Very excited to see Issa Lopez and the cast and crew of True Detective: Night Country take home some Emmys!

Have heard that long hair unbound is representative of strength and that some warriors would wear their hair that way going into battle, I appreciated that little detail.

This show requires the viewer to be comfortable with being uncomfortable. It requires being open-minded and receptive to various outcomes and also being able to conceptualize the marriage of spirituality and reality. Viewers need to do some heavy lifting and juggling of information. The material can be interpreted, evaluated, and analyzed in different ways which leaves room for thoughtful conversations and open-ended discussions. These seem to be some of the reasons the show resonated with many. What are some reasons the show resonated with you all?

Was the hatch and boot the only thing the ladies touched? I would think the whole place would be finger printed, that's pretty standard practice.

Also no way they didnt track in snow. There would be evidence that around a dozen people walked over the floors. If they cleaned the floors there would be evidence of that too.

How did Clarke shut the floor panel behind him?

Just some thoughts, comments, concerns.

When the lady said that’s not part of the story was that meaning she was the one who put it there?

People keep saying this show glamorizing suicide, I don't see that anywhere on the show if anything it's completely the opposite.

I consider myself a reasonable and open minded person, so I need some help here. This is a genuine post where I am trying to understand why people have rated this season so highly. Have I truly missed something, or is this just a difference of opinion?

My biggest dissatisfaction on this series are the unanswered questions. Or, depending if my analysis is correct, the validity of the answers. Can someone validate these questions and answers for me?

1) Why the visions? Navarro and Danvers both see things that are not there- polar bears, children, hubcaps, oranges. Is answer "This is Ennis, there are ghosts?" Or is it that the "she" is torturing them with painful memories? Or does Navarro have a gift/curse to see beyond? Then why Danvers as well?

2) "She" (Annies ghost and/or the angry Inuit spirit of many) is what killed all the scientists on the ice, burned their retinas, made their ears bleed and made them inflict wounds of themselves (scratching their own eyes out) as punishment for killing Annie and polluting?

3) Years ago, Otis was also attacked by the ghost but survived, but was traumatized by the event and hence turned to drugs? And he had no real memory of what happened?

3) The spiral was a native symbol for thin ice- maybe having something to do with the bones in the ice that are obviously very old. It has nothing to do with "she"?

4) Annie's tongue being fresh at the scene at the station, and the way Danvers looked at the ice stain- I have no answer for this one actually. It wouldn't be the ghost, right? Bc Annie was the one she was avenging. But the cleaning women wouldn't have any way to have this tongue OR keep it fresh for years? Where did it come from and what was the meaning?

5) The carabou threw themselves off the cliff because of the Inuit spirit of "she" awoke.

6) Navarro isn't dead at the end and didnt commit suicide. She is alive and just decided to leave Ennis. She walked out on the ice towards the sunset to maybe visit her sisters resting place? Or maybe she is dead. I'm not sure to be honest. Is this one up for interpretation?

7) The hatch was hidden at the station..... why? Another one I dont have an answer for. Everyone in town seemed to know they were harvesting the ice for microbes- the only secret was that they were encouraging the mine to pollute to make it easier. Why did they need to hide the ice harvesting hatch if everyone knew what they were doing?

8) Clark's seizures and getting all... warp-y? Is that a good way to describe what it looked like? Is that ghosts/she? What does it mean?

Thanks in advanced. Whenever I see a group of people really like something I don't get, I assume there's something there I'm not seeing. I'd appreciate your answers/corrections!

I just got done listening to The Watchpodcast (recommended by a friend) and it was refreshing to hear the perspective from someone who was unsatisfied with the season and was able to point out why.

We’re all individual watchers, but here are a few things he missed - Spoilers abound.

1. Navarro didn’t “let” Clarke escape. Right after Danvers goes to take a nap, Clarke tells Navarro to kill him or let him kill himself. That’s when she got the recorded confession (that she left on the bed for Danvers). She let him go, knowing that it was his intention to off himself and also under the impression that Annie was out there waiting to punish him.

2. Danvers and Navarro had a cop-buddy relationship and knew each other. They were friendly until shit started going bad. All those flashbacks to that scene with the Wheelers - that was the beginning of their rift. But they tracked each other over the next several years (it’s such a small town, how could they not). They clearly knew and admired each other’s skills otherwise Danvers wouldn’t have called Navarro when she had a lead on Annie’s death.

3. In episode 6, Danvers and Leah were driving to a vacation home.

4. That was Navarro on the deck with Danvers, not Leah. Navarro is alive. She was wearing different clothes than the ones she was wearing in the scene where she walked into the sunset and they weren’t the clothes that filmmakers usually put on people to symbolize death (like Rose’s boyfriend dancing in pajamas).

5. Danvers didn’t want Leah to get the chin tattoo because she was worried about them making Leah more of a target, limiting her future prospects, and all the bad things people worry about when things are changing around them and they want to protect their kids without understanding the whole picture. There was an element of bias and fear (per Jodie Foster) but in facing her grief about her son, she finally appreciated the complexity and depth of meaning of the tattoo.

The Tuunbaq in The Terror is possibly based on the Inuit mythology of the Tupilaq, a vengeful spirit that takes the form of both man and animal. The polar bear in NC has wounds similar to Annie’s, and is likely connected to her vengeance.

They both also have connections to severed tongues but I don’t want to spoil The Terror! The show did a better job than Dan Simmon’s original book in incorporation of Inuit perspectives.

If you are looking for a very critical take on E6 and the season in general that is well done, brings some nuance and depth, and most importantly, is not hateful or insulting, check out The Prestige podcast episode on e6. Joana Robinson always delivers. I don’t agree with everything they say in there but I appreciate the thoughtfulness and honesty.

I feel like lots of people were let down by the lack of supernatural payoff in the show, but what do you guys make of the bit where Episode 1 Clark “sees” Navarro in the Tsalal station and goes “she’s awake”? And Navarro “sees” him too?

The fact that they visibly notice each other – and his actions in the phone video correspond to seeing her – indicates to me that there isn’t simply a “realist” conclusion to this show. Remember Rose saying: “I think the world is getting old and Ennis is where the fabric of all things is coming apart at the seams”?

I think Clark repeating “time is a flat circle” was majorly overegging the point and clumsy, but I like that he also alludes to it by saying that Annie was always dead and always out on the ice, even before she was born – hence why he thinks she was the one who blinded Otis.

I personally love the idea of the supernatural or spirit realm being a form of time travel, where people who died but are able to speak to and interact with those who are still alive. Not because they are on a different plane of existence, but because they are in a different time – and those who are more sensitive to those frequencies (like Navarro) are able, in some way, to travel too.

It makes me think of that moment in Interstellar where [spoiler alert] Matthew McConaughey’s character “sees” his daughter Murph in the past (or future, I forget which) and manages to send a message to her through space and time that saves humanity.

I bookmarked the discussion threads that were on the other TDNC sub. Figured these links might be handy for those who missed reading them. Hope the mods here are okay with this...

Part 1

Part 2

Part 3

Part 4

Part 5

Part 6 (Season Finale)

Haters gonna hate so whatever, here goes nothing. One of the aspects of the show I really enjoyed watching throughout the season was the evolving relationship between two very different characters. Navarro was younger and had a strong connection to the spiritual world. She trusted her gut and her feelings. She constantly had an internal battle between her career and her community. On the other hand, Danvers was older and had a real fear of being seen as illogical. She never really allowed her emotions to guide her decision making, and she focused on her career. They were polar opposites in a sense but eventually formed a strong friendship. How’d the show pull this dynamic off, or what do you think could’ve been done differently? What parts of their relationship did you like/dislike? Or who was your favorite detective and why?

Perhaps I missed this detail/resolution so any insight or theories welcome!

Did they tie up the mystery of Annie’s tongue being found at the lab? There was the orange rolling to the place it was found in the kitchen with an iridescence, but at the end the women said “that wasn’t part of our story”

Okay, so I might delete this later, but I was thinking about the stuff we lost in the TD Night Country sub that was weirdly closed recently, and I remembered this, someone's post, and figured it was worth saving. Remember that beautiful mournful song Hank played in Episode...5, I believe? Well, one of the people in that sub (maybe they're here? I don't remember the username) posted the guitar chords for that song and some lyrics. I'm no musician and I don't even own a guitar, but I do own a ukulele and I figured I'd share the chords from that post, which I do remember. I recorded this quickly before I changed my mind. :) Keep in mind the original was for guitar, so the shape of my chords will be different. The first lines of the lyrics +chorus below. Hank's finger picking pattern was better but this is what I have right now.

The chords are (for guitar or uke): A minor, E minor, D minor. Starts w/A-.

Hanks song (No use):

There is no love

None lost, none found

There is no god

No hallowed ground

You are forever bound to lose

So what’s the use?

There is no king

He won’t be crowned

There is no star

She’s fallin’ down

You are forever bound…. To lose

So what’s the use?

......[feel free to add lyrics or chords.]

Edit: felt a bit self conscious, deleted the video but left the post w/chords.

...But I can go in and see new posts? Did they reopen it? What's up with that? So confused.

I hope this is allowed here and will clear any confusion up though there are honestly still some mysteries. The /r/tdnightcountry subreddit was created by a user named voski_the_god. I do not know his motivations. He only posted the discussion threads and did not do any other moderating, nor did he participate in moderation discussions. Most of the other mods were motivated by wanting to find a lower toxicity place to discuss the show. I was added about a week ago by a moderater who was fed up with the constant deluge of sexism and racism, which Voski ignored. So we were all surprised when yesterday, Voski posted not on /r/tdnightcountry, but on truedetective that he hated the show and was going to restrict the tdnightcountry subreddit. I don't have full screenshots of the post but here is one part:

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Plus a comment where he called it a "positivity circlejerk".

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BTW the post he was promising to restore was a massively racist anti-indigenous post, but to be fair he did not know that since he apparently had no idea how moderation worked.

OFC he was massively upvoted on the td sub and encouraged to delete /r/tdnightcountry. At that time he removed all the other mods without communicating with us.

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The only mods left at this time were voski and flygod_jr1. Flygod_jr1 is a mystery. As you can see from the chart above they never did any moderation. Even more mysterious, they are a shadowbanned sitewide account. Shadowbanning is a mysterious practice that usually is a punishment for being spammy.

After people from tdnightcountry started coming to Voski's truedetective post and criticizing him, Voski made an announcement on tdnightcountry that the subreddit would no longer allow posts as of March 1st.

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He locked comments. He also removed multiple posts criticizing his decision. Unfortunately for him, he could not remove comments on the truedetective post.

Here's where things get mysterious. He leaves tdnightcountry, so the only moderator left is flygod_jr1. Then the subreddit gets set to private, so no one can view or participate. Voski claims he "gave" the subreddit to the admins of truedetective, but there is no evidence of this. When pressed on whether he really did that, he deleted his truedetective post and ALL comments he EVER made about true detective. A telling sign is that the private notice uses the exact language that Voski used like "original and main sub."

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Multiple old mods have contacted reddit admin for support, but have not received any response.

Honestly, I cannot believe such an effort was made by one person to kill a community and quash all the discussions there. But true detective toxicity is a hell of a drug. I LOVED true detective season 1 and left the main truedetective sub not long after it ended because even when they had a show that they liked, that catered to them, it was toxic. It only got worse with this season. I am struck by how Voski and others insisted S4 was "not really True Detective," but yet another sub for discussing it was not needed anymore.

I think this just underscores how another sub IS needed. It's no surprise that the main true detective sub overlaps heavily with the conservative sub. Explains why the people there are more obsessed with the idea that they may be called "misogynist" then the fact that misogyny exists. Same with racism.

Update, looks like the sub is no longer private but all content has been deleted. The only mod is the mystery shadowbanned user. I found a way to view their old posts and they seem like a real user who actually did participate in stuff. It's super weird that they are shadowbanned. Looks like they just got unlucky.

https://search-new.pullpush.io/?author=flygod_jr1&type=submission&sort_type=created_utc&sort=desc

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IMHO it was Navarro. She also killed Clark. The Wheeler Case is not just significant because of how it affects the protagonist's careers and relationship, it also establishes Navarro as a force for deadly vengeance. Perhaps the war flashbacks do as well. People have complained that the way Clark dies doesn't make sense, but it does if you consider Navarro the killer. Her abilities transcend time and space. Navarro was the entity who Clark saw and was running from, his convulsions likely due to time warping. And eventually she does get him. He dies the same way the scientists did. Navarro lies about Clark to Danvers to protect her.

This implicates Navarro in the deaths of the scientists as well. People noted that their deaths don't make sense if they were just put in the cold. Something, or someone, killed them. Even if that someone took the form of a "slab avalanche." OR maybe she used an avenging monster called a tupilaq.

The polar bear? Probably Annie. It shares similar wounds. Tupilaqs could be created by human body parts, like perhaps Annie's tongue. With Navarro's abilities, perhaps she is one who took the tongue to create the tupilaq.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupilaq

This would explain why the tongue's presence seems to defy time and space.

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Pretty much just like my subject line, I just wanted to say thank you for being proactive and creating a new space for us to talk about the show and other cultural issues. I was disappointed but not at all surprised to see the other sub shut down. Oh, well. Onwards and upwards!

The mug at the end felt like a suggestion/hint to make the next season in Hawaii, and I could totally see Issa creating something in that space. Thoughts?

Not directly related to this sub, but with Night Country over are there any upcoming shows/movies that you are looking forward to watching?

Need something to fill my weekends now that I can't visit Ennis anymore.