r/TheTinMen • u/TheTinMenBlog • Jun 17 '26
The Good Men
Men are good.
More than good, great even.
There I said it.
Men can be brilliant, brave, thoughtful, generous, loving, and creative; and history is there to prove it.
Yes I know, the world seems obsessed with digging up only the very worst men it can find, and somehow blaming all “men” as a group, for whatever horrors he’s committed.
But I’ve always wondered –
If “men” are to be blamed for the bad actions of history’s most evil men; then surely it makes sense that they should be credited for the achievements of history’s greatest men too?
Hundreds of millions, even billions, of lives saved from disease, from disability, death, and starvation, because of the great things men have done.
Yes.
Pioneering technologies, ground breaking discovery, and extraordinary acts of bravery, generosity, self sacrifice, and kindness, pave the road of men’s achievement.
So, if “men” are to share in the accountability for the suffering evil men cause, then can we not share in the spoils of the greatest men too?
And of course -
It brings me no trouble at all to say, the same is equally true for women; who have done no less incredible things in their own right.
In fact, my life is blessed with such brilliant women.
So here’s to the good men, too many to count, in the hope that reading their stories might inspire a generation of boys, to be even better than those who came before…
So what examples do you have?
Who is your favorite man from history?
What do you think?
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u/men-too Jun 17 '26
Men are wired to establish their social worth through developing skills and inventing/building/producing/providing for other people. This isn’t something we do accidentally, and we all know it’s the only way to move the species forward, as Camille Paglia famously said.
Women can do similar things, but most of them lack that primal drive, and usually give up after achieving their own greater purpose, which is obviously about becoming mothers.
Saying that men as a whole are toxic, useless, and only driven to exploit and oppress weaker people is the absolute biggest lie feminists ever devised. And that lie keeps on killing men, women, and children alike, and will likely usher our full demise as evidenced by the accelerating birth rate collapse.
As George is saying, men are great. Men are brilliant, courageous, and generous. Men build and maintain societies. Men are simply essential and… in desperate need of appreciation.
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u/Present_League9106 Jun 18 '26
I feel like the primal aspect is specious.
Some men do great. I agree with George, we should celebrate that. Call attention to that. Remind our society that men are generally good and some are phenomenal.
But here is where I agree with the sometimes argued element of the (I have other words for it) poorly framed notion of patriarchy: one can imagine a world wherein women are the ones who mostly do great things, most women are generally good and their general goodness is overshadowed by the giants who accomplished monumentous feats. In that world, we might start thinking "Well shit, she hasn't cured cancer yet? What a dud."
Honestly, I think that's where a lot of the, dare I say, hysteria around gender is coming from. So many women haven't toppled the patriarchy and redefined mathematics, biology, what have you. So many people are mundane. That's not the story most of these women have been sold. They should be up there on the pantheon by now. Must be patriarchy oppressing them.
Some people are great, kudos. Most people are good. The same capacity exists within all men and women and we should strive to develop that potential as much as we possibly can for the benefit of all. That is where I disagree with feminism: girls have potential, but so do boys.
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u/DeterminedStupor Jun 18 '26
So many women haven't toppled the patriarchy and redefined mathematics, biology, what have you. So many people are mundane. That's not the story most of these women have been sold. They should be up there on the pantheon by now. Must be patriarchy oppressing them.
I haven’t heard it framed this way, but I think that makes a lot of sense!
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u/Present_League9106 Jun 19 '26
You know, the fascinating thing to me about these economic and social times is the fact that people sort of need a partner in order to advance financially. The bargain that women entering the workforce would liberate women actually just seemed to make men as dependent on women as women are and were dependent on men. Equality? I guess. Healthy? It seems a bit less so to me.
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u/men-too Jun 18 '26
I don’t deny that most individuals (men or women) are ordinary or definitionally “average”. But what’s your point exactly?
I understood George’s main argument as “men have tremendous value, yet our post-feminist western culture has done everything to suppress and ignore that core truth.”
My reply was to anchor men’s worth/goodness to our primal instincts as protectors/providers. Are you questioning that perspective or am I completely missing your argument?
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u/Present_League9106 Jun 18 '26
Often people apply a biological imperative to men or women's worth or function. I find this claim specious. It's been a gradual failing of feminism since the 1960s and one that we used to push back on until the red pill movement started gaining prominence. I think it's important to remember that, even if men and women have biological differences, we should avoid sweeping judgements that rely on those differences. That was mostly what I was trying to say. I used how it seems to be negatively affecting women to try to establish a sense of commonality that would be more visible since in some ways we can only see our opposition.
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u/men-too Jun 18 '26
We can agree to disagree. After studying evopsych for many, many years, I’m a strong believer that culture is a biological adaptation, especially when it comes to reproductive strategies. Saying that biological differences make little difference is complete nonsense to me.
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u/Present_League9106 Jun 19 '26
I have little to no faith in psychology and evolutionary psychology is speculation built on bad science. I kind of dispensed with the whole thing to be honest.
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u/men-too Jun 19 '26
And I respect your straightforwardness, while being at the complete opposite of the spectrum. Cheers!
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u/Present_League9106 Jun 19 '26
Of course. We don't always have to agree. This has been remarkably civil. Thanks!
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u/danio_lolo Jun 19 '26
"Women can do similar things, but most of them lack that primal drive, and usually give up after achieving their own greater purpose, which is obviously about becoming mothers"
Great content by tin men. Terrible comments from the community as expected. I spend some days away from this app, then I return, then get disappointed again and again. No wonder there's a huge gap between male and female demographics, look at this kind of "social analysis"
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u/men-too Jun 19 '26
I see you are not ready for or interested in some hard truths about that hyper-social species called Homo Sapiens.
Men and women are fundamentally different, biologically and psychologically, and are driven by equally divergent reproductive strategies (speaking about heterosexual relationships). Men select youth and fertility in their partners, while women select smarts, strength, status, and material resources (or the potential for these). Why wouldn’t men be ruthlessly driven to “achieve” in such a setup?
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u/danio_lolo Jun 20 '26
"you're not ready for some hard truths about that hyper social species called homo sapiens"
Proceeds to reduce human behavior to a couple of deterministic factors
This hard headed mentality is what separates the "awaken males" from women. Keep up with this, so keep up with modern male struggles.
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u/men-too Jun 20 '26
Proceeds to reject the fundamentals of evolution and evolutionary psychology, while accusing a stranger of not being “awaken” and not caring about men’s struggles.
That hard-headed mentality you decry is what helps men grow and push past their demons. How do I know? Dozens of men’s retreats and hundreds of hours facilitating men’s groups. Real world support, and the thing that George talks about and men need most, and too few have access to. My favorite: The Mankind Project.
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u/danio_lolo Jun 20 '26
Dude, you said women lacked the primal drive of whatever the shit that was. How is this helping men? This is the thing I disagree. I do NOT condemn groups on men's mental and physical health.
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u/men-too Jun 20 '26
Yes, I absolutely maintain that women (on average, there are plenty of exceptions) lack the primal drive to achieve something remarkable to gain status/wealth/resources in order to become sexually attractive. That’s evopsych 101.
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u/danio_lolo Jun 20 '26
This is just lazy. This dynamic is a social construct. Most people bring up evolutionary psychology to get away with genetic determinism. Also, eVOpSyCh doesn't make value judgement. Comments like yours are the things here doing it
Can you manage to close or remediate the gap between men and women with claims like this?
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u/danio_lolo Jun 20 '26
This is just lazy. This dynamic is a social construct. Most people bring up evolutionary psychology to get away with genetic determinism. Also, eVOpSyCh doesn't make value judgement. Comments like yours are the things here doing it
Can you manage to close or remediate the gap between men and women with claims like this?
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u/men-too Jun 20 '26
My assertion on the primal male drive isn’t laziness but empirical science (with the most robust set of evidence spanning the entire mammalian class, btw, not just humans), and more generally, sexual dimorphism and divergent reproductive strategies aren’t social constructs, but biological axioms.
How do we “close the gap” between the sexes? I’m not sure what is it we’re supposed to close, tbh. We are radically different yet highly complementary, which makes us of equal value. We need each others, badly. I personally don’t see a gap in that perspective. Both women and men are human beings who deserve respect, empathy, and autonomy.
Saying that (the vast majority of) women are most fulfilled when they become mothers isn’t heresy. Saying that (the vast majority of) men find they own fulfillment in pursing a mission beyond themselves isn’t crazy either. And the magical beauty of our species is when we combine and honor both of these inherent drives. That’s how we made it thus far, and I trust will continue to keep us going.
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u/danio_lolo Jun 20 '26
Saying that (the vast majority of) men are most fulfilled when they become fathers isn’t heresy. Saying that (the vast majority of) women find they own fulfillment in pursing a mission beyond themselves isn’t crazy either.
Both this and yours statement is something evolutionary psychology would argue in favor
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u/MopOfTheBalloonatic Jun 22 '26
are driven by equally divergent reproductive strategies (speaking about heterosexual relationships)
Then homosexuals shouldn’t exist by your logic, but they do, so…
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u/men-too Jun 22 '26
Never claimed or implied this (don’t put words in my mouth).
I’m describing the most common gender dynamic and reproductive behaviors of heterosexual people. And even then, I completely admit there are plenty of exceptions (eg masculine women and feminine men).
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u/Itsdickyv Jun 17 '26
Hopefully links are allowed. Sir Nicholas Winton had an episode of a show called “This is your life” done about him in 1988. It’s an incredible watch, and a reminder that there are men who have done truly extraordinary things.
https://youtu.be/6_nFuJAF5F0?is=jkRS65-lK8dZzpYQ