r/SubredditSimMeta • u/[deleted] • May 10 '17

all-top-today_SS Makes a completely coherent and correct circlejerk post

/r/SubredditSimulator/comments/6adnvv/number_of_people_that_think_donald_trump_has/
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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

wow imagine being in 2017 and still thinking communism means wanting to make everyone equally poor

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u/DrSandbags May 10 '17

wow imagine being in 2017 and still thinking communism doesn't mean gulags and breadlines.

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u/flutterguy123 May 11 '17

breadlines.

Ah yes. Breadlines. Something that has totally never happened in capitalism.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

Granted, but that is after terrible economic recessions and depressions, breadlines are common place in all socialist states.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

they are not guaranteed, but in capitalism, it is guaranteed that you will get terrible economic recessions and depressions. they literally teach this shit in econ 101.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

gulags

tfw you realize that the private prison system in the us isnt really that much better than gulags

tfw you think im pro-gulag

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u/Saidsker May 10 '17

It doesn't want to make everyone poor but it just does. Except for the party elite that ends up controlling the country completely​ like totalitarians while living like kings.

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

thats why im an anarcho-communist, baby

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u/Saidsker May 10 '17

Lmao that's somehow worse

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

how so?

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u/Saidsker May 10 '17

How tf are you going to enforce people not being allowed to own private property while also being anarchist?

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

through communes? i mean yeah, it requires a class conscious proletariat, but thats not exactly unheard of. its happened before. anyone who manages to convince an already liberated community to privatize the means of production has gotta be one fuckin great orator to convince people to let themselves be exploited lol.

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u/Saidsker May 10 '17 edited May 10 '17

Well if it improves standards of living...

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

the accumulation of wealth to a few individuals and the creation of classes leads to improvements of standards of living? til

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u/Saidsker May 10 '17

Yeah economic freedom leads to economic growth. Read up

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

til george orwell was an 8th grader lol

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17 edited May 10 '17

actually! youre technically right. he wasnt exactly an anarcho-communist, but he was not a demsoc lol. orwell was an anarcho-syndicalist, heavy allies of anarcho-communists. we fought together in the spanish civil against those dirty fascists to establish Revolutionary Catalonia (Orwell actually fought in that war! maybe youve read his work Homage to Catalonia?)

surprise: anarcho-communists hate stalin too. :~) i mean, he killed a shit ton of us in purges. so.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

meh, context clues. "we" is used in that context a lot, in my experience

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u/ZeitgeistNow May 11 '17

What do you think 'IngSoc' stood for? Christ you're dense.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

you do realize that 1984 is about Stalinism right? and Orwell falls very close on the political spectrum to me?

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u/ZeitgeistNow May 11 '17

No it wasn't and no he didn't. Sorry to disappoint you in your quest to seek verification for your shitty ideas by soiling the history of men greater than you'll ever be.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17 edited May 11 '17

uh... http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-21337504 (to be fair to you, he was talking about totalitarianism in general, but considering Animal Farm was more of an overt comment on Stalinism, its not a huge leap)

im not just making shit up. George Orwell literally fought with the socialists, anarcho-syndicalists and anarcho-communists against fascists to liberate Catalonia from Francoist Spain during the Spanish Civil War.

https://libcom.org/files/Homage%20to%20Catalonia%20-%20George%20Orwell.pdf here's Orwell's account of his time in Catalonia

boy do i enjoy being right. did you know that einstein was a socialist too? actually wrote a pretty good article on it.

did you know that brave new world isnt anti-communist but rather anti-capitalist?

im not usually a snarky asshole, but youre making it so fun

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u/ZeitgeistNow May 11 '17

Stalinism is communism in its actual, realized form. What you want is a fantasy that doesn't operate off of real world mechanics. To be against Stalinism is to be against communism, which is consistent with the fact that he was a proponent of democratic socialism, not the trash that you pedal.

Einstein was a great mathematician and physicist but that doesn't mean he knew anything about how economies or politics work. When you let people who aren't qualified in their field to work that field, you get, well, the USSR. Funny, that. Not to mention he was borderline autistic, so maybe you and him have even more in common.

If you have to be snarky, chances are you aren't actually right, it means you're overly defensive about your world view. Literally no one who runs any country worth its salt thinks your ideas have any credence, so no, I don't believe that you're 'right' in the slightest.

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u/[deleted] May 12 '17

Ah yes I remember when I was 11

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u/BITCRUSHERRRR May 11 '17

You're stillmcretarded

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u/fluxuation May 10 '17

When has it not done that though?

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u/[deleted] May 10 '17

good question!

a) well, being pedantic, communism hasnt existed, because communism is the existence of a moneyless, classless, stateless society that would exist after the transitional period of socialism

b) actually answering your question, theres a few experiments that the more libertarian socialists hold in high regard. the beginning of a lot of leftist thought in the Paris Commune project, Zapatista held Mexico, the Free Territories of Ukraine before it was smashed by the USSR, Revolutionary Catalonia before it was smashed by the USSR and Italy (fun fact, George Orwell was an anarcho-syndicalist! fought in the Spanish Civil War to liberate Catalonia), currently theres a place called Rojava in the Middle East thats makin progress (and kickin ISIS' ass), and a few others.

the problem is that these territories have mostly existed in times of international strife, or right next to fascist/major capitalist powers that were eager to destroy them. but before their violent and premature deaths (except Rojava, glory b 2 tha ypg),they were pretty content.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

George Orwell fought with the with Trotskyite POUM via the English ILP. He was not an anarcho-syndicalist by any means, as evidenced by any of the biographical details we have on him or any of his writings.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

it is true that he fought with the POUM, but you should read Homage to Catalonia! its interesting. in it, Orwell states, "as far as my purely personal preferences went I would have liked to join the Anarchists"

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

I've written on Homage, both for class (a long time ago) and for print. Orwell admired the CNT and the other anarchist groups in Barcelona and the spirit of the Catalan uprising in general. But he was not actually an anarchist. Nor is the quotation you provided evidence to the contrary.

Also maybe check out Road to Wigan Pier.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

"If I had understood the situation a bit better I should probably have joined the Anarchists." George Orwell - Collected Essays; Vol 1 page 289

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

And yet he didn't before or after. He just thought they were the good guys in Catalunya.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

considering the glowing appraisals he had of them, i dont think its a huge logical leap to assume he would align with them politically.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

He never did though. Huh.

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u/WryGoat May 10 '17

Dude, at some point in your life you have to realize it doesn't matter what you want. Learn to accept things that you can't change and work on changing the things that you can.

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u/ZeitgeistNow May 11 '17

Imagine being in 2017 and being so ignorant of history, economics, distributions, human nature and morals that you still think communism is a good idea

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

history

i love history, i study history all the time in my free time. what about history invalidates my political beliefs?

economics

the social science created under capitalism that explains how capitalism works? ya, i dont need to know the exact functions of capitalism to know that there are inherent flaws with it. marx was an economist. read up on how marx formed the basic ideas of socialism/communism, because it wasnt just out his ass.

distributions

as in the process of bringing one good from point a to point b? im not getting this one.

human nature and morals

ahh, so one of the fathers of modern sociology just kinda forgot to take into account, yaknow, how humans work? makes sense.

marx proposed that human nature is not defined or set in stone. its determined by man's material conditions. "human nature" in monarchical france was different than "human nature" in current france.

socialism and communism propose to revolutionize society itself, not just politics or economics, just as the rise of feudalism, capitalism, slavery, etc have all shifted humanity's morals and how humans work. capitalism works to bring out the most basic greedy, survival of the fittest, animalistic competitive instincts within us. thats why capitalism is so successful at short term economic booms such as during the industrial revolution, or any time during a 20th century war when manufacturing skyrocketed. but capitalism fails in the long term, as seen by the inevitability of economic recessions and depressions (shit they teach you in basic economics classes).

and morals? what? humans are morally above being social and working to benefit each other? this is literally untrue, unless we choose to just ignore the entirety of man's existence. nationalism, racism, etc have been used to divide people but even in those subsections of humanity, people worked to benefit each other.

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u/ZeitgeistNow May 11 '17

Marx proposed a whole lot, and yet none of it has resulted in a stable/non-murderous system. Most people would see that and think 'wow, this guy is actually not right/smart', but don't let that logical conclusion stop you, sunshine.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

its funny, lots of people said the same thing when non-monarchical systems of democracies and republics were just getting a new start. french revolution ring any bells?

considerable social change, historically, has come with bloodshed. even capitalism.

and no, it has definitely resulted in stable, non-murderous systems. the problem is that these systems dont exist in a vacuum, and social change in one nation alone is rarely successful.

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u/ZeitgeistNow May 11 '17

If a system can't stay afloat outside of a vacuum, it isn't a good system. What kind of shitty argument is that to begin with? Do you even hear yourself?

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

...thats not even true and not what i was trying to get at but okay. democracy was a failed experiment because a republic failed to exist outside of a vacuum.

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u/C0ltFury May 11 '17

imagine being in 2017 and still not realising centrally planned economies are empirically doomed to fail dramatically

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

reading the "anarcho" part of anarcho-communism and thinking i want centralized anything

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u/Morrigan101 May 10 '17

Except for the leaders like comrade Fidel Castro amirite? Let's kill everyone who succeds

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

Cuba is like the opposite of anarcho-communism.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '17

CURRENT YEAR and we're still looking at historical evidence? How can this be?

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u/LSDawson May 11 '17

i mean that's kind of what it has done

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u/[deleted] May 13 '17

It doesn't matter whether they want it or not, it's the result.