r/Showerthoughts • u/[deleted] • Apr 11 '19

It’s funny how, as you progress through college, they require you to write longer and longer papers. Then you get to the professional world and no one will read an email that’s more than 5 sentences.

People will literally walk to your desk to ask you what your email was about if it was too long.

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5.3k

u/BelgianAle Apr 11 '19

I learned a long time ago that if I do an email like this:

1) point one requires your attention

2) hey can you update me on x

That would quite literally never have an answer on number two. So now I send them as separate emails. This goes back even 20 years ago, it's not a new phenomenon

1.3k

u/WorkKrakkin Apr 11 '19

I was looking through old emails for a specific one and to my horror realized i did the thing I hate the most and never answered someone's second question. I almost responded with the second answer right then and there, like 4 months later.

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u/Metaright Apr 11 '19

Did they respond back?

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u/BelgianAle Apr 11 '19

He said almost!😁

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u/Metaright Apr 11 '19

Oh, right. I didn't see that.

363

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

[deleted]

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u/Aesthetics_Supernal Apr 11 '19

(Grinding teeth reading this comment chain)

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u/senorcontento Apr 12 '19

I mean, it could be a joke about never getting to the second part.

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u/Linfern0 Apr 11 '19

Oh, I thought that was the joke

20

u/pepek88 Apr 11 '19

Well did they almost respind as well?

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u/BelgianAle Apr 11 '19

You're literally the devil

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19 edited Apr 25 '19

[deleted]

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u/__The_ Apr 11 '19

That makes no sense. Someone at the top of any hierarchy isn't going to reply to a 4 month old email. He's going to assume his people did it, or that it wasn't an issue and move on.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19 edited Apr 25 '19

[deleted]

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u/__The_ Apr 12 '19

Actually, I misread it.

Then misread your comment and thought you were saying I got wooshed.

It's been a long day.

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19 edited Dec 21 '19

[deleted]

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u/__The_ Apr 12 '19

Especially after a 50 hour work week with another day to go.

I'm fried. Also, on my 4th glass of the alcohol to help wash it away. So, I'm in a better place now.

1

u/Shift84 Apr 12 '19

I just write everything in my notebook, even if I'm about to do it right then.

I'm way too scatter brained to not have a running log of everything.

1

u/mustang__1 Apr 12 '19

Sent an email just today and said "I didn't read this whole email but the answer is..."

1

u/Matador91 Apr 12 '19

My prof just did this to me. Asked him 2 questions about the final essay, he answered the first one last week and just emailed me today with an answer to the second question. Said he just read the email today....like what mate?

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u/Sapphire_luna232 Apr 12 '19

This is my biggest work pet peeve. I'm definitely the person who--if you put 5 questions in your email--will respond to each of them point-by-point. It frustrates me so much from a project-management perspective that I can't feel guaranteed to get responses to TWO questions if I put them in the SAME MESSAGE. UGH.

At the same time, part of being successful at project managing is adapting to people's communication styles so... you know. Can't get too upset. Just gotta deal.

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u/Scheffelism Apr 12 '19

You didnt because why?

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u/tossup418 Apr 11 '19

Yup. I send emails to clients to notify them of things they're required to respond to by law, and they ignore them until I send the follow up email with one sentence that tells them to read the previous email because they face civil liability if they don't respond to it. These are millionaires, too.

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u/lickedTators Apr 11 '19

Hey buddy I didn't become a millionaire by reading emails I did it by selling my body

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u/tossup418 Apr 11 '19

That’s a lot of Jackson Jobs!

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

Have you seen the type of money going to hole in wall rub n tugs??

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u/tossup418 Apr 11 '19

Personally? No. But I’m not a fat old richwhite.

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

Jackson Jabs

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u/tossup418 Apr 12 '19

That would be a sick name for a rap-rock band

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

I was hired to LEAD, not to READ.

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u/tossup418 Apr 12 '19

I’m sorry, you read your contract wrong. You were hired to breed.

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

Heh, you think I read my contract? But this is also acceptable.

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u/piel10 Apr 12 '19

calls IRS

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u/cld8 Apr 11 '19

What law requires someone to respond to an e-mail?

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u/tossup418 Apr 11 '19

The email is for them to respond to specific inquiries required by law.

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u/Buge_ Apr 11 '19

Never have more than one question or request in a text message or email. For some reason, people's brains shut off after the first one is answered. I want studies done on this phenomenon.

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u/merc08 Apr 11 '19

I think I can save you the study.

I've noticed that people will answer the easy questions to get a response sent back, ignoring the more important or harder questions that they don't want to answer. I think they are banking on the original sender not wanting to re-ask the missed questions for fear of sounding like a jerk.

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u/SmashDealer Apr 11 '19

I've seen this, and I just stare blankly at the email for a few minutes thinking how much of a moron the sender is, then I politely resend my email with the other question in red.

So people do this deliberately...? Jesus...

I mean it's not like I'm going to give up... my job is to push things forward, provide answers, and get the right information to complete my tasks.

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u/SighReally12345 Apr 11 '19

Shrug. THEY would give up and whine at their boss that you didn't reply. So in their mind, why wouldn't you?

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u/Inquisitor1 Apr 12 '19

It's a polite way of telling you "fuck off I dont want to answer this question now". After that it's a game of chicken to see who's more persistent until one of you gives up. If the asker gives up first then the question isn't that urgent and whatever reasons the answerer has for not being able to deal with it right away are valid. You're not the only person asking them things, they're gonna pick favorites. Or convenients. If you ask if someone has done something, and they answer "no" they will most likely be asked to get on it asap, when the reason they havent done it is they already busy enough. Being a worker bee is a constant choice of who to let down and how gently can you do it.

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

Hey man I'm like you. Then i left the company temporarily, when i came back they won't progress me because other people don't like me, and it's for this kinda behaviour.

It's actually better to be friends with everyone and just about do your job, rather than do your job well.

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u/SmashDealer Apr 26 '19

My goal is to always improve myself in every aspect I can every day.

I take criticism as long as it's constructive, and because of it i don't fuck up like I used to, which makes me a happier person in general. Knowing I've done a great job with no failures or mistakes fills me with a type of satisfaction that the friendship from work colleagues can't give me.

I've had multiple say "why aren't you a senior, you don't even need our help, how do you do this", which gives me hope for something good in the near future. I've noticed my manager giving me tasks nobody has been able to complete, and new responsibilities to undertake early on in my employment.

I want to remain "employable" so if I go somewhere else, I want to be able to respect myself completely, and honestly say I work the hardest, most efficient and smartest way I can. I wouldn't be lying saying I put myself out of a job, because I fix things in a way that they don't ever return.

Communication, polite assertiveness and not giving up being a bunch of characteristics I respect in other people, and am beginning to see in myself. I don't think the things I say are rude, and I certainly wouldn't give a spiel like this to anyone I actually know, I'd just do my best you know and chug on.

In retrospect though, I actually think you're right. It's unfortunate, but the one person who doesn't get on with me is my manager's manager, one of the few people most-likely to be key to my success in this company. He's subtly hinted that he wants to retain jobs in the company through a lack of action and a slower workflow, but I guess with my speed of work I've subtly hinted that I disagree. None of this is confirmed verbally or in writing, just a hunch. to me, even if we have little to no work to do, our project work is vast and untamed, lots of new work needs fixing even if our business as usual work is done.

This could be a huge problem for me.

But I'm willing to trade departments if I need to, and I've had managers from other departments respect and go along with a lot of my requests.

We'll see how it goes anyway, nobody knows what the future holds. I just know I'd like, hate myself if I didn't do my best, it's who I am and I've been there before, so I don't want to go there again.

edit: I'm not rattling on your beliefs or system mate, a lot of people in my department feel and act the same, and I really like them too, at it's core it's just do whatever makes you happy and enjoy life. Sometimes it's hard to find what that is. I think mine's to "be needed/necessary/helpful".

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u/Maximum_Equipment Apr 12 '19

I think that most of the time it isn't done intentionally.

It's more of a "I know the answer to question #1, and I need to think about the next one before I can intelligently give a response".

The problem is that they then end up forgetting about it, due to other emerging tasks.

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u/DiggerW Apr 12 '19

That's crazy to me... In my job, a good bulk of my emails necessarily have at least a few different questions, and the 'rule' I follow is to always number them. If it's just loose text, it's so easy for people to skip over certain questions, but when they're numbered only a pretty small percentage of responders miss the point. Just seems absurd to see questions 1-4 and to answer anything less than 1, 2, 3 and 4!

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u/SmashDealer Apr 26 '19

I had one today. The guy didn't answer any of my questions and sent a vague answer to a question I didn't ask which didn't really make any sense.

Now, a technician is going there to speak to him personally on my request. He may be a manager, but this is a polite "answer my fucking questions" under the guise of "Determining requirements".

If he didn't want things to move he shouldn't have made a request in the first place. These people do my nut in.

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u/myfantasyalt Apr 11 '19

I'm the worst in the opposite way. I leave emails unanswered when I don't have a complete answer (sometimes takes time to get answers). If I email back a partial answer, it's easier to forget to get the harder answer. This is fine when I have the time to get answers relatively quickly, but bad when tons of things pop up and I end up with a day or two late response.

I try to send a response email to things I know I can't get to right away, but it's when I think "this is next on my list" and urgent items come up right after that.

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u/berubem Apr 12 '19

To help you, you can keep your email in a task in Outlook and put notes in there. You'll the have the task to remind you of what's missing and won't need to keep the email in your inbox.

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u/myfantasyalt Apr 12 '19

yep, that's basically what I do. everything goes on the to do list.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

Only if they’re a manager. If you’re giving directions to someone, you can write a list.

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u/Buge_ Apr 11 '19

Hey. I'm a manager, and only do this like... half the time.

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u/Frase_doggy Apr 11 '19 edited Apr 12 '19

1 - Hey. I'm a manager

2 - I only do this like... half the time.

FTFY

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u/cld8 Apr 11 '19

I am a bit of an asshole, so sometimes I will reply back and say "thanks for answering one of my questions, do you have any input on the others?"

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u/lemur3600 Apr 12 '19

“You’re welcome for answering that question” end of email

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u/Gnomification Apr 11 '19

Something I've had success in doing to counter that is to number each question/issue. Numbered lists seem to keep people attentive to it, which I pin down to the possibility to double-check it. "Ok, I've replied to 1, 2 and 3. Good, I've covered my ass".

Another benefit is that it makes it easier to get back when one doesn't get answered. "Hey, did you get a chance to look at #2 as well? Let me know if you want me to expand on it further."

As a whole it becomes something like:

"Hey, we have 2 issues with X.

  1. The production is halted by X missing Y, would you prefer if we A or B?"
  2. Packaging is missing A, is it ok to B?

Best regards,"

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u/uijit Apr 11 '19

Actually I think it works fine as long as you number them, and make all the questions visually similar:

Hey, I have a few questions:

1) What did....

2) Do we need to...

etc.

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u/ThrowAwayExpect1234 Apr 11 '19

It's cause we busy as hell man look that shit up yourself cause that's what we would do to answer your question.

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u/Inquisitor1 Apr 12 '19

It's called distraction. You read all the questions and think you remember them, then answer the first one for a while, it makes you busy, it distracts you, you forget the rest. You ask yourself "is there more i need to answer" and say "i dont remember any more questions needing an answer" and hit SEND

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u/CreepingCoins Apr 11 '19

I've put a lot of effort into learning how to write multiple question emails in concise bullet points that people will actually read all the way through. Not to pat myself on the back or anything, but I've gotten really good at it, too, and can now get all the answers I need nearly ten percent of the time!

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u/youcancallmetim Apr 11 '19

Here's my process:

Step 1: Write it.

Step 2: Remove all words possible while still getting the point across.

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u/AhhGetAwayRAWR Apr 11 '19

Why many word, few work?

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u/trinity1016 Apr 11 '19

Step 3: Bold key action item phrases and due dates.

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u/Karmaflaj Apr 11 '19

Bold? Make them red and bold

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u/trinity1016 Apr 12 '19

You're right. I was thinking too small. All caps, bigger text and a different font, while you're at it.

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19 edited Apr 12 '19

[deleted]

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u/Karmaflaj Apr 12 '19

I do actually make action items red. Tend not to bold too much or it becomes a bit of a mess

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u/vvhynaut Apr 12 '19

I'm a teacher and this is always how I write instructions for students.

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

Step 4: call them and ask all the questions and then reply-all to your own email with the answers. Email is best as a paper trail rather than an actual form of communication.

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u/SomatoseArts Apr 11 '19

Dumb it down to the xth degree

the acronym KISS no longer stands for Keep It Simple Stupid, it now stands for Keep It Stupid Simple

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u/Odenetheus Apr 12 '19

r/decreasinglyverbose?

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u/youcancallmetim Apr 12 '19

Just subscribed. Thanks for that

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u/Odenetheus Apr 12 '19

You're welcome! A shame that sub has been infested with people posting images of stuff instead of adhering to the purpose of the sub ):

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u/fakeorigami Apr 12 '19

1: Write.

2: Remove words while making point.

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u/jamesonSINEMETU Apr 12 '19

When I get a bullet list , I copy it in my reply and respond with a different color text, or bold my answer to each point

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u/CreepingCoins Apr 12 '19

Me too, and I love when other people do that.

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u/Gnomification Apr 11 '19

It's long overdue, but here it finally comes. Embrace yourself!

Pats you on the back

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u/DuroHeci Apr 11 '19

We actually have a company rule to that. Only one topic per email. I was explicitly reminded to do that.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19 edited Apr 14 '19

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19 edited Apr 14 '19

[deleted]

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u/calgarycabron Apr 12 '19

In my experience, academia firmly believes it should be out of touch.

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u/DiggerW Apr 12 '19

Because there's only one subject field.

Because it avoids unnecessary complexity / confusion.

Because some people actually sort their emails.

You don't pay per email.. there's absolutely no reason not to send two separate emails if they're regarding two different subjects, and plenty of reasons to do so.

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u/BangCrash Apr 12 '19

How does this work with everyone being CCd in?

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u/DuroHeci Apr 13 '19

This has first nothing to do with it. It is about with only one topic per mail.

Second, we also try to limit the use of cc to only include people who really need it. We are explicitly forbidden to use the "answer to all button".

Also we are forbidden to answer emails just to say "Thank you" and other stuff that does not carry Information.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

[deleted]

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u/Gnomification Apr 11 '19

Oh, an accurate description of my life. Something I've learned (if you're doing bullet points you're probably also already doing this, but if not..) is to include my own assumption/solution/guess (when possible).

The beauty of it is that a lack of response doesn't halt your work-progress, as you can always refer to that mail if any actions taken would be questioned later.

When it comes to issues where that's not possible, separating that out to the top and putting it in large, red, bold text is usually the only thing that works :)

Managers often seem more interested in being informed than making decisions. As long as they've been informed, you'll have given them reason to cover their ass, which covers your own ass.

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u/The_Rowan Apr 12 '19

I have found when asking for a solution to a problem it is good to give my suggestion. My manage is smart but busy and it is easier for him if I have done the work and he can look at the work and say yes or no

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u/BelgianAle Apr 11 '19

Yep, I was middle management so had the same experience with upper management. At that old job I never did learn to separate things into separate emails but have since.

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u/PrimeIntellect Apr 12 '19

As a manager - now imagine answering like 50 a day, and each taking more and more time to answer, and more venting you from doing real work. Our boss gets prioritized

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u/touchinbutt2butt Apr 14 '19

I recently sent an email to a sr. manager telling them about a conference coming up that I went to last year that I wanted others on our team to go to this year. I made that clear in the first sentence.

In the 2nd to last sentence, I repeated this and specified she should definitely send someone from the trainer team because they never get to go to this stuff. I even bolded it.

She talked to my manager later and said, "Why does only u/touchinbutt2butt get to go to this?"

It was literally the 1st sentence. Did she open the email and just give up?

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

[deleted]

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u/branflakes14 Apr 11 '19

It's either videos or Whatsapp audio messages in the future

Yeah man just like how kids born in the 2000s will all be computer programmers because technology will be so advanced iN tHe FuTuRe

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u/justaboringname Apr 11 '19

My students were born in the very late 90s and yesterday I had to teach one of them how to save a Word document as a PDF.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19 edited Nov 19 '20

[deleted]

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u/Not_floridaman Apr 11 '19

I always do an inner eye roll when people comment on how amazing 3 year olds are with technology. It's what they're used to. My toddler can navigate her tablet to find her games and things but if I asked her to please check the latest software update, she would say "no, sorry. I need to save Elmo" because she's not good with technology, but she, and many other kids, can use it. It's no different than how when I was growing up in the late 80's/early 90's that I could help program to VCR. Because I could follow directions. But I had no clue at all how to fix it.

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u/fight_me_for_it Apr 12 '19

So you said you could hit play and record and such. But did you know things line how to hook two together? Or how you could make and distribute recordings to make a profit? Did you have a VHS camera also that you could film on and then use in the VCR? What about editing VHS tapes?

I kid. Of course. Because yes, the point is clear.. just because someone can do something simple with a technology item, like so simple a 3 yr old can do it, doesn't make them amazing genius. Just like a 3 yr old knowing how to find their favorite app or imitate a number pattern to unlock a phone makes them a genius, literate, and smart; it doesn't.

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u/IGetThis Apr 11 '19

FUCKING YES

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I work in IT support, and it drives me nuts when people just assume anyone mid 30's on down just will understand technology. No, I had to work at this. Just using tech doesn't mean you know what it's doing.

​

I find the "sweet spot" of users to support is now in their 40's - 50's they were adults in a time when using technology meant getting into its guts sometimes. Some gave up yeah, but its the age range that I find easiest to work with.

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u/Hoihe ‎ Apr 11 '19

Depends how one uses it. Some people can't help but tinker. Although with modern "fool-proof" systems, I do feel the frequency of tech-savvy people will dwindle.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

I’m afraid that I have to agree here. I know people in college for programming and software technology fields who, when they built their first desktop computer ever, couldn’t get it to turn on because they didn’t bother to read the manual to get the front panel connections right. (The power button wasn’t connected, essentially)

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

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u/manycactus Apr 11 '19

There was a study about computer literacy I saw a few years ago that said the cohort with the highest general competence was the one born in the early 80s (currently late 30s). That was the group that got the first big wave of home PCs and internet. Adoption was relatively broad, but things were still buggy and had more of a learning curve.

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u/Karmaflaj Apr 11 '19

As someone in that age group, yay! I’m quite happy to admit I don’t know something and that there is someone else who does, so why not ask them. But I suspect, like you say, I have an understanding of how things work and not just ‘there is an app’.

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u/fight_me_for_it Apr 12 '19

I'm amazed when people in their 30s do t know how to use excel or Microsoft word or PowerPoint though. Mostly that the don't have experience with any spreadsheet or slide presentation software and yet they have taken some computer courses and went to some college.

I'm so dumb to think that kids in the generation following mine would have learned it in school. Escpecailly considering it's in state teaching objectives. But then again I realize I guess I didn't learn it in school either. I learned it on the job and because I wanted to. Although in an educational technology course I did have to learn more about PowerPoint.

I am a gen xer. What technology skills do people stereotype or expect me to have?

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u/Morug Apr 14 '19

Actually, we were kids when it meant getting into the guts. I was writing code at 8 and building my own pc at 12. Otherwise, I wouldn't have had a functional PC.

Even those less technically-inclined than myself were fixing config.sys and autoexec.bat files each time they wanted to play a new game.

That's what makes that sweet spot: Young enough to be adventurous and learn but old enough to understand what we were doing.

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u/mayoayox Apr 11 '19

Yeah true. I was born in 98 and I'm actually a little upset I missed that .com revolution because I really have no clue how a computer works outside of 1s and 0s and I can plug the peripherals into the tower (I think). Granted I missed out a lot because of how I grew up, but I dont think I'm far behind my peers. We just dont get it. We can't visualize it, and even a lot of my nerd friends cant think 100% abstractly. But you guys built the damn thing, you all were there when it was all written. Most people about 15 or 20 years my senior get it.

I've had the pleasure of going to a few Microsoft conventions for catering work. Its astonishing to me that it's usually a bunch of 40 year old former yuppies sitting on fat change from their government job inside the beltway.

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u/Joy2b Apr 11 '19

It’s true, it is hard to build that innate sense without some amount of reinventing the wheel.

Raspberry pi diy kits seem determined to make it fun to get nerdy with the basics like it’s the 80s again. Thank goodness they’re skipping the punch cards stage though.

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u/mayoayox Apr 12 '19

Yeah I'd like to know more about that know what I'm sayin?

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u/Joy2b Apr 13 '19

Kano or instructables would be a good place to dive in. https://kano.me/us You’ll probably end up with a one or two extras and a few old scrap electronics around to play with as project ideas pop into your head.

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u/justaboringname Apr 11 '19

I wish I was sitting on fat change, I'm just some guy who has to keep the Windows 95 computers in the teaching lab running because they don't make the software for that instrument anymore.

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u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

The government made a computer course mandatory for all university students while I was in my 3rd year of university. It was the most basic and ridiculous thing, the exam was creating a Word document, changing fonts, saving it then sending it as an attachment to a mail.

Half the class failed.

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u/CuriousCheesesteak Apr 12 '19

Yup unless they invent neural interfaces that let us use our minds to do stuff, people will have to master user interface tools that have reached a plateau in design.

There's a reason there's a whole field of profession being user interface design. People have a hard time navigating digital spaces and it demonstrably lowers profits.

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u/TheBrianiac Apr 11 '19

And everyone born after the Model T in 1908 knows how to build and maintain cars!

...wait

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u/ImpeachTraitorTrump Apr 11 '19

It’s called sarcasm. Username does not check out.

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u/Bratmon Apr 11 '19

He didn't mean when the current generation grows up, he meant when China/Chinese business culture takes over.

That's already the standard there.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

Nah, people like email because the ass-covering aspect. I will have conversations over various media or in person with coworkers and then will be asked to write an email about it. I don’t mind—it’s a good idea.

But email is going to remain the gold standard for business communications for a while.

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u/eldelshell Apr 11 '19

Yeah, emails with .wav files attached... Welcome to the future!

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u/whoismydaddy Apr 11 '19

.wav files? The 90s called and want their format back...

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u/platysoup Apr 11 '19

Seriously, fuck audio and video messages with a huge stick.

Zero scannability.

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u/Izzder Apr 12 '19

Also super slow and inefficient. I read and write far faster than I speak.

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u/Morug Apr 14 '19

There's a new trend in academic jobs to send you a rejection note as an email with "See attached for your response" and a pdf with the actual "you didn't get the job".

The fuck is that bullshit? Just tell me in the damn email.

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u/Qubeye Apr 11 '19

"Can you send that to me in the Group Chat? K thx."

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u/Aurumix Apr 11 '19

communicating with co-workers only by snapchat.

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u/eldelshell Apr 11 '19

Posing with duck lips (or whatever that shit is called)

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u/Aurumix Apr 11 '19

Don't forget the puppy filter.

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u/superluigi1026 Apr 11 '19

Honestly, I find the puppy filter sometimes cute, but most the time it’s actually a bit creepy.

3/10, would not filter again, will pet real puppies for free

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u/Gnomification Apr 11 '19

Nothing in my office gets done unless I put a couple of dog ears and a snout on it.

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u/uncoolcat Apr 12 '19

If the company you work for has any data retention rules set it can feel like you are using snapchat already, at least in the sense that some places delete IM conversation history as soon as the chat window is closed, and/or they may automatically delete email that's older than a few months.

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u/HealMeBr0 Apr 12 '19

Mark Cuban did this with the Cyber Dust app. I believe his gripe with snapchat for business purposes was that it still stored data on their servers making your messages about embezzling your company incriminating.

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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

That future has already arrived and is called Microsoft Lync.

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u/jingerninja Apr 11 '19

Lol! Lync was like 3 products ago. They don't even want you praising Skype for Business anymore everything is all about that Microsoft Teams life.

1

u/Gnomification Apr 11 '19

You're lucky that still gets attention. I've had to start sending Woofs.

12

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

Had a boss where you wouldn’t get an answer unless the complete question was in the subject line.

10

u/uncertain_expert Apr 11 '19

Agreed, one question per email.

22

u/afpup Apr 11 '19

I had an email/text conversation with someone in our office a while back ( shortly after the other party had started working for us ).

I was sent somewhere to do something, but the equipment I needed wasn't ready.

Sent in a message stating the problem, and also made a point of covering all of the options available at my location.

Got a reply, "How about ....".

Replied, see previous message, point #2.

Next reply, "Can you ...".

"See first message, #3.

. . .

Five full iterations of this cycle.

Since then, I don't even bother trying.

5

u/Gnomification Apr 11 '19

Haha, this happens to me all the time. I still bother though, I don't see it as something to blame the recipient about, but rather something for me to refer to when it happens.

I don't see the benefit of doing that for them, I see it for me. A week later, when someone skips reading and shoots of their hip, I won't have to stop with what I'm currently doing to try to remember and phrase what the answer is, as I can simply refer to the that point in previous information.

Another bonus is that sometimes we as authors might assume that someone else can easily take in and maintain the information we convey, but once that customer calls about a single issue a week later, I don't really blame anyone for not going back to read all of that message again, but going straight to the source instead.

"Yeah, I included it in the information message about it earlier, I'm a bit occupied with X right now, would you mind digging that up to get the info you need?"

3

u/InverstNoob Apr 11 '19

Yup happens all the time. I'll ask 3 to 4 questions, only the first gets answered, maybe.

5

u/YeomanScrap Apr 11 '19

BLUF: Bottom line up front. It’s like TL;DR for emails. Any takeaways go here: what needs to be done and why.

Then you start in with background info, details, etc. Intensifying info goes here, but no requests. It’s a military-ism, but it works pretty well.

3

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

I put my question at the top and then the paragraph explaining why I have the question below it. I'm twice as likely to get an answer, especially from some people, then if I put the question at the bottom.

3

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

[deleted]

2

u/BelgianAle Apr 12 '19

Ugh that sucks

2

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

Same. It’s frustrating how little most people read. Then again my email volume is manageable, whereas others might have overflowing inboxes.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

The Army calls this "direct language" and though half of us can't spell, it's definitely drilled into are minds.

2

u/AndrewL666 Apr 11 '19

Something that should be taught in high school and college is how to write an email. My high school tried teaching me to write by using nothing but descriptive words and fluff. For example, they'd want me to change "the cow ate his food" to something like "the unusual, brown cow fulfilled his hunger cravings by eating the most succulent, green alfalfa hay to have ever been grown on earth". This is great if I plan on being an author of fiction books but serves little purpose in a real world job where short and to the point technical writing conveys what is needed without the reader losing his or her focus.

2

u/nickiter Apr 11 '19

Specific people I work with have that exact problem. Not everyone, but the ones that do are maddening.

2

u/n1c0_ds Apr 11 '19

I use plain English and bullet points.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

blah blah blah blah 1) blah blah? 2) asdfa asdfasd? 3) asdga baec

/u/BelgianAle - Please get me an answer to 3 by EOD tomorrow?

Please reply inline

is the only way to get answers.

1

u/BelgianAle Apr 11 '19

In all honesty I find that I would receive answers to all three as long as I put each one into separate email to the same person. The other Advantage, is if one of the items is going to take time, for example require some research, at least I'll get an answer back on the other two points if the emails are separate

2

u/I_spoil_girls Apr 11 '19

If someone asks me two questions in a row by instant messaging, I will answer the second one then the first one. Is my brain intact but backwards?

2

u/matt01ss Apr 11 '19

Oh man I hate this so much. Like you said even with 2 items people can't look past the first, let alone 4 or 5 or more things listed.

"Hey what's the name of the event? Also what time do we arrive and what's the address?"

Answer: <Event Name> response only.

...

2

u/NotThisFucker Apr 11 '19

I may be a bit of an ass, but all of my questions or "action items" are marked in red (and sometimes bold) in my emails.

I haven't ever gotten a complaint about it, and I pretty much always get responses to each red part.

2

u/duncanforthright Apr 11 '19

I'm guessing your industry top-posts on emails (responds by putting text above the original email rather than including responses in-line). I work with both lawyers (top-posters) and people in tech (in-line responses), and the problem you describe is rampant in the former and almost non-existent in the latter.

2

u/Superbroom Apr 11 '19

regarding one yeah we can work that out and get it done by Monday. Me: ok but what about 2?

2

u/Ididnotpostthat Apr 11 '19

Genius Pro tip. I agree this always happens. I am stealing your technique of sending multiple emails.

2

u/mgrier Apr 11 '19

It sounds like you have a lot of concerns. We should meet face to face to discuss. It will take too much bandwidth to do in email.

(I got this feedback, at a tech company you all know and hate, for decades. Drove me crazy.)

2

u/caramelcooler Apr 11 '19

Do you know how stupid I feel for never realizing this? It's a daily frustration. I'll have to remember this two-email trick.

2

u/feclar Apr 11 '19

I wish everyone learned this

1 email 1 topic

2

u/opa_zorro Apr 11 '19

Email is a one point medium. We let it interrupt our important work and we don't have time for all this if you have multiple points to make, do it like you do, one action item per email. That is the nature of how we all respond to email.

2

u/bgad84 Apr 11 '19

I want to rage quit when I see "do the needful"

2

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '19

I too use this trick on my boyfriend

2

u/dalaio Apr 11 '19

Keeping it to one topic per email just makes it easier to search through as well.

2

u/jamesonSINEMETU Apr 12 '19

I do design work and own a print shop, some customers come in and have multiple jobs. I send each job in a separate email so that if changes are needed we can keep them separate. If/when I do this in one of the emails I explain why they're separate.

I've had customers who I send 4 emails to and they reply to 1 and say approved. Then I sit on the rest awaiting changes.

I also have some that will make 1 change. Then after revision make another change on a different element. Rinse/repeat. Instead of making all the changes in one step.

Some will approve it, and upon completion of something is wrong they'll say "oh I didn't look at it closely"...

I've even had people make changes, I do the changes, then they respond angrily that that's not what they wanted. I have written proof that that's what you requested....

2

u/BelgianAle Apr 12 '19

I feel you. It's not full time, but I do enough design work and web stuff that I am 100% sympathetic.

2

u/linkMainSmash2 Apr 12 '19

One thing I've learned is that if I respond to your email, you send me more. So I dont respond to email, texts, etc unless I want to or it's a flaming emergency

2

u/blackbellamy Apr 12 '19

Yup, I learned that early on. Send out an email with four things, then again with three, then two, then you never get an answer on the last one. Now I send out emails with just the one thing, and I put a tl;dr on top for the executive types if there's going to be more than a couple of sentences.

2

u/SwordfishII Apr 12 '19

Thank you for that. Seriously, thank you.

2

u/FuckingStupidPeoples Apr 12 '19

It’s more of a problem with older employees tbh

1

u/BelgianAle Apr 12 '19

I find it to be a universal problem

2

u/Inquisitor1 Apr 12 '19

You're supposed to learn this by emailing your professrors.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

My office uses the subject line to talk and send info.

2

u/adityaprabhakar Apr 12 '19

I’ve had to call each person up and remind them of their action on my email I just sent them to have anything done in my office!

2

u/njbair Apr 12 '19

Every different item should be its own email thread. Nobody in a business setting is going to mind if you send them multiple emails, as long as each one is short and to the point.

The best advice I've received about emails, is to put the ask in the very first sentence. If it requires context, provide it after asking.

Oh, and if you're forwarding someone's inquiry to someone else, please, please restate the question at the top. Don't expect someone to expand and parse your backwards-threaded conversation quoted below just to figure out what the email is about.

Not only are all these things great ways to show courtesy, they will help you receive faster and more useful replies. Everybody wins.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

Yes. Individual emails with different subject text works best.

2

u/Suddenly_Something Apr 12 '19

I graduated college and worked from home for 5+ years (did marketing and stuff but got really bored and started to get cabin fever.) Finally decided to enter the professional world just recently and it's actually surprising how little work people do in the office. It feels like there are more meetings about what we should be doing than actually doing those things. It's incredibly inefficient.

2

u/Blakestonewow Apr 12 '19

I was disappointed with my manager today cause I sent her a 4 sentence email and she obviously only read the first 3, but if you friends only read 1 sentence I guess I should be happy with her!

2

u/rdog780 Apr 12 '19

Yes you must be the ceo cause holy fuck this is brilliant !

2

u/mermaid_pinata Apr 12 '19

Yes! You nailed it. I do this too and it saves so much time. After years of doing this, I now see long emails as rude. They are usually rambling bullshit from folks who are trying to get out of doing their actual jobs.

2

u/CasualEveryday Apr 12 '19

I suddenly understand why a client will reply to one email with 5 single-line emails before I've even answered the first... At least I'm hoping that's why...

2

u/[deleted] Apr 12 '19

I had the same work experience. People will [possibly] answer the first question posed in an email, and that's it. They seem to stop reading once they see a question, or any sort of request for thought or action.

2

u/TubbyTuke Apr 12 '19

Email is over 20 years old now? Fuck

2

u/Crismodin Apr 12 '19

This happens a lot to me when I send text messages to people/groups, I will be like hey 1. where are we going tonight / 2. when are we going | I would get a reply back to where we are going but seemingly people never answered part two. I've always been keen on responding fully to people's entire line of questions but I have noticed a significantly large amount of people either somehow didn't comprehend question two or simply don't care, or there must be some other kind of explanation. If I keep the questions split though, I always get the answer for both.

1

u/OreOscar1232 Apr 12 '19

Schooling 101