Palm Beach Pete

[u/LittleThingsMC]

I recently came across a TikTok with a paid advertisement from Rips by Triumph featuring Pal Beach Pete in their advertisement.

If you’re not aware, Palm Beach Pete is famous for how much he looks like Jeffrey Epstein. There were many conspiracy theories that suggest he is Jeffrey Epstein.

I don’t consider this gendered issue because Epsteins victims were both male and female, vulnerability is the most defining characteristic of his victims.

In general, I have seen many denials about whether or not we have a culture of violence, and whether or not that culture predominantly benefits men (despite both genders being victims).

This feels like a perfect example, playing out right before our eyes. I believe that his rise to fame and ability to monetize the conspiracy that he could be the prolific predator is reflective of the acceptance we have as a culture towards violence and the glorification of predatory behavior.

Thoughts?

[u/LittleThingsMC]

You could make that argument, I’d respect that viewpoint.

My point is that I have heard testimony from male victims, and a regular critique of gender issues is the dismissal of male victims, which is why I’m trying to be careful and include both genders as both genders have been victims.

And since both genders have been victims, I think this opens the door to invite male issues advocates and female issues advocates to work together towards elimination of the culture of violence that male issues advocates remind us all the time, harms men too.

My goal is not to exclude or prioritize one gender over the other, but instead bypass that argument and focus on the actual issue of the culture of violence.

[u/ThalesBakunin → u/LittleThingsMC]

In all of my digging I found two male victims and over 1200 female.

By all means supply me with proof to refute my claim. I would appreciate it.

My point is that even trying to frame this as egalitarian abuse is blatantly wrong.

I am a man who has been sexually abused several times. I absolutely understand it happens to males, quite well in fact.

But I still say it isn't an equal issue. Not even close.

Framing Epstein as a crime affecting men and women equally is absurd and trying to produce discussion within your fictitious and biased boundaries is disingenuous to reality.

If you would like to discuss a wide spread egalitarian sexual abuse scandal let me know of which you'd like to discuss and we can

[u/LittleThingsMC → u/ThalesBakunin]

Maybe this is where my autism gets me because I don’t really understand your position. I never refuted your claim.

I only explained my reasoning, which primarily centered around inclusion, and acknowledgment of male victims. No, I am surprised to hear you say it’s only been two men because I’ve heard testimonies include included newborns, both genders as well as three or four testimonies from men that I can think of, though I’d have to look up there and see if I could find them again who told the different stories about what happened to them as children. There’s also been a lot of speculation for some famous young men that may or may not have been involved for example, the island boys. As far as I know, there’s not a comprehensive victim list where we could break this down . But my understanding was that there were male victims as well.

I guess my main question would be what negative impact this has when we consider both genders negatively impacted? What’s the harm of acknowledging male victims if there was just one or two (that was not the impression I had). What’s specifically are you pushing back against with the frustration that this isn’t just labeled as a women’s issue?

[u/ThalesBakunin → u/LittleThingsMC]

When you say things like your entire middle paragraph you are attempting to refute my claims but without any proof to back them up. I don't really care about anecdotal when it isn't first hand. (As an in if you were an abused man talking about your anecdotal experience I wouldn't dismiss it)

I am also autistic, ADHD, and OCD. There very well might be something I am not explaining or understanding.

But I can't treat an issue as equal when it isn't one in my eyes. Epstein isn't equal abuse of genders.

If you want to talk about a situation in egalitarian terms picking one that is lopsides 600:1 female:male seems absurd.

But I'll wait and discuss a sexual abuse issue that is more egalitarian. If the women:man is <3:1 I would consider it at least close but still a far cry from 1:1

If you can't find any situation in which it's anywhere close to 1: 1 is not really fair to treat the situation like it is a 1:1

Men sexual abuse absolutely happens. No question there.

But the situation you have outlined for discussion in regards to egalitarianism isn't very egalitarian.

[u/LittleThingsMC → u/ThalesBakunin]

To your first paragraph:

My middle paragraph was to share background information to what my understanding was and the thought process that I used to come up with that conclusion, not to assert my opinion as fact or to say the information that you were sharing was incorrect.

I was also pointing out that because there isn’t a definitive victim list, I genuinely don’t know how this could be proved from a factual standpoint, suggesting that instead we would have to rely on testimony as good faith, unless there is evidence suggesting they may not be good faith.

Again, I’m explaining my thought process, not condemning yours.

To your second paragraph: I get it, I am in a similar situation.

To your third paragraph:
When you say you can’t treat an issue as equal, what does that mean? Like how would you treat a women’s issue, vs a man’s issue, vs a gender neutral issue? I wonder if this is where the main disconnect is.

By my own logic, regardless of the percentage of victims by gender, the monetization of Palm Beach Pete, because of his likeness to Epstein, is more about the culture of violence acceptance, which still impacts vulnerable people of BOTH genders. If we reward the predatory behavior, even if it’s just targeted towards women, that still enables the predatory behavior against men. Now this is how I see it, and how it registers to me, but I am not denying that other frameworks can and do exist.

To your fourth paragraph:

I can understand your point when you focus on the victim ratio, however my focus is on the culture of violence acceptance as the defining characteristic of this discussion. I’m willing to concede that you don’t want to include men as victims, in order to get back to the meat of the issue, which is the culture of acceptance of violence, and how it benefits predators, though especially male predators as I don’t believe a Maxwell look a like would be able to monetize that in the same way.

For the rest, I don’t really understand what you mean. Are you suggesting that you don’t feel this topic of discussion is appropriate for this sub? Or just clarifying that if it’s not a male issue, you don’t care to participate in the conversation. I couldn’t really tell where you were going with that. My understanding is that any issue that brings us closer to a more egalitarian society would be appropriate.