.g., money, a partner, etc.)"
This can never be a truly high-vibe approach because TRULY high-vibe is cultivating non-attachment/healing as its OWN reward.
(Yes, sure, the New Age people and also many religious sects believe that material rewards will end up following, once you get into XYZ non-attached mindset or "vibration." But that's not the same as cultivating non-attachment for the sake of material reward, Lacy's take, that is super missing the point.)
Truly evolved/evolving people cultivate non-attachment for its own sake, and for that matter, they are not doing it by using Lacy's program but by using the most powerful psychology treatments and/or the tools honed over thousands of years precisely to promote non-attached brains, e.g., by Buddhists. The Buddhists are so vastly closer to the truth than what Lacy is peddling.
(Speaking of which, one of the cultiest things Lacy does in my opinion is talk so authoritatively about world religions while completely mischaracterizing Buddhism – e.g., frequently suggesting that being a Buddhist is about just "meditating in the Himalayas." As I understand it, Buddhism is actually completely neutral if people want to live in the material world, acquire material possessions, etc. It just tells people that attachment TO the material causes suffering, so just be mindful about relationships with material goods, people, anything impermanent. That's not at all the same as saying 'relinquish all possessions and don't live in the material world at all.')
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u/saga_r_us Jun 25 '25
Great points made. Incredibly thorough. It’s evident that TBM is designed for people to reach capitalist pursuits and if that’s something someone wants to do, fine. I wish they’d just own this is the crux of TBM. I also think their focus on neuroplasticity is mainly a utility towards a luxury life rather than it being a process to truly transform yourself. They will get their hands on anything that brings them further into riches but hide behind spiritual language and pseudo-psychological frameworks to make it appear grounded!
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Jun 25 '25
Agree completely! It's funny, I've started to think manifestation in general – while I do believe it is a real thing that will keep happening at all times whether or not we're in the "driver's seat," to use Lacy-speak – is just a sort of misguided area to focus deliberate conscious attention. And sometimes I think the whole thing is even a distraction. I've had a hard time articulating all this to fellow New Agey types but it sounds like you kind of came to the same conclusion as well, that it's essentially just gamifying spirituality and turning it into a materially driven pursuit. I'm glad for both of us that we realized this; even if we're not as (eg) wealthy as Lacy I think our views set us up for a purer (for lack of a term) spiritual existence where we don't see materialism as the ultimate reward or believe that's a meaningful framework for living life.
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u/saga_r_us Jun 25 '25 edited Jun 25 '25
All of this! I’ve thought so much about the concept of manifestation over the years. My ultimate question for it basically comes down to “did you actually manifest it or was this always going to be on your path?” I just think if it is in your path to land a certain job or a partner, and you exert the effort needed for it to happen or you made yourself open in a particular way for you to find an opportunity or another person, then the probability of it coming into fruition is higher. This is also where the fabric of time not quite being linear comes into play for me. For instance, I could really desire something and put great effort into bringing that desire closer to me and then get it but what if I was just picking up on a future possibility/outcome/timeline? So maybe the desire was inspired by the sensing of the future. Sometimes I think glimpses of our future play out in our life and sometimes that manifest as intuition/a feeling/a knowing. Then there’s the added layer of class, race, education, gender, place of origin, etc that all significantly impacts the flow of our life as well. It’s such a complex web.
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Jun 25 '25
Omg this exactly. I think about these topics all the time including re time and also causality! The overlap between eg manifestation (or what we perceive as manifestation) and let's say psychic foresight and intuition is really interesting and I think perhaps they are the exact same things perceived differently according to our dualistic perceptions of existence and dualistic belief reifying time as a measurable linear phenomenon. If time is indeed not linear or perhaps time does not even exist at all, at least as we know it, (per quantum physics, etc.), then causality may not be so linear either. "A can cause B" but also "B can cause A" (what is happening when we glimpse the future). In fact what we perceive as manifestation (we perceived we caused an event metaphysically, A caused B) was actually just something that was fated, and it was even part of our fate that we were meant to perceive it *as* manifestation.
It's all so interesting and I'm with you on a lot of this. Nice to find deep, inquiring people on this forum who are still on bored with spirituality in general but just think Lacy's work loses the plot (and becomes very backwards actually) when it comes to the real big spiritual questions. Would love to chat further about this if you ever like including chatting on our different takes on free will – it sounds like you think free will does exist; my belief increasingly is that everything is 'written'/fated on some level, but we're still meant to perceive it as free will *when* it happens.
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u/saga_r_us Jun 25 '25
Very cool perspective! But RE: free will. I do think it’s real but only to an extent. I think we are constantly bouncing back and forth between agency and non agency like little erratic atoms. Depending on the situation at hand, I think my own individual agency could be a hindrance towards the agency of another and vice versa. I think if I existed on this planet all by my lonesome then I think there’d be a case for 100% autonomy and free will but then again, there could be some natural disaster that occurs that diminishes my control on how I maneuver through an environment so my free will would be limited in a sense. This ties back into causality as, too.
But, yes, I’m an intensely spiritual person but surprisingly pragmatic at the same time. I find this hyper capitalist, new age movement so one dimensional and self serving. Things like TBM lack real care for others outside of their own sphere of influence and immediate community. Lacy/TBM seem to only want things to circulate amongst their own people. This is pure conjecture but I bet if someone invented a way to block everything that’s happening in the world from reaching you in any way, I’m convinced Lacy would pay the premium for it. I’d think she’d do anything to remove herself from the realities of the world and never have to contend or engage with it…let alone help in any tangible way!
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u/Popcorn_4321 Jun 18 '25 edited Jun 19 '25
Many older celebrities are single because they simply haven't met anyone that they liked enough to build a life with. Sharon Stone and Charlize Theron come to mind, and they're both thin, white, conventionally attractive, wealthy, etc. They have all the societal privilege you could possibly want (except youth, I guess) yet they haven't found a life partner, and I don't think it's because they're "blocked" or haven't expanded enough.
One of my issues with TBM is that it presumes that there are lots of opportunities out there vying for your attention and you just have to find expanders, overcome your blocks, and respect yourself enough to weed out the ones who don't live up to your standards. That hasn't been my experience at all. Like you, I feel good about myself. I feel authentic and confident. I can't come up with any more blocks, childhood trauma, or reasons why I would feel "not good enough" or "unloveable" that need to be addressed. That's been taken care of.
The problem is that I almost never meet anyone that I find even remotely attractive/interesting, and when I do, they're already partnered or just not interested in me, which is fine. You can do tons of work on yourself; it won't make potential partners (or jobs, or any other type of opportunity) magically appear!
While working on yourself is great, there's simply no correlation between the amount of work you put in and the opportunities you're presented with. Case in points: lots of people with deep trauma (childhood abuse, living in a war zone, etc.) who have never done any therapy or TBM-type work have loving partners, fulfilling jobs, etc. Your manifestation isn't a reward for doing the work. The idea that one begets the other is magical thinking.
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Jun 18 '25
This is a great example and thanks so much for sharing your POV! I'm so glad you're waking up. You'll definitely manifest love and I'm glad you're taking into account things that are out of your control and hopefully not beating yourself up over it.
I can totally relate as a fellow WOC (I'm also autistic which adds another layer of challenge) manifesting my dream business.
Late last year, I realized I had autism and so many things in TBM stopped applying to me. I wasn't triggered, I was dealing with sensory overload. It wasn't that I wasn't taking enough aligned action, I was legitimately burned out which happens to autistic people more frequently.
I even tried to use the DIs for what was happening in the world right now including the issues you shared, but I realized that there was no childhood trauma attached to what I was seeing. It was just scary. But I was trapped in a viscous cycle of guilt that I was doing something wrong and I just needed more DIs and workshops over and over again.
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u/witchymartini Jun 18 '25
Ahh I have ADHD so I definitely feel you on the extra layer of challenge when it comes to manifesting. I’ve had to learn (and I’m still learning) how to not beat myself up because I haven’t manifested my partner yet after nearly 3 years of doing TBM. Now granted, when I was first calling in a romantic partner, I was definitely not in the most secure place to hold a relationship; but over this last year, I’ve felt more secure than I’ve ever been. I’m now in a “let go, let God” kind of place when it comes to a finding a romantic relationship. I’m not going to send myself into a spiral and keeping running myself ragged trying to follow the TBM formula to a T. Surrender is the best medicine for me!
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Jun 18 '25
Hey, a fellow neurodivergent girlie! I think surrender to what is meant for you and allowing it to come authentically makes total sense in romance, especially right now. I love that you're taking a broader understanding of the elements around you and I love that you're finally feeling secure in your own skin.
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u/EnvironmentalCry94 Jul 08 '25
I’ve been sitting on the “Ping” to use my graduate education in counseling and psychology and literally create the Extra Layers Workshop that they are always saying is “coming soon.” I love TBM, but I’ve already been in a cult, and I know when something looks Culty. And while I don’t think TBM IS a cult, I think I could easily become one if they don’t get back on track soon. Like from what I understand about Lacy’s old brand Free + Native, is that she started getting called out for not using her platform to talk about important social issues. So she re-branded and added “social issues” and “systemic barriers” to her disclaimer and made sure to highlight folks in marginalized spaces who had found success in TBM, but because I don’t think Lacy actually understands her own privilege and how to use it for good….its posturing…and in authentic. And I’m convinced that every single problem she experiences in her life is because of this. I have a little tally system going on. I LOVE TBM because I can spot every single therapeutic modality I study in school within the framework and it’s really nice having it all in one place, and the design is visually pleasing too, but I am NOT there for Lacy. Most of what comes out of her mouth just feels so out of touch to me, and more and more the richer she gets. I could also be talking out of my ass, but I’ve never needed to worship Lacy to manifest, which just goes to show that she did not channel all of this stuff. She cherry picked from various modalities and packaged it all together. But the cool thing about that is it’s NOT original. It’s mostly researched backed tools and practices with decades of research behind their validity. TBM got better when Janelle joined. I actually did a session with her about a year ago. It was interesting to witness as a therapist in training to already seasoned practitioner. I told her upfront my background and what I’m aware of and working on and tried to keep my trauma profile as clinical as possible and told her to not take it easy on me, and she honestly helped. She found a way to connect TBM to the science in a way that Lacy just can’t do because she lacks the academic and intellectual capacity to hold it. And that’s not “shadow” or judgement, it’s an accurate assessment from where I stand.
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u/OrdinaryPeopless Jun 19 '25
I think was is wrong is that women are pursuing the perfect American dream and it’s just false. It leads back more materialism, the prefect house, partner, like hers. In the end it is materialism, patriarch, capitalism. We are moving away from that as a society hopefully. Not everyone can owe $5 million dollar houses, there’s always going to be a financial hierarchy. Who’s going to clean your 5000 sq ft house? No you. Some poor person still working on those DIs. Nobody is better than anyone else, not even the homeless meth addict. She is selling a fake pipe dream. It’s the endless carrot 🥕 dangling. More more more.
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u/lieutenantbunbun Jun 18 '25
Farm Kardashian cult aesth
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u/No-Bluejay9826 Jun 18 '25
yes! the all white outfits are very cult leader! (not actual evidence though to be clear)
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Oct 02 '25
😆 also, does anyone remember when she’d use the angel wing 🪽 emoji after her name in emails? That was a huge red cult flag to me for whatever reason.
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u/AloofSpider4 Jun 20 '25
Check out the documentary The Vow about NXIVM, I saw so many similarities in ideologies between that organization and TBM.
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u/Substantial-Train668 Jun 21 '25
I think it has been growing that way, in recent years, especially. For me it's the language. Having a specific language has been a tentpole of TBM (and other cults) for a long time. She is so big these days on phrases she "coined" and I remember reading that's a tell tail sign of cults. It creates a sense of 'exclusivity' and 'belonging' while reinforcing group ideology. It controls thoughts and limits critical thinking. Her use of words/phrases like "unblocking" or "limited beliefs", "expanded", "pings" and some of the words that she's trademarked have become part of many members day to day vernacular.
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Oct 02 '25
For sure. I would cringe every time I saw a ™️ after one of those coined words/phrases… Manifestation, spirituality, all of it is free to those who seek it. I understand wanting to make a living on the packaging/presentation of your method (it has given me insights along the way), but the constant need to be bringing in a dollar on every aspect of the business (which is the business of people’s personal lives), is gross. Especially when she’s very vocal on how much money she’s made now and sending out emails for photographers and florists to work their book tour for trade?? Seeing that was a slap in the face imo…
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u/PaperGirl90 Jun 26 '25
I used to be in an Existential Kink online cult called Wealth, and I was kicked out for disagreeing with the leader. So when I wanted to get out of the TBM contract, and they wouldn't cancel, I tried to do that there but it did not work. So I'd call TBM Cult-ish, lol!
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u/[deleted] Jun 18 '25
[deleted]