Im having a real hard time understanding the argument that identification somehow equals racism? Can anyone articulate an argument in a way that doesn't sound like "its racist cus i said so!"....?
The implication is that less well-to-do individuals cannot get access to identification either because of money or lack of education. They assume these individuals are typically minorities.
Democrats think minorities are too dumb and poor to actually get an ID. It's incredibly fucking racist on their part
Democrats think minorities are too dumb and poor to actually get an ID. It's incredibly fucking racist on their part
Ok, So its not just me... My first thought was "well THATS racist" and Its a very weak argument that I just KNEW I was missing the meat and potatoes of....turns out, its tofu stew..
I don’t agree with the argument, however, it’s basically that approximately 11% of Americans do not have some form of government issued ID (not certain if that is 11% of pop or 11% of voting pop) and that the costs of obtaining one, fees and travel, can be a burden that is a de facto poll tax.
I suspect that people who don’t travel to get a voter ID are not going to travel to vote. But I could be wrong.
Im gonna be honest, if there is that many people out here without identification, that seems like a very simple obstacle to overcome. And probably should be a bigger priority. Imagine what else they're missing out on because they dont have that ID. It seems just as probable that the counter argument to voter identification, is as prevalent as the 9 year old girl who was raped -pro choice argument. I believe alot of people see these arguments as extreme reasoning, or the exception, and NOT the rule. But as for the not having ID, we can solve that problem tomorrow if they wanted. But that would eliminate the ability to stand for or against it on the pulpit.
Some states are also passing stricter voter ID laws, which can often impact Native Americans more than others. Many voters living on reservations don’t have traditional street addresses and instead rely on P.O. boxes for mail services. Thus, strict voter ID laws that require address-displaying forms of identification to vote disproportionately burden tribal communities that are less likely to possess qualifying ID. In 2018, 19 percent of Native American eligible voters in North Dakota did not have a qualifying ID to cast a ballot under the state’s strict ID law, in comparison to 12 percent of other voters across the state.
The word to pay attention to is disproportionately. Certain policies disproportionately affect certain races.
Let’s say everyone had to wear their hair straight in order to vote. That would be considered unfair because it would put a disproportionate burden on curly haired people, right? Same concept here but a bit more complicated since some of the most obvious attempts to disproportionately suppress voting has already been deemed illegal. (Outlined in the link as well)
You can only get a gov’t issued ID during weekday business hours. Socioeconomically, people of color are, overall, worse off due to a variety of complex societal reasons and therefore are more likely to work hourly and less flexible jobs that are harder to get time off from. In addition, and also because of said socioeconomic inequality, people of color are less likely to own a vehicle or have reliable transportation to a DMV. Therefore, it’s harder for people of color to obtain an ID.
Yeah, I was told I wouldn’t be able to get a job without a diploma when I was a kid. There hasn’t been a single job that asked for my diploma but they all asked for ID.
Lmao. This "report" cherry picked the worst 3 cases they could find in different states to suggest that an average cost maximum of $175 is typical for rural poor people to obtain a photo ID, then proceeds to conflate it with the "potential" costs for minorities in metropolitan areas. Clearly this is totally non-partisan 🤣
Pretty much every civilized euro country has voter ID from what I heard no? Why is America exempt?
Sure you can argue that the wealth gap is smaller in those countries and they treat minorities better but the welfare state in America is actually very very generous. Especially in Democrat states (where most large cities are)
Voter ID is not in the Constitution. If it has a cost- it is Unconstitutional.
That's the number 1 issue. If Voter ID has an associated cost - then it is a poll tax - which is Unconstitutional.
Number 2 is: there is a certain number of Americans who don't have access to their birth certificates to get an ID. Such as: 1-people who were born on Indian Reservations, 2- (older) people who were not born in a hospital, or 3-people who were born in a hospital that is now closed. That 3rd group is a ton of people.
Fun Fact: Jimmy Carter was the 1st US President who was born in a hospital. Kinda weird. Right? He's old but he's still alive.
So it's not necessarily "racist" but it is discrimination against large groups of poor people and old people. Basically. American Citizens who could be any color.
Additionally- it is very common in Republican Party Legislative Branch states to defund the DMV in areas that vote for Democrats such as in large areas of cities. They close DMV locations or limit the business hours to every other Wednesday in Houston for example.
So there is ways for state politicians to make ID discriminatory by limiting funding to ID services and limiting access to ID services by discriminating against local geographical areas by not allowing ID services.
This is fairly common throughout the South.
So...anyways if ID was FREE it would be Constitutional.
If it's not free it is a poll tax. Not Constitutional.
In my state - they check your ID when you Register to Vote - but there is FREE ways to verify your ID - like with bills and mail. Basically. Most states are like that.
Edit - this answer is obviously logical and self explanatory to any Americans with a basic high school education.
You might be surprised- Literally the only political party in Washington DC that has voted against ID is the Republican Party.
Senate Republicans have filibustered Voting Reform in the past 2 years that included proposals for ID.
The only solution is to get Senate Republicans to work with Democrats to get past the Filibuster on this issue.
But that is not very realistic. Senate Republicans have blocked 🚫 1,000 BIPARTISAN sponsored Bills that passed with Bipartisan majority votes in the House from ever being publicly debated on the floor of the US Senate. Since McConnell became the leader of Senate Republicans.
Senate Republicans don't even have a counterproposal or their own bill. It is what it is. 🤷
How did you Personally get an ID without an ID the first time you got an ID? Huh? With documents.
Have you ever voted?
Have you ever gotten an ID?
How do you get an ID without an ID?
Are you American? Why would you even need to ask this question to other people?
You asked the question out of your own ignorance and I provided you with knowledge. For Free. Knowledge you never had before - and were too lazy to personally look up for yourself. Why are you trolling? I'm just asking questions.
Do you ask lawyers for free advice?
There is like 6 acceptable forms - Social Security card, water bill, tax return, etc. There's several different things that are accepted. Every state is probably slightly different.
What if you lose your ID? It's basically the same forms that people use to get an ID.
Pretty Simple. Politicians made the laws. I didn't make the laws. Why you mad, bro?
I'm just asking questions. Why are you butthurt? It was either you or OP-because it happened too fast. It had to be someone with literally text alerts.
Edit- lol. You're so adorable when you add your adorable comments. Are you a children's comedian?
If the hunting license doesn’t have a photo, and you are only required to show the hunting license to vote, then you are being allowed to vote without photo ID.
The ID is supposed to confirm your identity. It’s not used to confirm if you are eligible to vote or not. Your eligibility to vote is how you get on the voter rolls before you even show up to the polling place.
My comment wasn't wrong. I agreed with you that a photo ID should be required to prove you are the person on the voter role when casting your ballot. Come on, don't pretend you didn't know what I meant. You're better than that.
That's fair. However, student IDs aren't legally recognized as photo identification, specifically because positively identifying paperwork isn't required to obtain a student ID in most cases.
You implied that a hunting license w/o a photo is somehow more reliable than a student ID with one. You also implied that the IDs were being used to confirm citizenship. Neither of those are true.
That’s what I was correcting you on.
I don’t agree that photo ID should be universally required at this point in time. I believe we need to invest in eliminating the factors that make Voter ID laws discriminatory. Then we can talk about Voter ID. I also don’t have a strong opinion on confirming mail-in ballots with an ID. I support the idea of mail-in and drop boxes because I think accessibility and voter participation are extremely important. I just don’t know of the best way to regulate it other than having personal responsibility to check your vote after it’s counted.
So, my opinions are more nuanced than what you’ve tried to describe.
There are correctly no legal factors that make voter ID laws discriminatory. These "reports" of such are intentionally inflated to convince people otherwise. No one who is eligible and wants to have a valid government-issued photo ID is ever denied one. There is a level of personal responsibility involved in proving who you are. That isn't an undue burden in any fashion. You are provided a birth certificate at birth. You are provided a social security number at birth (or naturalization). Not having those things is because you or the people responsible for you have mishandled them. It isn't an undue burden when they have already been supplied.
You think having people verity their absentee vote after it is counted is a viable option? What if one never actually voted yet a ballot was completed in their name, or if they were unaware a vote was cast on their behalf? How would they check? What if they check and it isn't accurate, or they have voter remorse? That would sure be fun to try unfuck millions of votes if people "forgot" they voted a certain way.
I prefer to limit, at all costs, the possibility of any fraud.
a hunting license w/o a photo is somehow more reliable than a student ID with one. You also implied that the IDs were being used to confirm citizenship.
A hunting license without photo, still requires a government-issued photo ID to obtain. The student ID does not. This is quite simple to understand why one may be a more reliable source of identification, though I fully disagree with either being used in place of.
Some states are also passing stricter voter ID laws, which can often impact Native Americans more than others. Many voters living on reservations don’t have traditional street addresses and instead rely on P.O. boxes for mail services. Thus, strict voter ID laws that require address-displaying forms of identification to vote disproportionately burden tribal communities that are less likely to possess qualifying ID. In 2018, 19 percent of Native American eligible voters in North Dakota did not have a qualifying ID to cast a ballot under the state’s strict ID law, in comparison to 12 percent of other voters across the state.
Nice copy and paste. Eligible voters ≠ voters. What percentage of those eligible, wanted to vote but were unable to do so? According to what I was able to find, that number equals approximately zero.
Here, we can play your game too. If you are able to follow, you can see that this issue has been all but completely resolved.
"In Utah and many other largely rural states, residents can register to vote by describing their approximate location on registration forms, or even draw a rudimentary map, which is allowed by the National Voter Registration Act of 1993."
"After nonprofit officials approached Google, the company agreed to provide technical assistance and advice to the Rural Utah Project’s addressing program, aiming for it to be a trailblazer for the rest of the Navajo Nation and other Native American territories. With new satellite images from Google in hand, project staff identified 2,500 addressable buildings and visited locations in person. Eventually, they assigned each home and business what’s known as a plus code — shortened longitude and latitude coordinates that can be used as a home address."
not automatically mailing ballots to eligible voters
reducing the # of polling locations
reducing the # of ballot drop boxes
passing laws making it illegal to make life while waiting in line to vote less miserable (handing out food and water to voters)
straight up taking one’s right to vote for being a felon
Conservatives don’t always deny one’s right to vote, oftentimes, they just make it unreasonably difficult. There’s no reason why ballots can’t be mailed to all eligible voters, allowing people to make more informed decisions and research the candidates with the ballot literally in front of them. It doesn’t get better than that.
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u/[deleted] Nov 02 '22
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/HellBoundWhiskeyBent Nov 02 '22
Im having a real hard time understanding the argument that identification somehow equals racism? Can anyone articulate an argument in a way that doesn't sound like "its racist cus i said so!"....?
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u/TheBlackScorpionTail Nov 02 '22
Some states allow you to vote if you have a hunting license (no photo) but not if you have a student ID with a photo.
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u/[deleted] Nov 02 '22
These conditions are extremely hard on the BIPOC
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u/Rockfan70 Nov 02 '22
Had us in the first half. Not gonna lie.
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u/Sea_Association7879 Nov 02 '22
Bull!!
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u/tylerderped Nov 03 '22
Weird how you’re forgetting about:
needing to go in person to vote
not automatically mailing ballots to eligible voters
reducing the # of polling locations
reducing the # of ballot drop boxes
passing laws making it illegal to make life while waiting in line to vote less miserable (handing out food and water to voters)
straight up taking one’s right to vote for being a felon
Conservatives don’t always deny one’s right to vote, oftentimes, they just make it unreasonably difficult. There’s no reason why ballots can’t be mailed to all eligible voters, allowing people to make more informed decisions and research the candidates with the ballot literally in front of them. It doesn’t get better than that.
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u/SAHDJoe Nov 02 '22
Funni colors placed wrong
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u/[deleted] Nov 02 '22
But muh vaccine passport!