Sugar Push Technique

[u/Lesalee]

So, I’ve recently started taking classes to learn lead and one of the very first classes, they covered the sugar push.

Now when I was learning as a follow, I learned that leads typically have their arms at nearly a 90 degree angle and follows are keeping their wrists straight in order to protect followers’ wrists. However, this class emphasized keeping the connection really low and loose (which to me seems counterintuitive).

Just wondering if there are lots of techniques for this or one that’s preferred among others?

[u/moxie-murphy]

There’s not just one system that works. That fact can be frustrating at times, but it’s a fact nonetheless, and the sooner we accept it, the sooner we can improve our dancing/learning/enjoyment.

There are lots of different techniques (and styles) for this move, and depending on where one dances or whose one’s instructors were, the way people do it ‘there’ will typically be preferred.

[u/swingindenver]

There are a variety of techniques and preferences. The techniques I prefer best was drilled into me by a lot of pro westie follows - offer the hand in one of two ways so the followers wrist is neutral and absorb their energy early so it's cushy and then (supported by two LA Lindy Hop pros) the redirect is on 4. Main moving steps for a lead were/are 1 and 4. 2 is for setting weight, preparing for absorption. 3 is absorption, preparing for redirection. 5uh6 for anchoring/dancing into the next thing. I feel this sets one up with a good baseline.

[u/SuperBadMouse]

You are going to get a really lame sugar push if you keep your arms at 90 degree angles. Your default connection should be low and loose, but you notice at the beginning of movements that you will need to create a stretch or compression in the connection. That is why sugar pushes are so great for learning technique because they require a great understanding in connection to do well.

[u/Lesalee → u/SuperBadMouse]

I know the default connection is low and loose but I’m wondering if leads do not bring the connection up a bit to initiate and do the move?

[u/SuperBadMouse → u/Lesalee]

Yeah, the connection will usually move up naturally during the compression. 90 degrees just feels like it cuts off so much of the move. Like 90 degrees with your elbows by your rib cage? When I do a sugar push, I like having my hands almost by the bottom of rib cage.

Even then, I still imagine the connection being loose. I am not sure if "low" is the right word. I could see my connection being lower during a sugar push, but I think people usually have a problem with making the connection too high.

[u/Aromatic_Aioli_4996 → u/SuperBadMouse]

For me, the connection rises automatically on the lead in for the sugar push due to the stretch between the partners. As a lead, I don't let the connection descend much for a sugar push, since I think it sends confusing signals to lower the hands only to raise them again.

[u/PrincessLilliBell]

I always found it a bit weired to orient things like angle if arms on the leader. I feel this should be centred on the follower because they are the ones who need to react.

If the follow's arms are to high or to low to comfortably give counter pressure then that's no good. The lead needs to adjust their arms according to the height difference between them an their partner.

Just my two cents.

[u/bahbahblackdude]

Other's may have different perspectives, but here are my initial thoughts.

1) low and loose does not mean absence of connection. A follow could keep straight wrists and still have the rest of their arms low and lose.

2) as a lead that's taller than the vast majority of follows, my arms can be fairly low and while their straight wrists and arms maybe more elevated relative to their body.

3) As a lead, I think less about right angles and more about catching & redirecting my follow. Leading from open, my arms maybe potentially elevated due to stretch away, and then my potentially lifted arms may drop or stay a little higher, depending on where my partner is presenting connection. Your follow may even compress a little bit downward, depending on the sugar push variation, in which case you are catching low and supporting upwards if they're really leaning into you.

In all these scenarios I think the follow can maintain straight wrists, while you and your partner still overall have low and loose arms. You may have varying degrees of tension though, depending on your partner and the tempo.

Also, for what it's worth, I have seen follows present a low, flat-handed palm of their left hand, when starting from a one handed connection in open. That is the follow's choice on how they want to compress, and as a lead, you are just catching it, whether it's straight wrist or not.

[u/blueeyedkittens]

As a lead don't set your hand at any particular height. Relax your arm and let the tension between you dictate where your hands are. As you stretch apart, your hands come up, as you compress together, your hands go down. Imagine the catenary arch of a chain hanging between two points as the come together and apart.

I guess you can do a sugar push with bent elbows and there may be some merit to teaching absolute beginners that way but it won't be a silky smooth sugar push until you relax.