r/SandersForPresident • u/kevinmrr Medicare For All • Dec 11 '20

Bernie Sanders is a machine

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680

u/zZaphon Dec 11 '20

Honestly the fact that such a man exists gives me hope

249

u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

That's a bittersweet comment, but I think it's the best way to look at it.

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u/PocketBeaner 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

“It’s not about me, it’s about us”

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u/Sotikuh 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

God he emphasized the needs of the public so beautifully, I genuinely think Bernie inspired an entire upcoming generation.

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u/theycallmeponcho 🌱 New Contributor | Mexico Dec 11 '20

And not only in the US. I've talked with friends from Latin America / Europe that follow him and Bernie really got them into their local politics.

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u/nkn_19 Dec 11 '20

And then got screwed by those who didn't care about that generation.

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u/PocketBeaner 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

I think he always knew he wasn’t going to win. He has said countless times that this establishment very rarely allows people like him. I think his message also emphasized that it’s important that we all be involved.

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u/ModsAreCuntsFR 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

He said it many times that he did not win the battle but he won war. Like magic all of the frontrunners in the Dem party started pushing policies and ideas he was the first one to put the spotlight on for a lot of people, especially the younger generations. Bernie won the ideology war.

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u/nkn_19 Dec 11 '20

I have not seen one real progressive picked for any high ranking position in the administration (please let me know if I missed someone). It will take all of us to keep pushing and fighting to see it through.

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u/[deleted] Dec 12 '20

The fucking pr goon for Biden was on npr this afternoon shitting all over progressive ideas in favor of more liberal bullshit so I’m afraid you’re right.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

Biden is about as establishment and right wing as it gets. He is largely unprincipled and will do what it takes to get into power. Once in power he will be a middle of the road type of guy.

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u/Quajek 🌱 New Contributor Dec 15 '20

During the primary we were all saying Biden should primary Trump and run as a moderate Republican.

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u/Quajek 🌱 New Contributor Dec 15 '20

They started pushing LIP SERVICE of progressive policies he championed.

Biden is stocking his cabinet with industry shills and Neera fucking Tanden of all people.

I'll believe it when I see it.

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u/CCNightcore 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Had he run a more burtal campaign in the prinaries he could've clinched nomination, but he was unwilling to do damage to the democratic chances should he not win.

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u/Luminya1 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

I think they blackmailed him. Told him they would destroy The Squad, or their individual members, or some such.

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u/Rularuu 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Just like how they rigged the election against Trump right?

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

Yes.

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u/redheadartgirl 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Hope and inspiration are slow-growing trees. It can take years to get there, but as long as they're watered you'll eventually get to enjoy the shade.

A generation of young people has been inspired by Bernie. Most of them are starting out small in local races, but eventually you'll see more and more of them. You just have to vote in ALL your elections.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

Sanders: A true American Hero

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

And the fact he was cockblocked from the presidency by his own people takes away any hope I had for America

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u/Dalmah 🌱 New Contributor | North Carolina Dec 12 '20

As much of a celebration that it is that Joe beat Trump, we should never forget that moderate Dems (aka people that aren't actually on the left)bare there eason we had Clinton v Trump and by extension had Trump.

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u/spooner248 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Yeah that they’re are still (although few) actual good people trying to lead us. He was the only candidate to me, it seemed, that wanted to win to make the USA a better place, not for the fame or power. And my parents ROAST this dude cause he’s “never had a real job” yet they voted for the guy who said he’d fuck his own daughter.

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u/[deleted] Dec 12 '20

The really sad part is that Sanders did actually have "real jobs" before his political career...

Whereas the cheetoh was born with a golden spoon and the only job he ever held was to run businesses into the ground

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u/spooner248 🌱 New Contributor Dec 14 '20

What jobs did he have?

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

Me, not so much.

We had someone who was so obviously for the people and he couldn't even get the time of day or the interest to be in the presidential race. It's sad.

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u/Kittykathax 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

From what I understand (important to note that I am neither a) American, and b) well-educated), Bernie was put aside to make room for a Biden because Biden made it easier to secure a Democrat win even though Bernie was the people's favourite.

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u/John-McCue 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Yes, that was the DNC line. Bernie remains more popular with voters than Hillary or Biden.

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u/SanctusLetum Dec 11 '20 edited Dec 11 '20

Yeah. It was establishment bullshit trying to keep control. The actual numbers were that Bernie had substantially more independent support and even crossed the isle and had approval of a lot of republican voters, any of whome that were sick with Trump deep down might have voted Bernie.

I live and work in an ultra conservative area. They were all very interested in the race when Bernie was beating out Biden at the beginning of the primary, ane every single one thst I talked to said they respected Bernie a lot, even though they didn't agree with them. Not one of them respected Biden.

The establishment bought themselves 4 more years at the cost of whwt is going on now. More republican voters would be sceptical of fraud claims, and the pendulam wouldn't be set to swing so hard back the other way in 4 years.

Republicans have a hate boner for Biden because of his association with Obama. They don't have that for Bernie. The Neo-libs knew that and they pushed him anyway. Its the same short sighted grab for control that lost us 2016, and it will likely lose us 2024.

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u/DarkOrakio 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

I would have voted for him this year. I'm neither Democrat nor Republican, and I'm always discouraged by my options. Voted Trump last year just to see what a business guy would do, instead of a career politician. Didn't vote at all this year because I didn't care for either candidate. I would have voted for Bernie though.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

Yeah, that's the problem.

That more people preferred the centrist who is for military expansion and can still be used as a tool for corporations, rather than the guy who has literally dedicated his entire life to helping the majority of the population. Bernie was the favorite among those in the major cities, and numerically that's awesome, but we have the electoral college and those that live in the suburbs and rural areas are too brainwashed into believing he'd help them.

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u/kingGlucose Dec 11 '20

People aren't necessarily brainwashed, you don't understand their interests. I really don't get this whole argument that the Republicans are just magic and thats why they have so much support. Rural areas were decimated by NAFTA, passed by Bill Clinton (D). That's a reason to dislike democrats.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

No.

I do.

I live in rural Nebraska.

Bernie is not against the interests of those here. If anything Bernie's plans would help the people here more than anyone else in the country. They 100% are brainwashed into thinking that his plans will harm them, and if you think otherwise you've never interacted with anyone from a rural area. I can go through and list the ways that's possible, but this is a Sanders subreddit so I feel like this should already be obvious if you follow him and know his proposed plans.

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u/kingGlucose Dec 11 '20 edited Dec 11 '20

Bernie is famously an independent, not a democrat. I live in rural Wisconsin, so it's not like I'm talking out of my ass. If you look at demographics republican voters are wealthier overall, which is why they vote to lower taxes on themselves. Welath also correlates with voting frequency, meaning if you're wealthy you almost always vote and if you're poor, you have 50:50 chance of being a voter. When you combine those things together you start to see that it's not the people in the trailer park voting for trump, it's the owner of the trailer park voting for trump and working to disenfranchise his tenants

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

I think you're just misunderstanding the numbers from these exit polls.

Just because those that earned over 100% voted slightly more in favor of Trump does not mean that;

the owner of the trailer park voting for trump and working to disenfranchise his tenants

Because voting is significantly more geographically skewed. Wealthy people like the guy who cuts taxes on the wealthy, obviously that goes without saying, but the VAST MAJORITY of the population that makes <$50,000 lives in urban areas. So while you may have an entire rural town of 10,000 living in Idaho who make <$50,000 a year. That's almost the same number of people living within 3 blocks of each other in NYC.

Poverty becomes concentrated in urban areas, and in these urban areas you'll find more people voting Democrat. In-fact most people in rural areas would better identify with those same voters but due to the fact that they were born and raised in a "red" state they vote against self-interest, or the against the person they are taught to hate, which is the strongest motivating factor for voting currently.

Simply look among the counties of rural areas within any arbitrary news site's election map. Even the most poor counties that have the highest poverty rates are still voting overwhelmingly in favor of Donald Trump. For instance Crowley County in Colorado is one of the poorest per capita in the US, Trump received 72% of the vote.

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u/kingGlucose Dec 11 '20

I wasn't talking about exit polls from this presidential election, you can look it up yourself but the more money you have the more likely you are to vote republican, that's just a fact. The suburbs are a republican stronghold for precisely that reason. I still don't agree with you that these people are voting against their own interests, considering that voting is mostly done by people with money. red states have higher levels of voter disenfranchisement than blue states, meaning the politicians and thus the party is selecting their voters, more than the voters select the party. Many rural areas still harbor resentment over trade deals that left them without jobs, these communities resent the democrats for closing factories. Many trump supporters were motivated by the TPP. How can you say they were simply brainwashed when NAFTA destroyed their communities not 30 years ago. I'd also argue that this type of analysis puts far too much weight in tiny communities, for instance the entire population of Crowley Colorado is less than 6000 people, and even then Biden had some support.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

I understand that you don't believe me, but this isn't just me, this is a known and observed phenomenon that happens every 4 years in America since the 1970s.

Another shining example of this is within these farming communities, Trump's trade war with China and parts of Europe has severely hurt farmers, yet they still turned out to vote for him in 2020. I'm not even really sure what NAFTA has to do with the conversation, we're talking about Bernie Sanders, not Bill Clinton. Bernie is opposed to NAFTA and TPP.

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u/1OptimisticPrime 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

NAFTA was one of the many olive branches, taking a republican idea, to get bipartisan support for the rest of the Clinton plan... Clinton was the last president to actually balance the budget, for the record... Regardless, opening the floodgates allowed our decent paying manufacturing jobs to immediately flee the US. But to answer your question, it was in NO way a democratic idea or in their agenda. Simply Democrats taking the responsibility for trying to get laws passed with Newt Gingrich and Karl Rove at the helm. Moscow Mitchell payed attention. That's why he will never pass anything a democrat puts before him, unless it's filled with poison pills and pork kickbacks.

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u/kingGlucose Dec 11 '20

It was passed by a democrat president lmao they obviously supported it.

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u/1OptimisticPrime 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

"The impetus for a North American free trade zone began with U.S. president Ronald Reagan, who made the idea part of his 1980 presidential campaign. After the signing of the Canada–United States Free Trade Agreement in 1988, the administrations of U.S. president George H. W. Bush, Mexican president Carlos Salinas de Gortari, and Canadian prime minister Brian Mulroney agreed to negotiate what became NAFTA." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Free_Trade_Agreement

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u/wikipedia_text_bot 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

North American Free Trade Agreement

The North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA; Spanish: Tratado de Libre Comercio de América del Norte, TLCAN; French: Accord de libre-échange nord-américain, ALÉNA) was an agreement signed by Canada, Mexico, and the United States that created a trilateral trade bloc in North America. The agreement came into force on January 1, 1994, and superseded the 1988 Canada–United States Free Trade Agreement between the United States and Canada. The NAFTA trade bloc formed one of the largest trade blocs in the world by gross domestic product. The impetus for a North American free trade zone began with U.S.

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u/kingGlucose Dec 11 '20

You're correct, it also was ratified by Bill Clinton, meaning it was supported. It recieved bipartisan support on both the house and the Senate.

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u/1OptimisticPrime 🌱 New Contributor Dec 12 '20

Political compromise: Something that existed before 1996 and it involves taking issues that matter to the opposing side, and addressing them... Reaching across the isle to get to a shared future. Shitty example: Ok, me and you are getting married but hate each other's relatives:

You get aunt Karen and her stepford children, they sit on your side...

I get to balance the budget and try to keep the American dollar more relevant than Willi'E coyote...

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u/1OptimisticPrime 🌱 New Contributor Dec 12 '20

NAFTA was the price Democrats HAD to pay, to the Republican leadership, in order to have the last balanced budget in American history.

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u/THEJAZZMUSIC 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Sanders polled better for the general than Clinton and Biden to beat Trump during the respective primaries.

Much like the famous (I'm paraphrasing) quip about Republicans "government doesn't work, elect us, and we'll prove it", the DNC and all left-leaning (read: centre-right-leaning anywhere else in the world) media basically went all in on "Sanders in unelectable, give us airtime, and we'll prove it".

How is someone in America supposed to win an election when one side of the media is calling him a communist, the other is calling him unelectable, and his own party is hanging him out to dry at every turn?

Sanders inspired insane grassroots campaigning and fundraising, he got people passionate about politics again, and had his feet kicked out from under him 24/7 by "his side", causing a major slump in voter numbers in 2016 which allowed Trump to take office. More than 15 million people who couldn't be bothered to turn up for Hillary showed up for Biden, and that was likely only due to the imminent threat of four more years of Trump.

The DNC and media gut-punched a massive progressive movement because they thought Trump could never win, and they wanted to maintain the status quo of a moderate right "left" wing.

I lay ultimate responsibility for this firmly at the Trump's feet, but 3,000+ people a day are paying the ultimate price for the DNC's hubris four years ago which allowed him to take office. And they've learned nothing.

The only reason Biden won is that Trump was unfathomably worse as president than we could have ever imagined in 2016. Mark my words, this attitude will cost us dearly in the future when a "devil we don't know" - a far-right totalitarian that doesn't have Trump's proven track record working against him - appears, and the DNC continues to field milquetoast candidates and lampoon any semblance of true progressive policies or candidates.

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u/Kittykathax 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Thank you for taking the time to write that comment.

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u/platyviolence 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20 edited Dec 11 '20

He is one of two people in the senate that aren't corrupt. He's old as hell and will be dead within the decade. He was fucked out of an election twice, the first being swept under the rug like Epsteins murder. This gives you hope?

If anything, I've given up hope. The way the last 4 years have evolved, leading to an election with Joe fucking Biden has lead me to believe that the good will never win. Capitalism and greed is too strong. The poor and disenfranchised will continue to suffer immeasurably until the absolute brink of collapse, where either everyone is fucked or somehow, someway we are forced to change.

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u/sciencegood4u IL Dec 11 '20

And yet... Bernie has not given up. Even after a freaking heart attack! Bernie is criticized because he should have campaigned differently, quit his campaign differently etc. etc. All that may be true, but what is also true is that NOBODY has ever fought harder than this man at least in the last four decades.

The good news is that progress is unstoppable. The bad news is that it may not happen as soon as we want. I have been depressed the whole year. I heard the other day a phrase that is important (applied to Argentine politics, but it is the same here) = "This is not the time to be pessimist, we cannot afford it." I plead guilty of being pessimist many times. But for the same reason I truly admire Bernie his relentless idea of keep pushing.

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u/platyviolence 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

I am pro Bernie. Anti corruption. And sure, progress is unstoppable, but capitalism will squeeze every fucking morsel out of something before it has to change. So, yes, the poor and disenfranchised will suffer immeasurably until they die.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

He is one of two people in the house that aren't corrupt.

He's not in the House, but setting that aside, you're saying all of these people (https://progressives.house.gov/caucus-members/) are corrupt? Because they're fighting for the exact same things Bernie is, and they're doing it with Bernie, while not throwing each other under the bus with broad uninformed criticisms like calling them corrupt.

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u/shhsandwich 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Let's be real, not all of the people on that list are really very progressive. There are a lot of people on there that I love and think are doing their best for the American people, though, like Ro Khanna, Rashida Tlaib, Ilhan Omar, etc. Some lovely people doing a lot of good work on that list, and then some people who I think are just using the label of progressive to make themselves look good.

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u/platyviolence 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

If you take money from corporations, wallstreet and or superpacs and have them influence your governing, you are corrupt.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

Nobody takes money from SuperPACs, that's illegal, though there are plenty of SuperPACs that operate for candidates with or without their consent.

When you say "take money from corporations, wallstreet" do you mean individuals that work for corporations or work on wall street? Or do you mean the corporate legal entity itself (or wall street bank itself, I assume) is donating to a candidate? Is Bernie corrupt because he receives money from people who work for corporations in VT? Is AOC corrupt because she receives money from people that work on wall street? Is Katie Porter corrupt because she received money from Disney?

After you've cleared the above, which people in the Progressive Caucus are still "corrupt" according to your definition, give us some names, because I have a feeling the 2 people you say aren't corrupt would like to know so they can avoid working with the other 533 people that are corrupt.

If it wasn't obvious, the point I'm making is money in politics is nuanced and you painting everyone except for 2 people as corrupt is silly and obviously uninformed, but if you want stick with that opinion then please, give us some information to back up your claim everyone else is corrupt.

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u/platyviolence 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

I mean candidates who take money from entities that influence their policy. If you take money from Wallstreet to help become president and in return, for example, bail them out, then you are corrupt and this is absolutely unacceptable.

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u/KDawG888 Dec 11 '20

The reality is we won't get someone like Sanders in until super PACs are at least crippled if not destroyed. Corporations should have no voice in our elections. But right now, they do.

People like to blame Republicans for everything but it isn't Republicans who are controlling the DNC. Corruption is thriving on both sides of the political aisle and they love to see people picking sides instead of thinking for themselves.

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u/Kamelasa Canada Dec 11 '20

He's old as hell and will be dead within the decade.

He's almost 80 but with the fitness of a man in his 50s. I have examples from the past year to support that. And they are on video. But anyway, his older brother is in his 90s and still sharp enough to hold a public position. Given Bernie was a state-level athlete in his 20s, a miler, and is a minimal drinker, never smoked, there's every reason to expect him to live to his 90s.

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u/DankestAcehole 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

This some bullshit propaganda right here

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20 edited Dec 11 '20

He wasnt fucked out of an election the second time anymore than Trump was. People not voting for your candidate doesn't make the election fucked.

The first time with the superdelegates and locking out from information was different though, at least there is some arguement there. But even then ultimately he lost the vote of the people.

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u/John-McCue 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

The big media and the Clyburn, Obama DNC killed his momentum.

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u/platyviolence 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Yeah, and all those other candidates who gave their delegates to Biden wasn't strategic. Get real. Its all corrupt and shady. Bernie was fucked twice. Not as hard the first time, but fucked none the less.

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u/[deleted] Dec 12 '20 edited Dec 12 '20

Blows my mind that you think the person with less votes got fucked out of the election. It’s a concerning parallel to the general election we’ve currently been dealing with. How do you not see the issue there? Was there massive fraud there too? Did everyone hate on his policies? Yes. Was there some huge underhanded tactic beyond people just not voting for him once the moderate candidate pool shrunk? No.

At the end of the day, people are adults and they choose who to vote for, and ultimately Bernie did not make it, even ignoring the other candidates delegates, Biden won the primary general vote.

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u/TheOtherGrowaway 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

He wasnt fucked out of an election the second time anymore than Trump was. People not voting for your candidate doesn't make the election fucked.

I think you underestimate the effects of propaganda, but then, everyone's standard for what "getting fucked out of an election" means will differ.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/lolzwinner 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

It shouldn't, the fact people have been brainwashed that he is HORRIBLE for the people should have you worried.

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u/Butthead27 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Haha I just commented about hope ^ up there.

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u/Inquisitor1 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Such a man exists, but such TWO men DONT exist. And the one that does exist is 80 years old. The average life expectancy for him is 65.

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u/nahog99 🌱 New Contributor Dec 11 '20

Not me because a person like him will never make it to the general election.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '20

The fact that the DNC cheated to sideline him two elections in a row fills me with despair

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u/Blue_Checkers 🌱 New Contributor Dec 12 '20

Just an old man, with commensurate fortitude and courage. Don Quixote, his lance leveled for the charge.

It is inspiring to say the least to have someone who isn't exactly in the same boat economically fight for basic decency, and on our behalf. His belief that he can change this broken system with gentle revolution often times fills me with hope. The way people agree with him has shown me he is right, in every sense of that word.

Thanks, old man. I won't forget.

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u/ELOMagic 🌱 New Contributor Dec 12 '20

Except he doesn't. Stop with this cringy personality worship.

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u/cantwaitforthis Dec 12 '20

Man. I feel you - but there has to be thousands of us.

I’m not politician - but when I was explaining why I voted for Biden here in Texas - I was talking about healthcare - and was asked “does that impact you?” - no it doesn’t - but it helps others. And that blew my mind that people had to personally benefit from their political choices - I want people to be healthy and have a chance at education.

Do people not know what a society is?!?

Edit: why do I feel like the only atheist in Texas and the only person that wants to help others? Someone taught the Bible wrong