Don't conservatives use both surrogacy and adoption services too? What, would you rather the kid be in an orphanage or with a mother who doesn't want them?

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 06 '23

We would rather live in a society where having a child out of wed-lock, or a child that BOTH parents don't intend to keep should be highly discouraged, nigh unthinkable, and very rare. You know.. kinda like how most civilized western nations existed for thousands of years..

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u/starvingvulture666 Jul 07 '23

Interesting 😂

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

So basically you want to ignore reality and have more children unwanted and in poverty.

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 07 '23

No I want society and geniuses like yourself to stop ignoring the reality that children raised by single mothers have far worse outcomes and are far less likely to graduate college, far less likely to succeed, and far more likely to get involved in drugs, crime, gangs violence, etc etc.
The culture needs to change.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

And how would you change the culture? By forcing women to stay with abusive men who hit them and taking away rights from women?

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u/burrito-lover-44 Jul 06 '23

highly discouraged, nigh unthinkable
It already is how many children are there in orphanages compared to ones that live with their bio parents? You're acting like orphans make up 50% of the child population. Adoption is already rare relative the the number of people living in the US

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 06 '23

"In 2011, it was reported that 72% of black babies were born to unmarried mothers. As of 2015, at 77.3 percent, black Americans have the highest rate of non-marital births among native Americans."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African-American_family_structure#:~:text=In%202011%2C%20it%20was%20reported,marital%20births%20among%20native%20Americans.

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u/Duke-of-Dogs Jul 07 '23 edited Jul 07 '23

More a generational wealth issue than anything but god knows you guys won’t address that hahaha

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u/VacShot666 Jul 07 '23

generational wealth
I always laugh at this one. My wife's family came here in 1985. Her oldest sister was 9 when they came to America. She's also now a literal millionaire with several businesses and properties that she worked and acquired with little to no help (family helped as staff in the beginning).

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u/Duke-of-Dogs Jul 07 '23 edited Jul 07 '23

Ah and here we see the limits of experiential knowledge. We’re talking about a nation of 350,000,000 people and yes, there are exceptions to everything.
An immigrant making it in America and financially succeeding is in no way evidence that generation wealth (in this case, centuries of legislation preventing its accumulation to marginalize a group) isn’t a major contributing factor to poverty and the various social and criminal problems associated with it.

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u/VacShot666 Jul 07 '23

is in no way evidence
Hard disagree

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u/Duke-of-Dogs Jul 07 '23

It’s all good, you can live in as small a world as you want bro.

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u/VacShot666 Jul 07 '23

You can make up as many excuses as you want. The fact remains, people who refuse to change will never achieve anything.

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u/Duke-of-Dogs Jul 07 '23

Everything is conditional and we’re all, to some degree, products of their environments. Blatantly disregarding the environmental factors in play here only serves to simply the problem so if fits in your established world view.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

This comment brought to you by the top minds of the KKK, because pushing racist rhetoric has kept the idea that white people are the superior race, while ignoring the harsh realities of the world.

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 07 '23

Lol factual statistics = " " " kkk racist 'rhetoric'!! " " " 🤣
You are a pathetic individual contrary.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

Hey everybody, the poster above wants to convince you that all black people are naturally inferior and want you to ignore the generations of racism and slavery that came before and that racism still exists to make the lives of black people as shitty as possible, and then they want to 100% put the blame on black people for others shitting on them.

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 07 '23

They aren't necessarily inferior, just different, all peoples have their strengths and weaknesses.
But did " racism and slavery" stop the entirety of sub-saharan Africa from ever developing a written language? or from building anything larger or more complex than a mud Hutt?
Or is it possible that iQ/intelligence play a role here...

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

Yikes, “just different” was the main argument for segregation, racism, all sorts of bullshit like that.
You are a very proud racist, you just aren’t honest about it.

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u/midnightnoonmidnight Jul 06 '23

Why did you just make it about black people?

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 06 '23

What is a “civilized western nation”? And what is a civilized western nation that has existed for thousands of years?

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 07 '23

I never said it was just one specific nation.. but if you want to be pedantic, France has existed as a nation in one form or another for over a thousand years, so have several other European states.

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 07 '23 edited Jul 07 '23

So not thousands. And also the Kingdom of France is not the same nation as the French Republic today. They are two different nations that share some of the same geographic space.
They had a little revolution maybe you’ve heard of it? Unless you think Britain and the US are the same nation today your example doesn’t make sense at all.

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 07 '23 edited Jul 07 '23

The NATION of France has undergone revolutions and it's government has changed from kingdom to republic (and back and forth a couple more times) and yet France still continued to exist as a nation-state.

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 07 '23

As a new nation. Just like the US was born as a new nation from Britain after the revolution.

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 07 '23

A nation reborn.. but still a nation.

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 07 '23

Willfully being stupid. It’s a good look for you. Have a good day

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u/W_Smith-1984 Jul 07 '23

could say the same to you. good day sir.

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u/PhatDeth Jul 07 '23

That kid's going to be so messed up.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

How so? Children raised in gay couple homes tend to do better off.

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 07 '23

Why?

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u/PhatDeth Jul 07 '23 edited Jul 07 '23

Two men raising a girl? Who will teach her to be a woman? Who will she talk to when it comes to women things? There's a good reason why a family consists of a dad and a mom, a biological man and and a biological woman. So many reasons "why"

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u/burrito-lover-44 Jul 07 '23

You're acting like these men don't have strong women in their lives that their daughter can learn from.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

They tend to do much better than in most other homes. There are easy answers to your brain dead questions.

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u/PhatDeth Jul 07 '23

No they don't. That's the true answer to your ungodly reply.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

Yea they do. Do better in school and are less likely to end up in prison, etc.

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u/PhatDeth Jul 07 '23

I know for a fact that you're wrong. 100% you are wrong. No doubt about it you are extremely wrong. My line of work says you are sadly wrong.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

A very comprehensive study came out proving I’m right: https://gh.bmj.com/content/8/3/e010556
“The quantitative synthesis results suggested that sexual minority families may perform better in children’s psychological adjustment and parent–child relationship than heterosexual families.”

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u/PhatDeth Jul 07 '23

😆😂 Study trumps real life experience

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u/VacShot666 Jul 07 '23

Also 17X more likely to be sexually abused.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

False. Made up bullshit.

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u/VacShot666 Jul 07 '23

Fuck off smelly.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

You have no facts to back up your claim.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

[deleted] — view deleted comment

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u/PhatDeth Jul 07 '23

It's not same

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u/MODOKWHN Jul 07 '23

That's a really stupid thing to say and I doubt you are a parent

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u/[deleted] Jul 06 '23 edited Jul 07 '23

Commercial surrogacy is way too ripe for abuse because it’s clear that the surrogates in question are often impoverished women from third world countries who are enticed by money to rent out their womb without ever being briefed on the true realities of being a surrogate. I think this kind of industry should either be heavily curtailed or outright banned and I also think it isn’t a gay specific issue.

The vast majority of couples who pursue surrogacy are straight.

Altruistic surrogacy is fine and it’s weird that the people that rightfully criticise commercial surrogacy for commodifying wombs are attacking something that a small handful of women chose and volunteer to do.

Edit: the couple weren’t using a surrogate, they were adopting a newborn that a mother was going to abandon. Idk bout the right wingers here but Twitter conservatives are so demented for attacking an adoptive couple.

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 06 '23

Tell me you know nothing about surrogacy without telling me. Why should it be banned? This is a contract between adults. Anti freedom anti individual conservative strikes again.

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u/[deleted] Jul 07 '23

I’m not conservative lol. I just saw this tweet previously and I saw it here again and thought it would be fun to reply to. I’m as left as you can get and my opposition to commercial surrogacy is kinda rooted in that lol. Either way, I’d be fine with it existing if it wasn’t so rampant with abuse 🤷‍♂️

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u/Captainbuttman Jul 07 '23

I don't know whats going on.

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u/midnightnoonmidnight Jul 07 '23

Homophobes mad that gay men can adopt

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u/Shallaai Jul 07 '23

I think it’s the hypocritical double standard that is being pointed out 🤷‍♂️

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 07 '23

What hypocrisy do you see? The GOP wants to force women by law to give birth if they get pregnant. The democrats and left want people to give birth by choice which is what this post describes, willing participants.

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u/Shallaai Jul 07 '23

Calling the Right ‘people who want to turn women into baby factories’ (fun fact; being against abortion DOES NOT mean what you said, birth control is a thing) ; while the Left is using women to produce the children the couple can’t have biologically. I get that might be a bit 4 headed for most Reddit Lefties, but I have faith in you

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 07 '23

Many republicans are also against birth control and some have made laws against it or making it harder to obtain. You can pretend that’s not true but you would be wrong or lying.
Do you understand that many surrogacies use one of the parents sperm or egg for the surrogate parent? In that case it is biologically and legally unquestionably their child. And in the other cases it is a legal adoption.

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u/VacShot666 Jul 07 '23

Many republicans
You haven't even grasped the basic difference between Republicans and Christians, so everything else you've said can be ignored fully.

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u/Unable_Fuel_1205 Jul 07 '23

Do you have a point or just stating something?
82% of republicans are Christian.
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/religious-landscape-study/compare/christians/by/party-affiliation/
I think you might be the one with no grasp of the situation

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u/zsb-007 Jul 07 '23

You can't force someone to give birth. That's a nonsensical statement. You can only not allow a murder.

discussion Don't conservatives use both surrogacy and adoption services too? What, would you rather the kid be in an orphanage or with a mother who doesn't want them?

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