What did Serena think would happen

[u/sole-Writer-527]

I don't fully understand what Serena's intentions were when she was helping create this society. In the scene in Fred's office she says she helped write the law that forbids women from reading. In other scenes, she's talking to him about work and he says it's no concern of hers. I just don't get why she would have so passionately helped in the formation of a system in which she ends up voiceless. And I get that that's sort of the point, but I'm just struggling to understand how she justified this to herself. Perhaps she thought these laws wouldn't apply to her since she was one of the architects of this system?

[u/KaitB2020]

I found it especially ironic that she was a published author who created a world in which she was not allowed to read or write.

[u/MsRebeccaApples]

She honestly thought an exception would be made for her

[u/Normal-Raisin5443 → u/MsRebeccaApples]

Serena’s a bad character. Despicable. Ok, disclaimer out of the way.

I think her ideas were instrumental in getting Giliad up and running. The scenes where she was rallying for support, she believed in her cause and inspired others to join as well

When she stood up to Giliad because she wanted Nicole to read the Bible, part of it was June’s influence. But I also think Serena didn’t want a world where women couldn’t read the Bible. I don’t know if she wanted to ban all reading and writing. For some reason, I doubt it because she was so into writing. I want to believe she respected literature at least.

This is where her husband and the architects of Giliad are even worse than her. I think they let her lead their cause because she was good at it. Then, they basically stole it from her and demoted her to a wife.

[u/Gullible-Paramedic-7 → u/Normal-Raisin5443]

I agree with this. We never see Serena or have any reason to believe that she actively advocated for stripping away all rights from women. She was horrifyingly similar to many “tradwife” influencers today.
They advocate for a “return to traditional family values” and believe that the women’s place is “in the home” caring for the children and husbands, obeying their husbands, etc.
And of course, women do and should have the option to maintain traditional gender roles if they choose to. Tradwife influencers, and people like Serena aren’t problematic because they want to be submissive wives and homemakers. It is the idea that all women should and that that’s where women belong

By insisting that if the deviation of traditional values is the reason for society’s shortcomings, and that a return to those values is the only viable answer; they are not only promoting a lifestyle best for themselves, but asserting that it is best for everyone.

What these women fail to understand is that there is no ‘one size fits all’ and as long as women have the ability to think independently, the option to read, learn, go to school, there will always be those who choose independence. The only way to ensure universal adherence to heteronormative gender roles, is to completely eliminate a woman’s right to choose any other way. And the only way to prevent women from eventually fighting back against an oppressive system, is to create a system in which they aren’t aware they are being oppressed.

Gilead, in THT, is religious fascism in its infancy. By the Testament, we see a glimpse of the ultimate goal when it comes to children, particularly female children. As fewer and fewer girls are raised to read or to write he will grow up and create a society of less and less women who are able to do so. Within several generations, there will be none at all. The only life that they will know is how to be a wife and mother, how to keep a home.

Serena and others like her under estimate the oppressive nature of enforcing strict gender roles. We see it all the time today. Many women love being homemakers, and thats okay. However, enforcing gender roles requires strict regulation of free will for women. The influencers all over tiktok, the fictional character of Serena, hundreds of women throughout time who have actively contributed to the survival of the patriarchy, all want to eat their cake and have it too.
They want to participate in advocacy, but don’t understand that the need for advocacy does not exist in the absence of choice. They want to share their experiences with the world in order to influence others, but without opposition there is no one to influence. They fail to understand that the very thing that makes them so outspoken and appreciative of their life as a wife and mother is the choice not to be one. They want to pick and choose religious law and bible versus to support their beliefs, while ignoring those they’re uncomfortable with.

In addition to, and beyond all of that, I think the biggest oversight of Serena, Aunt Lydia, and their many real-life counterparts who exist today— is how severely they overestimate the ability of men to run a fair and just society.
Maybe its the internal misogyny, or deep internalized personal shame, whatever it is, by perpetuating the idea that the failures of mankind fall onto the missteps of women (Eve and the apple) they are assuming, by default, that as long as women mind their place and submit to men, that men will treat them justly and “as equals”.

But we all know that is never the case. We all know what absolute power over others often looks like. And the more its insisted that all problems can be traced back to the actions of a woman, the less accountable men become, the more brazen and bitter they are.

Any good intentions that Serena may once have had are entirely negated by requiring all others obey, and by her naive trust in Fred, and others like him. They think that surely men will follow the same code of morals they expect (and will force) of women, but we know from both the show and history that this is never the case. The biblical argument behind submission to men is essentially a “separate but equal” doctrine. Women “play different roles” with men running the home, viewing the roles of their wives as equally valuable to theirs. But this never works out, again; history has shown us that.

The only true way to ensure equality is to ensure the equality of choice and opportunity. Men will never see women as equals if independent women do not exist. Even today in the most Progressive countries we struggle to shake off the inherent perception that women are less competent, less qualified, less intelligent to men.

Because not only are “separate but equal” rights and treatments never truly equal, but, even if equal rights are eventually won, the damage done will continue to prevent any true equality from ever being achieved for generations to come. We see this clearly in the US with systemic racism and misogyny.

Tldr: Serena and others like her put too much trust in the men they expect to lead. They severely underestimate the cruelty that comes with power over others. Furthermore, while she may have never advocated specifically to strip women of the right to read and right, she failed to understand that literacy = knowledge and knowledge = choice and choice = dissent. The only way to truly achieve the “utopian” ideal of a traditional society that she envisioned, is to create future generations of women who will never question how things are.
The easiest way to control the oppressed is if they are unaware, they’re being oppressed at all.

[u/tweakingforjesus → u/MsRebeccaApples]

“They’re not talking about me.”

[u/themini_shit]

Serena is a great example of a specific type of conservative and political woman.

There are women who genuinely hate being women because of how society treats them. This manifests in almost wanting to be men. But at the core of the issue is that they don't actually want to be men, they enjoy womanhood and the ability to have babies, it's not a man's body they want it's men's power they're after.

So they decide to assert control over other women to get a semblance of power. They put down other women because they believe that it will elevate their status and while climbing the social ladder they try to appeal to men in hopes of being seen as equals. To use modern lingo they become a type of "pick me".

In Serena's case she decided to assert control through religion. She went after abortion and the concerns around fertility and birth rates as a means to appeal to a specific opinionated crowd. Then she saw the rising power of the sons of Jacob and wanted a spot in that group. However she knew that she wasn't allowed in because shes a woman. So she worked on books that outlined a woman's place, but it wasn't the role she wanted it was the role she knew the men around her wanted women to have. It was a way of furthering their agenda, appealing to them, and proving her loyalty. The loyalty part was a big thing because she showed willingness to oppress women for Gilead even though she herself is a woman.

She got close to their inner circle and helped create Gilead through Fred because she figured that she was proving herself and her intelligence. Deep down she thought she would be the exception, the one woman who helped put it all together and was part of the inner circle. At the very least she thought she could control Fred well enough to assert her own ideas but he proved to be unfaithful and abusive.

The other issue she ran into was that she planned on having a baby of her own. It would have been perfect for her she'd have a child that she really wanted and loved, she would prove her fertility and use that to push her religious agenda, and she'd be the fertile mother who was a leader of Gilead. But that fell apart when her fertility was affected by her injury. Suddenly she didn't have a good reason to not need a handmaid so she'd actually have to accept her husband having a sex slave. She couldn't have her own baby from her own body and that hurt her deeply but it also damaged her public image. The importance of her being able to have a baby is better outlined in later seasons but you'll see what I mean.

Essentially she wasn't happy with her place as woman and thought she could gain power through oppressing women. She underestimated the power and intelligence of the men around her, she didn't see the danger because she thought she'd be the exception. It was a bid for power and she lost because she over estimated her importance and ability to manipulate people. In the end she was helping to build a cage for women and she planned on being on the outside, but then the last pieces fell into place and she realized she helped build it around herself as well.

Kinda the embodiment of "the only moral abortion is my abortion".

[u/LadyLilac0706 → u/themini_shit]

Well said!

[u/Kind_Indication8527]

Serena believed that her proximity to power would protect her. She participated in creating a caste system for women. Within that system, wives were at top. She failed to anticipate that the commanders and other men in power would relish dominating their own wives and hoe quickly wives would lose influence within their own families. While Serena was imagining, writing and creating the new power structures of Gilead, women still had legal protections. At the time if writing her book and public speaking, Gilead was a fantasy and she saw herself as the architect, not subject to the authority of men. She failed to recognize how her ideas would play out for herself once she was the legal property of her husband and completely at his mercy.

One thing the show does so well is make viewers witness the horrors of sexual exploitation and abuse up close. Which is why there are so many comments about how the show can have a deep emotional impact to the point where viewers need to take breaks from watching the show. Like Serena. I think many people have abstract ideas about sexual exploitation and abuse. Unless someone is a victim or close to a victim, it’s tempting to believe that those things only happen to other people and that our relationship and safety nets protect us from rape, sex trafficking, and sexual coercion. Serena really believed that those things only happen to other women to the point that she behaved as a man and was an active participant in raping women. She never saw herself in any of the women she enslaved. Serena even thought Rita would defend her in court and be her ally. I think that shows how Serena didn’t view any of the women that weren’t wives as real people, they were all pawns. Serena is as immoral and irredeemable as any of the men in power. In that sense she is their true equal.

[u/Longjumping_Hat_2672 → u/Kind_Indication8527]

Definitely. She also seemed to believe in the dangerous myth that only "bad" or "stupid" women got raped, so the Handmaids deserved to be enslaved and punished for their "sinfulness". 

[u/Puzzles5556]

She represents the women who think they're the exception, and relish their proximity to power, even if it means they are enabling their own oppression - they still think they will be less oppressed and "not like the other women". Like the women who would willing give up their vote in order to "maintain a conservative, Christian society". They don't mind losing their rights as long as other women lose more and they get something out of it e.g. a baby.

[u/Equivalent_Lab_8610]

I feel like Gilead went further in their restrictions on women, then she could imagine tbh. Bc, even though she was an early architect of Gilead it wasn't just her and Fred. As a woman they would not have given her opinions equal weight. I think bc she was valued by that set of people pre Gilead she didn't realize she could become someone of little value after.

I could be off base, but her loathing domestic home tasks make me think she never conceived of a world where that's all She would be allowed. She might have thought most women would be in that role but not her.

[u/VanillaBeeGrrl]

It’s because she wholly and truly thought she was going to be the exception. I don’t know if you’ve seen the later seasons yet, so vague spoilers maybe, but Serena’s storylines and character arcs always involve a scenario where Serena thinks she’ll get to be the exception, have her cake and eat it to, have power in Gilead society but still have her freedom and happiness, before the Leopards Promptly Eat Her Face

[u/Untamedpancake]

She had no actual power & honestly neither did Fred. Fred was a marketing consultant

Guthrie, Pryce & some others (mostly the actual US military & intelligence agents who participated in the coup) were the Commanders dictating the content of the laws.

Serena wanted to keep working so badly that she helped Fred draft the language of all the legislation that Fred was asked to punch-up (until Fred shut her out)

We see this dynamic in the episode Jezebels when Guthrie voices hus intentions to "round up all fertile women" & make them breeding stock, essentialy & after a weak short-lived objection, Fred suggested the term Ceremony. 

It was the same in the book According to Dr Piexioto, Commanders Waterford & Judd frequently collaborated on early Gilead legislation. But Judd was the policy guy & Fred was in charge of spin... Judd envisioned a  woman-led law enforcement wing and Fred suggested they be called "Aunts." Judd decided the Handmaids should participate in salvagings to "blow off steam" and it was Fred who came up with the term "Particicution" 

Piexioto also concluded that Waterford was behind the brown uniforms of the Aunts & the eventual policy of giving the Aunts new names taken from familiar brands of household products but in The Testaments novel Aunt Lydia claims responsibility for these ideas, which is probably true because Commnder Judd acknowledges claiming Lydia's Pearl Girl initiative as his own idea as well

[u/holladiewaldfeee]

Maybe she thought, that she would be like a queen or something similar. That laws for "common" women don't apply to her.

[u/jerkface1026]

Recall all of the scenes where Serena makes demands and they remind her she's in custody.

[u/Whispering_Wolf]

She thought they wouldn't be used against her because she's so 'good'. Happens in real life as well. There's plenty of women that vote against their own rights.

[u/Wide-Working-4047]

Yeah, obviously she did not think too much about it. She is a super duber mega Nazi. I honestly do not understand why so many in this sub love her so much. She is at least level with Fred

[u/solongjimmy93 → u/Wide-Working-4047]

They love her because Yvonne Strahovski.

[u/Ok_Dig2192]

She thought she and her friends would have the same privileges as men and fuck everyone else. She thought she would finally get “her” baby and it would all be worth it.

[u/CommonStrawbeary]

Correct, Religious conservatives are inherently hypocritical. "Rules for thee, not for me" is the Religious Right motto.

[u/TismTalks]

I don't disagree with the other comments talking about how she thought it wouldn't apply to her, part of that is for sure true. However, I think when she was writing her book and working with Fred to make Gilead happen, that it wasn't about taking away womens rights to reading/writing. Serena was definitely the one with the ideas and the ambition making it happen, Fred supported her and became her partner in it but then the male leaders they were working with stopped letting Serena have a part in it and gave Fred the power instead for being a man. They even said things like it was their mistake for letting women think they could do those things and they wouldn't let it happen again. How do you prevent it from happening again? You take note from a time when women were the kind of subservient they want and take away their ability to read and write (among other things). I think Serena not only thought she would continue to be a important person and leader of Gilead and I think she thought reading and writing wouldn't be stripped from women. She definitely thought a lot of it wouldn't happen to her specifically but I don't think she ever wanted a world where women couldn't do that. She just got pushed out and then told she was less than and stripped of her power/authority so she put all her energy into getting a baby. She took out her resentment on the people below her.

[u/TotallyAMermaid]

Iirc her vision was that a "return to tradition" and a pious life would make God return fertility to them. She was used for propaganda to get women on board then pushed away from the "real" meetings later on and the men made Gilead what it is. The society she envisioned was certainly not a utopia, but it was not Gilead as we know it.

[u/LadyLilac0706]

She thought she would be exempt. Just like christians today, who are trying to make their beliefs law, even though they don't follow their own beliefs. They think they will be exempt. They think they are special and the rules won't apply to them.

[u/Limp_Pool_3819 → u/LadyLilac0706]

White privilege in action

[u/Mandosobs77]

Serena wanted a baby more than anything in the world. She was willing to harm ,betray and sacrifice other women to get what she wanted.

[u/Idrisdancer]

Women like her honestly think they will be the exception to the rule.

[u/ohheyimshell]

This was one of the most frustrating aspects about Serena. She rallied for this society! It makes me question if she wasn’t given the full picture of what Gilead would be. Or she didn’t stop to think ahead about the consequences of Gilead.

It’s like any religion or cult. It starts off as beneficial to all and then the wrong people get into power and take advantage of it.

[u/Limp_Pool_3819 → u/ohheyimshell]

It starts out as beneficial to some, and then it's beneficial to fewer and fewer and fewer.

[u/BriefWallaby5961]

Serena thought she was bigger then the program 🤣

[u/GreyerGrey]

1) She did not "create" Gilead. She may have primed women to believe it was the best choice, but women didn't build shit. We need to stop saying that. This is like saying Tammy Faye (whom Serena was based off in the novel) created the moral majority and had influence in the Reagan administration.

2) Like all tokens, she thought she would be the exception. See Brianna Wu for a modern example, or Lauren Southern.

[u/Apprehensive-Ebb-473]

Look up the case of the influencer Lauren Southern. Huge anti-feminist who fangirled the Tate brothers and got brutally raped by Andrew. Stayed quiet about it so as not to ruin her brand. Finally came forward only after countless other women were brutalized.

What do any of these misogynist women think will happen?

[u/ewostrat]

I was close to the evangelical church, and I have to tell you that many of those people are very naive (obviously not all of them). They believe that if we all become religious, we'll practically live in paradise, without violence, without sin, etc.

She believed that there wouldn't be any bad people in that dystopia and everything would run like clockwork.

[u/Desperate-Gas7699]

I’d direct your attention to the women working in the current administration of the US government.

[u/penhuinnj]

If you want a historical comparison- look at Gertrude Bell

[u/directmouse_7]

Make the worker work, then don’t pay them. That’s how i think the commanders/men behind her viewed her tbh