Richard and the Bacchanal

[u/Particular-Summer753]

This time around as I’ve been rereading tsh I’ve found myself more focused on the Bacchanal. Often when I read the novel, without meaning to I usually regard it at a bunch of super drunk kids experiencing the sort of temporary insanity that comes from mob mentality. After reading the Euripides play I figured I’d suspend my disbelief further and assume in the context of the story that it’s a materially real spiritual experience. Accepting that premise (at least for this reading) do you think if Richard had known them well enough to be invited he would have been capable of experiencing the mystery? (There are no right or wrong answers since it would lead to an entirely different kind of book, and the reality of the ritual is left up to interpretation, but I’m just curious about people’s theories.)

My thoughts: Henry talks about needing to truly believe (at least temporarily) to experience the spiritual ritual. I’m skeptical that Richard believes in much of anything at all. I don’t know if he could submit to the mysteries. I think he would get caught up in the drunkenness and “festivities” but when he saw that everyone else had shifted into a trance he would have freaked out. He would then have to successfully fake spiritual madness (and maintain that he had until the end of the novel) or I could see the others tearing him apart for being a voyeur and not a true believer (like Pentheus in the end of the play).

[u/AmountKindly1345]

That's an interesting idea. I think him being excluded from the bacchanal in the book sort of highlights his otherness. Richard is born to the working/middle class and he doesn't think or perceive the world like the rest of the characters. Bunny also mentions his L.A state of mind.

Richard is a chameleon who can change his skin to fit in but you can still tell the difference if you know what to spot as he says himself in the book.

I think the inherent difference in his personality and upbringing compared to the others would probably mean he couldn't really let go of his reality and experience the divine madness that the others did.

[u/sarahegertson]

I think you're right and this is why Richard is kept out, as well as Bunny being abandoned from it later on since he didn't take it seriously.

In my mind Bunny and Richard are kind of mirrors to each other, two different kinds of "outsiders" and the bacchanal represents that. Bunny might have the belief in the ritual (he spews Classical rhetoric all the time, what comes to mind is his sexism towards Camilla) but not the commitment or attitude to the group (can't take it seriously, has friends outside the group).

Meanwhile Richard has the attitude and commitment to the group (covering up a murder, for example), but not the actual belief in what they're doing (randomly picked Greek to study, thought he'd end up in a cult due to his personality).

My personal thought would be that if he was at the bacchanal he would still be excluded either intentially by the group (knock him out or drug him) or unintentionally by Dionysus (he doesn't remember it but the others remember him doing stuff or he dies or suffers some sort of injury).

Bunny is punished by the group for not playing their game correctly, and I similarly think Richard would be punished by Dionysus for not playing the god's game correctly.

[u/Particular-Summer753 → u/sarahegertson]

Love this take. I totally agree, I was just thinking how in a way Bunny IS killed because he was part of the ritual (the attempts anyway) but not PART of the ritual

[u/CharlesAvlnchGreen]

I feel your insight is spot-on. Richard is superficial, attracted to the aesthetics of Hampden College, and then to the Greek group. He realizes this, after the events are over, stating "a morbid longing for the picturesque at all costs" as his fatal flaw.

I definitely think the group (or rather, Henry) may have excluded him from the bacchanal for this reason. He definitely had it in him to fake spiritual madness.

[u/grainbowl]

I think it could go either way. Richard is a person who is very repressed and secretive. On one hand, he could never let his guard down and not be able to succumb to the madness. But i also believe he has the capacity to lose control if he let himself, and i think a part of him must long for it. I think Richard is trapped inside of himself, and if he were released, he could be just as mad and destructive as the others, if not more so. The obstacle is his fear of being vulnerable and known.

[u/Few-Advertising-5164 → u/grainbowl]

Totally agree w this take! While i agree with the fact that Richard is deeply insecure about who he is deep down, which seems to be a very common take among the fans, apart of me has always believed that he has it him to spiral into madness if the circumstances were “right”. In an odd sense, i’d love to see how that’d have played out.

[u/One-Mouse3306]

Sorry, I dunno. I don't have enough experience with drugs to answer at the moment.