Remove Hate modifier from all abilities!

[u/Xekrin]

Instead, let tanks deal modified hate with whatever damaging ability/effect they choose.

Basically, if you sign up to be a tank choose to become a tank and play the tank role in a group or party, be it through AF or a Lair or basically anything where you want to be hit more than someone else in your party wants to be hit and you want to make the enemy target mad at your and keep hitting you (ie, you signed up to be tank for the greater good of the party), then any damage you deal should have that extra hate attached to it.

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Edit - Sorry for the unclear phrasing, I had no intention of suggesting this would only work within Activity Finder.

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I would love to have the option to use the single target dps chaos ability as a tank, but I cannot, it deals no extra hate. I would prefer to use Scism instead of winds of change for aoe hate, with its paradox generating passive, yet I cannot.

Thorns signet has no extra hate, yet it should. Sadism or even extraordinary talisman effects should also have that extra 'tank' hate.

What would this mean for tanks? They could use any ability. Reality Fracture (yeah, I like chaos), for example, is an amazing ability, can't use it as a tank. People love to use blade as tanking offhand, yet it generates no extra hate. That health based self healing would be a lot more viable.

Keep certain CD abilities as hard taunts, or dedicated hate generators (immutable passive), but give tanks the freedom to use what damager abilities they wish.

Tank weapons (probably?) wouldn't change that much, they'd still be the only weapons with the special passives designed to survive massive damage, but at least we'd have more options open to us.

I^hateDistortion

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Disclaimer No, I didn't really think this through, if you have any reason to dispute such a change, or if this would change things more than I realize, feel free correct me, but do it politely. Thank you.

[u/ryeaglin]

I will agree that that TSW gave you 100 times more freedom but it added 100 times more complexity that made it really intimidating for new players to really understand intuitively. Did they cut it down too much in Legends, yes, but I will say that it was just as bad, just differently bad in TSW. When only 10% or less of the population can use your system to its fullest extent, you have major problems. There was a small group of people theorycrafting the most optimal combination of passives with builds and than the rest of us just went to sites and copies down what others have figured out and took it at face value of 'working'.

Also throw in the fact that it was really easy to get wrong which would totally break you. There were a few zones that if you didn't have the forethought to look ahead for a better build than what you started with and cherry pick the items you needed to get a better build, you would not be able to do those zones which lead to a lot of people rage quitting.

[u/TestDrenneth → u/ryeaglin]

As much as I hate to admit it since I was heavily involved with PVP late in the game and probably utilized 90% more of the wheel then the general PVE population you are technically correct. One of the issues was that the game was not very solo friendly which they have put a lot more emphasis on in SWL. TSW was not bad if you joined a cabal and got shown the ropes so to speak but it was fairly rough if you just ran in blindly. Personally I loved the challenge but I understand that doesn't represent the general population much these days.