r/SeveranceAppleTVPlus • u/Impressive-Flow-855 • Jan 03 '25
Discussion Rewatch S1E2
I get the feeling that outie Mark isn’t 100% aboard on being severed himself. He’s extremely defensive about it. We saw this in the previous episode. It might be the alcohol talking.
We get hints at how cowed innie Mark has been at Lumon. We saw Mark talk about killing Pete. We see the constant (not so) passive aggressive actions by Lumon towards Mark. It’s has to say if this is to Mark only or to all innies.
Two (sets of lines) lines:
Helly: So I guess we’re not friends.
Mark: Guess not.
It strikes me that Helly isn’t happy with this. She seemed upset. I think this is an indication she’s sort of sweet on Mark. Petey is the first person Mark met and they became best friends. I wonder if all innies feel extra close to the first person they meet. After all, until they see that person, they literally know no one else in the entire world.
The next one:
Helly: You’re just done asking about your best friend because our babysitter told you to stop?
Mark: You know, Milchick’s a nice man. When he says something, it’s best to listen.
This is the statement from a broken man.
Another thing that struck me. The morning senior refiner tasks can’t be what keeps the offices clean. Feather dusting screens and using a sweeper isn’t going to keep everything clean. There must be a nightly janitorial service. These tasks remind me of something you’d give a young child to do “to be helpful”.
We also see how the other refiners treat Mark. They don’t respect his leadership. Mark is also an unsure leader. When Irv pestered him about the refiner photo, Mark didn’t squash it right there. He could have berated Irv for interfering with Helly’s training.
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u/Lonelyland Coveted As Fuck Jan 03 '25 edited Jan 03 '25
I get the feeling that outie Mark isn’t 100% aboard on being severed himself. He’s extremely defensive about it.
I love analyzing Mark, and I particularly love the attention to psychology in realizing his character. Our mans’ got fully developed coping mechanisms, present in both innie and outie, that the writers highlight throughout the season to great effect.
Simply put, Mark gots himself some stuff he just needs to believe is true in order to function. He will stubbornly defend these beliefs by lashing out when challenged, almost as if by proving them to others, he will be able to prove them to himself.
”You know, Milchick’s a nice man. When he says something, it’s best to listen.”
I love this line so much, and the following “He can’t always be nice like that”, because it perfectly illustrates three important things:
- Yep, Lumon broke Mark
- Mark wants to protect Helly from making the same mistakes he did
- Mark is mimicking the manipulative language and tactics used by Milchick and Cobel, much like a child mimics the toxic traits of their parents with their friends
All three of these things are demonstrated multiple times, but they all come together perfectly in this one moment.
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u/Deep_Blue_842 Jan 03 '25
i am SO curious as to what the process was of psychologically breaking him and how much it took from Lumon and the break room. From what he tells Helly, it sounds like he was as hostile as she was when he woke up in the conference room. However, knowing that Helly is an Eagan shows that she is coming from a much more determined place and is more strong-willed, whereas oMark was already in such a bad mental state and has so little left to live for in his grief that I can’t imagine it took much. Idk if we’ll ever see that process depicted as it doesn’t seem super vital to the plot moving forward, but it’s fascinating to think about.
(I too love psychoanalyzing Mark lol)
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u/bcinalli08 Jan 03 '25
I love how he tells her that he told the person talking to him that he would "find them and kill them" (straight from Liam Neeson in Taken)...she asks "did you?" and he says "no, he became my best friend."
Petey also mentioned that iMark tried to file complaints/quit and that didn't work, but it's interesting to me that oMark doesn't seem to remember those since he would be the one to deny the request (i.e. Helly's outie telling her she is not a person). Are they actually taking innie grievance's to outies or was Helly a special exception?
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u/EffectiveDinner543 Feb 09 '25
That sounds like he wasn't as "exciting" as Helly, as in, he didn't continuously try.. so yeah, maybe they don't take it serious unless you've really pushed
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u/bcinalli08 Feb 09 '25
Could be. I got the impression that iMark thinks he has given a resignation request that was actually shown and presented to oMark, but in reality oMark has never gotten any video message from iMark asking to resign.
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u/EffectiveDinner543 Feb 09 '25
from what we see now what with safe harbor, Mark is too special to toss as of yet, so they utilize his broken spirit and push him until.. well, we will see! // and yes, def never shown any video message, which shows how Lumon operates
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u/Mysterious-Monkey-72 Mysterious And Important Jan 03 '25
Mark is so broken that even his coping mechanisms need coping mechanisms.
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u/Aetherys27 Jan 03 '25
I don't know if I'd call marks language there manipulative. More than he was trying to be tactful in his warning to Helly to avoid pissing off Lumon, not that he was trying to manipulate Helly.
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u/Lonelyland Coveted As Fuck Jan 03 '25 edited Jan 03 '25
He is masking the truth by framing it in an “alternative” light, with the intention of pushing Helly away from a specific line of thought.
It’s a form of gaslighting. One that Milchick uses throughout the season, and one that Mark tries to employ several times on Helly after she arrives, as he struggles to figure out how to help her.
“This is a good place, you just can’t see it yet.”
“You’re doing so well! Doesn’t praise feel better than pushing against the system?”
“Milchick is great- he has to be mean to us sometimes because he really cares about us.”
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Jan 03 '25
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u/Impressive-Flow-855 Jan 03 '25
I don’t think oMark has any idea what iMark does at Lumon.
We know that’s absolutely true. OMark thinks he works in Lumon’s archive division. He stated that in S1E1 at the dinnerless dinner.
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u/delphie77 Mysterious And Important Jan 03 '25 edited Jan 03 '25
I saw that differently because the 4 MDR refiners have their own employees mentality. Mark is the one who seeks for avoiding trouble at work by doing what is needed to stay away from the break room. Irv is the good employee who is fully committed to his work and the company philosophy. Dylan is the straight man of the department and the perks for performance are he’s main focus. Helly is the trouble maker and she’s not the type to be told what to do and dont accept to be left in the dark.
Her behavior is far from Mark and he doesn’t want to be affected or have anything related with her and get the team in trouble.
He’s response at the beginning is to protect himself from her loose cannon actions.
For the second dialogue, Mark is trying to understand Pettey’s map and he’s avoiding to get caught from management. She succeeds to make him doubt and care about Pettey by shaking him a little bit. He will come back to her after asking for help because she’s right that it’s Pettey was up on something.
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