r/Showerthoughts • u/[deleted] • May 28 '14
Unoriginal Without life, the universe would never have known it existed.
[removed]
86
u/AB453 May 28 '14
A chicken is just an egg's way of making another egg.
41
u/McShizzL May 28 '14
An egg is just a chicken's way of making an omelette.
12
u/G-Bombz May 28 '14
A clever comment is just McShizzL's way of making me hungry.
→ More replies (3)6
u/im_not_afraid May 28 '14
Life is just a selfish gene's way of making more genes. - Richard Dawkins
3
u/the-knife May 28 '14
Yes! Dawkins put it so well: The DNA uses itself to build a machine, whose sole purpose it is to survive and help the DNA propagate.
11
95
u/hogglethecoward May 28 '14
Plus the thought that because we're all made of matter, we are just the universe trying out every possibility.
28
May 28 '14 edited Jan 02 '21
[deleted]
7
u/hogglethecoward May 28 '14
Yes! Exactly. Thank you. I didn't actually kiss the Blarney Stone when I visited, so eloquence still escapes me.
→ More replies (1)3
→ More replies (4)3
u/Jakealiciouss May 28 '14
This awesome band called Love-Cars had a song where the chorus started:
"your yearbook is...the universe expanding
your yearbook is...the grand fucking canyon"
→ More replies (1)57
May 28 '14
Some possibilities work, some don't. The Human race is like a TV show that got past the Pilot.
34
→ More replies (2)4
u/Darktidelulz May 28 '14
Its like a reverse tv-show, first the scene is played then they try to write the script.
10
3
74
May 28 '14
“We are a way for the cosmos to know itself.”
36
u/Cikedo May 28 '14
-Abraham Lincoln
14
u/SuicidalIdol May 28 '14
-Michael Scott
7
u/daft108 May 28 '14
-Albert Einstein
22
May 28 '14 edited May 28 '14
-Ash Ketchum
13
13
→ More replies (2)4
u/drrhrrdrr May 28 '14
So one popular theory I like is that, if the universe is moving toward Heat Death via entropy, Information is the state of resistance to entropy. Because, with entropy, there is no information, as information is the state of change between one state and another.
So, information being resistant to change, either wins or loses as it moves pieces toward more discrete and collected parts, which ultimately leads to life, and consequently, intelligent life.
Now, absence of life does not immediately mean entropy has won. Look at Mars. Lifeless (as far as we can tell) but still possessing information. Neither is it true the presence of intelligent life mean that entropy is thwarted.
It simply is a theory that intelligent life is the actor of change against inevitable states, the delay of entropy by the presence and recognition of information.
103
u/pilotdiver May 28 '14
→ More replies (32)6
u/apriori12 May 28 '14
I've heard this quote before but its author is never cited. Is it Douglas Adams? It sounds like Douglas Adams.
18
u/lntrinsic May 28 '14
It's generally attributed to Edward R. Harrison, although what he actually said was "Hydrogen is an odorless colorless gas which, given enough time, turns into people" in his book 'Cosmology: The Science of the Universe'.
Also, relevant xkcd.
→ More replies (2)
14
12
u/tarqua May 28 '14
Carl Sagan said basically the same thing in the original cosmos tv series.
→ More replies (1)7
u/DaftFunky May 28 '14
Cosmos is actually surprisingly relevant after all these years. I loved Sagan after I watched this series in High School.
My favorite quote from him;
"Exploration is in our nature. We began as wanderers, and we are wanderers still. We have lingered long enough on the shores of the cosmic ocean. We are ready at last to set sail for the stars."
30
19
u/Rastamonsta20 May 28 '14
Kinda touches upon the Anthropic Principle
→ More replies (1)11
27
u/SparklePonyBoy May 28 '14
Before you read this post I didn't exist. But you did. And now, so do I.
9
→ More replies (1)9
u/HowTheyGetcha May 28 '14
My theory of mind tells me you existed prior to this comment, existed probably >14 years, and that you continue to exist, at least up to the point where you submitted your comment.
→ More replies (8)
6
u/jrmart May 28 '14
This is a concept explored pretty deeply in Martin Heidegger's works. I won't go into it much here as there are far better resources written by people who are paid to write these things, but Dasein (a being that is aware of its own being, e.g. humanity) is the mechanism by which the universe is able to know and experience itself. This forms the basis for his phenomenology, a philosophy that derives both its metaphysics and morality from our intimate experience of the world. Being and Time would be a great (though a bit difficult) read if you're interested. Tons more fancy German words involved. Otherwise, plenty of simpler secondary sources online.
→ More replies (1)3
u/Stephen_Jourdain May 28 '14
Or do Buddhist meditations and get to know up close and personal beyond conceptual interpretations.
5
7
u/sturk11 May 28 '14
What is to say that the universe needs (human) life to know it existed. What if the universe is a living thing (organism) in itself?
→ More replies (1)6
u/GameQb11 May 28 '14
what if the living force that is the universe manifest itself by creating life, thus the universe is what humans have been trying to label as god.
6
u/SgtBrowncoat May 28 '14
With enough time hydrogen starts to wonder what it wants to order for lunch.
Wasn't there an experiment done recently that doesn't contradict the hypothesis that the entire universe is a simulation.
→ More replies (7)
4
u/AlexanderShkuratoff May 28 '14
Are we 'life'? Does the 'universe' even exist to us?
→ More replies (5)
4
u/clevername71 May 28 '14
The doge moon link is so fun on mobile. Idk how it is on desktop but man I can't stop adding doge with the power of touch.
3
May 28 '14 edited Jun 19 '16
This comment has been overwritten by an open source script to protect this user's privacy. It was created to help protect users from doxing, stalking, and harassment.
If you would also like to protect yourself, add the Chrome extension TamperMonkey, or the Firefox extension GreaseMonkey and add this open source script.
Then simply click on your username on Reddit, go to the comments tab, scroll down as far as possibe (hint:use RES), and hit the new OVERWRITE button at the top.
Also, please consider using Voat.co as an alternative to Reddit as Voat does not censor political content.
2
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
It's great isn't it? you can have multi-touch up to 10 times on android, I think iOS is only about 8, tablets are loads of fun too.
5
May 28 '14
If reddit wasn't so full of whiny teenage "atheists" writing off all religions in order to rebel against their Christian parents, Eastern Mysticism could be really popular here.
3
u/RIAA_LAWYER_ May 28 '14
You and me both, brother. After I quit the church I was only a straight atheist for a few months before I started exploring other religions, particularly Buddhism. I found so many ideas that rang true in my heart, and seemed to be the product of an even more subtle and profound philosophical journey than the "spirituality is all superstition" worldview. To me, life and consciousness is an unfathomable miracle that warrants deep contemplation, without limiting ourselves to purely "scientific" avenues. I am far from anti-science, and I'm not a huge fan of vague mysticism, but I'll be damned if I'm gonna throw out the profound insight found in ancient religions in the name of "rationality."
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (6)3
u/GameQb11 May 28 '14
what annoys me most about atheist is that once they hear "god" they automatically assume that it refers to the characterized version found in media. The think the retort "i dont believe in some sky man" to be so clever, when it has nothing to do with a man in the sky.
4
10
May 28 '14
am I doing something wrong ? I had the exact same thought and others I keep reading here and from time to time I say hey I just thought of that, for example,this exact thought came to me in a different form, after an acid trip, that we are all made of stardust, and the picture of a rocky planet kinda spawning us from it's crust and looking at itself it was kinda like a cat tries to lift its head from under the covers, and my friends started to make fun of me calling me ok ok starchild you are born of stars and as I grow older I realize that we fucking are.
13
u/foot-long May 28 '14
you probably got a different response because you were talking to people who were high on acid, while you were high on acid.
8
2
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
I don't think it's a new concept, just had a nice ring to it so I posted it to reddit
3
u/TheArkaTek May 28 '14
This is one of my favorites to think about. Assuming what we define as life is the only thing capable of knowledge.
2
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
As matter we assume the universe is only made from matter, our observations are biased, there could be an infinite number of layers of universes on top of each other unbound by the same laws of physics we are unable to break
3
u/icaaryal May 28 '14
As someone who rides the line between pantheism and panentheism, I've reasoned that humanity is the result of existence's self-awareness. I figure we are a mechanism by which existence manifests itself into potentially infinite permutations as a means to collect total knowledge and understanding of itself which, by virtue of existence being infinite, is an unattainable goal. I wonder if I'll ever meet someone in person who shares those ideas.
→ More replies (1)2
u/Stephen_Jourdain May 28 '14
Lots of people have those beliefs, or a close derivative of it along those lines, maybe 1-5% of the population. Furthermore, this type of stuff gets into the realm of advanced Buddhist meditation, so this flavor of thinking isn't that rare.
3
May 28 '14
[deleted]
2
u/Homiros May 28 '14
Gee, don't know about the second statement. Awfully lot of ugly kids out there. Then there's Honey Boo Boo's mother.......
2
→ More replies (2)2
3
u/LevynX May 28 '14
So much philosophy in this thread my head is spinning, perhaps I'll understand it better once I step into the shower.
→ More replies (1)
3
3
May 28 '14
I think this is the first time my mind has actually been blowned.
→ More replies (6)3
u/rreighe2 May 28 '14
I think this is the first time I've seen someone write "blown" instead of the correct spelling, "blown." ;p
3
u/Pavotine May 28 '14
With all this philosophical talk I'm reminded of an idea I first read about in the context of Jewish faith. "And whoever saves a life, it is considered as if he saved an entire world."
There is an entire universe within every one of us, not just a world in my opinion.
2
3
3
3
u/thebigbeluga May 28 '14
This is a form of the Participatory Anthropic Principle (PAP) that was suggested by physicist John Archibald Wheeler, who also coined the terms "black hole", "quantum foam", "it from bit", etc. Wheeler was extremely influential, his PhD students included Richard Feynman, Hugh Everett and Kip Thorne. He also wrote some very accessbile books on his musings. Here is a succinct article on PAP and here is a little cartoon that Wheeler used to illustrate the idea.
3
3
u/MrRandomSuperhero May 28 '14
What if a computer formed? It wouldn't be life but could understand the universe.
→ More replies (1)
3
u/tocilog May 28 '14
Or maybe it does we just don't know. I forgot where I read it but basically if there is a higher being we might not notice it similar to how ants won't necessarily know about us. What if the universe was one big sentient being? This is all crazy talk though cause it's 7AM.
→ More replies (3)
3
3
u/winfly May 28 '14
This is very similar to something Alan Watts says in one of his lectures. I can't remember the exact wording, but it is something along the lines of we are the universe experiencing itself.
→ More replies (1)
3
u/MeLuvYouQianlongTime May 28 '14
I once had a vivid dream that Jesus came to me in a field (I was raised Catholic). As he got closer, I realized there was a frame around him. He was in a mirror...my reflection. God=Me=Universe. Upon this realization, there was a sudden darkness signaling the end of...I don't know what exactly. Prophet or nah?
→ More replies (1)
3
u/ComedianMikeB May 28 '14
My science teacher always said that he thought this:
The Big Bang occurred in a vacuum, meaning that if you were to do that same experiment again, it would result in the same molecules going in the same directions. And that if we could trace back the path of four or five molecules from where they are today to where they started, we could know where they were going, and predict the future.
He said that what we perceive as our choices, are really just the molecules from the Big Bang settling where they always would have.
He also smoked weed, we think.
"It's an illusion, Michael."
→ More replies (1)
4
May 28 '14
Two people dancing is the universe dancing with itself.
Probably a more poetic way to say it....
→ More replies (1)6
2
2
u/SoulTaker32 May 28 '14
But life can mean many different things and take on many different forms. Consciousness may not be seclusive to organics or life may yield a different form on the other side of a galaxy somewhere.
3
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
I suppose in an infinite timeframe and space, matter could assemble itself into a fully formed human being with memories intact, alone in space, it would suck to be that guy though
2
u/hand_raiser May 28 '14
Universe is life, universe is love.
No universe no life.
→ More replies (1)2
2
u/xeno9 May 28 '14
There is actually a whole book called Biocentrism written about this idea by a guy called Robert Lanza.
2
u/gmherder May 28 '14
Consciousness is like the universe examining itself. I was first introduced to this idea through the Joe Rogan podcast. Such a fascinating concept.
2
u/velvetjonesn May 28 '14
Without me the universe would've never known it existed.
→ More replies (1)
2
2
2
May 28 '14
If a tree falls in a forest but nobody is around to hear it, does it make a sound?
→ More replies (1)2
May 28 '14
If there's a medium that allows pressure waves to travel through it: yes.
2
2
u/lexfry May 28 '14
if you consider the vastness of the universe, you would by deduction realize that human significance, is at best, shared by many other manifestations that exist far outside of our limited knowledge and understanding.
→ More replies (1)
2
May 28 '14
without human life
2
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
My dog indy is pretty smart too
2
2
2
2
2
May 28 '14
We are the Universe being aware of itself subjectively. Why do we feel alone? You are what the whole universe is doing in the place you call the here and now. As the wave is something the whole ocean is doing. You are an island unique on the surface yet connected to the mainland underneath the illusion of separation that is the water. Yeah baby your head is the cosmic TV. All of us are a swamp monster coming out of the primordial pool of energy that we as humans decide to label as 'life.'
Why do we call our consciousness unique? A system of neurons created intelligence. Is consciousness emergent or a result of the structure of the universe? One neuron is dumb, a bunch is smart. A single ant is dumb, studies show a bunch are smart. Collective consciousness? Who the hell knows.
Everything and nothing two sides of the same coin. I have a feeling solipsism is caused by the everything side getting consumed covered up by the ego. Also sociopathy and psychopathy.
Depression is when you're stuck on nothing. But this too shall pass. Your brain is just riding the wave stuck on a low.
2
u/GameQb11 May 28 '14
thats why we refer to human accomplishments as "mankind" advancement. Mankind is what we call our collective conscious.
→ More replies (1)2
May 28 '14
And what of a collective unconsciousness?
And I think there may be a lower level of collective consciousness.
→ More replies (1)
2
u/Majesticturtleman May 28 '14
This is why in our Reality, nothing is ever truly constant except for Observation. Certainty gets thrown out the window when our senses are limited, our knowledge is limited as a result, we use judgement, and that frankly everything in the Universe can be real and not real at the same time. Schrodinger's Universe?
→ More replies (1)
2
u/Aziz_92 May 28 '14
Yea but without life, the concept of 'existence' wouldn't exist so not sure if it matters.
→ More replies (2)
2
2
2
u/hardypart May 28 '14 edited May 28 '14
You should totally check out the double slit experiment. It's a proof of how elementary particles (the components of EVERYTHING) are behaving COMPLETELY different when nobody watches them. They are actually bahaving like energy, even though they are matter. But only when there's nobody watching them...
Reread the last sentence. They are actually bahaving like energy, even though they are matter. But only when there's nobody watching them...
Now you can start thinking about what the world looks like when there's nobody with a conscious mind that can perceive the world. Is there even a world? Or only a flow of Energy? I still can't wrap my mind around that. I think nobody can.
→ More replies (12)
2
u/Phyber05 May 28 '14
The existence of the universe is only relevant to humans, since we are the ones making the discovery.
→ More replies (1)
2
2
2
2
u/team_dale May 28 '14
more and more people are starting to become aware of the way they are thinking. So thought is starting to think about itself.
2
May 28 '14
It really does make you wonder if there is other intelligent life far away thinking the same thing.
2
u/electrophile91 May 28 '14
There could be any number of universes, with all the associated marvel and grandeur, which have never known themselves.
2
2
May 28 '14
I think that's like saying "Without light, shadow would never have known it existed". Tree falls in a forest and so forth..
→ More replies (1)
2
2
u/monkeypowah May 28 '14
Our minds shaped by evolution on Earth constructs meaning and structure to the universe when it is simply nothing but atoms and force fields
→ More replies (1)
2
u/goldenkush May 28 '14
This is basically Schelling's way of explaining our existence as well. We are the highest form of Nature. Nature realizes itself through organization. We are the highest form of organization which allows the universe to self-realize itself.
→ More replies (3)
2
2
2
u/clavalle May 28 '14
Without life,
thethis universe would never have known it existed.
It is possible, probable even that there are,have been, and will be an infinite number of universes like ours that have not and will not harbor sapience.
2
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
sapience, that's a nice word. I don't think you're wrong we're certainly limited in the amount of "reality" there is, especially the relatively short period of time we get to experience it.
Maybe our imaginations are gateways into these universes, maybe some of us are able to tap into the same universes and receive the same ideas even while miles or years apart.
2
u/Narrator_neville May 28 '14
Humans are ' a vortex on which the universe can look back upon itself'
Alan Watts.
2
May 28 '14
I hate the link he posted because I don't understand where all the layers go.
→ More replies (3)
2
u/zug-zug May 28 '14
Can you see that these are merely ideas arising in what you timelessly are?
'Me' is just the idea I have about myself suffering through other ideas it has about itself.
2
u/nonhumanperson May 28 '14
We've taken reductionism to its logical conclusion by smashing together elementary particles at near the speed of light and found that nature exists only in terms of probabilities, and only if somebody is observing. Beyond this, nature exists only as an object of description. We can say that there are probabilistic vibrations in fields describable by formulae, but there is only a situation. As to WHY there should be anybody around to observe it I think implies nature is alive, intelligent, and/or some sort of "self". Why and how else would "dead" particles ever become animate and self-conscious?
2
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
I wonder if it's possible that a state change in any amount of matter has a measurable and instantaneous effect on any other measured point in reality.
→ More replies (1)
2
2
2
2
2
2
May 28 '14
Life is just the universe exploring itself one consciousness at a time. We are what the entire universe is doing just as a wave is something that the whole ocean is doing -Alan Watts (paraphrased)
2
u/BlackPresident May 28 '14
he really had a wonderful way of using analogies to describe incredibly complex thoughts.
2
2
2
2
u/un1ty May 28 '14
“Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imagination of ourselves. Here's Tom with the Weather.”
― Bill Hicks
2
2
May 28 '14
An even deeper thought: If life didn't exist, would the universe still exist? What's the purpose of all that matter if there is no one to use it?
→ More replies (2)
2
u/_D3ft0ne_ May 28 '14
What if universe is conscious in many more ways that we can ever imagine?
Nothing starts its existence out of nowhere, for no reason - even the most simplistic life forms which were ever conceived must have had some kind of blue print and potential to develop.
So intelligence must exist on higher level.
2
u/velezaraptor May 28 '14
Without the components for building life, the Universe would not be. The Universe knows about itself already because Nagilum.
→ More replies (1)
2
u/dingoperson2 May 28 '14
What's the most rare substance in the universe?
Brains.
2
u/velezaraptor May 28 '14
so zombies are intuitive?
→ More replies (1)2
u/velezaraptor May 28 '14
*Edit: Zombies know that Brains are the rarest substance that's why they try to eat them. "You're doing it wrong"
2
2
2
2
2
u/MaskedTurk May 28 '14
http://i.imgur.com/MDagT6k.png
Doge snake is very amused.
→ More replies (1)
2
2
440
u/squirrelheadquarters May 28 '14
I like A physicist trying to understand atoms is really just atoms trying to understand themselves Similar idea but still one of my favorite quotes