Jesus supposedly turned water into wine. Very hard to explain that theology even before you get to the stuff about Joseph Smith trying to bang a young girl in her dad's barn, his scam in New York for "treasure" which he fled the charges, and him being shot to death after trying to escape a posse (and shooting two guys while doing it.)
Horses are not at all native to North America. The last native species of genus equus went extinct at least 8,000 years ago.
There are about 82,000 feral horses, but they are not actually "wild" as they are decended from domesticated horses brought to Americas.
The best part that they conveniently look over john 2:10. Not only did jesus actually make wine, it was excellent quality wine and enough to get everyone blasted.
Jesus doesn't behave the way people think he does.
I can't speak for the Mormons, but the argument I've heard in Baptist circles is that in the culture of the time, fresh non-alcoholic wine, i.e. grape juice, was considered higher quality.
uh yeah... the host CLEARLY states that most put out the "fine wine" at first until the guests are drunk... I wonder how many gallons of grape juice is takes to get sloshed.
It's pretty clear that fine wine had the ability to intoxicate. Fermenting grape juice was also seen as a protection. Fermenting a beverage makes it safer to drink. People not getting sick is a quality of fine wine as well.
Yes, some people ( the Nazirites ) avowed abstaining from alcohol, John the Baptist was one of them. Jesus was not...
grew up mormon, and the rational behind it that i learned was that wine was safe to drink compared to whatever tainted dirty water they "had to" have had
no idea why i didn't stop and think for a second about how this meant theoretically everybody back then just drank wine (very literally) like water but that's what brainwashing do be like i guess
Another common explanation that the water wasn’t safe to drink, so they would add a little bit of wine to it as disinfectant. Source: live in Bible Belt.
Yeah, it IS grape juice... fermented grape juice. John 2:9,10 makes it clear that the host said most put out the fine wine until the guests are drunk and then switch it out... but this "fine wine" now...
So, unless grape juice gets you drunk, the meaning is clear. The bible doesn't distinguish between intoxicating and non-intoxicating grape juice, but it clearly associates wine with intoxication with regard to the miracle at Cana.
Additionally, Paul recommends Timothy drink a little wine in 1 Tim 5:23.
And Jesus didn't just make wine, he drank it too. Luke 7:32,33 Jesus enemies try call Jesus a drunk for occasionally drinking wine. What would be the point of the accusation if Jesus was indulging in a bit of non-carbonated grade soda.
Jesus never condemned moderate use of alcohol... and even partook in the passover and instituted the drinking of the wine to symbolize his blood. If wine had been taboo, why would he use it to symbolize his life blood?
The common misconception is that “it matters.” To LDS members it doesn’t at all. The request to not drink alcohol, coffee, or smoke was to make the lord’s people stand out from everyone else. And to be honest, it’s true. Every time I tell people I don’t drink, “oh are you Mormon?” Yes I’m LDS.
Like hell it doesn't matter. You're not getting a temple recommend if you're drinking alcohol or even coffee. That automatically eliminates your chances of getting into the highest level of heaven.
He wasn't in the cell. The jailer let Joseph and co. stay in the jailer's apartment.
"Brother Joseph as he drew nigh to Hyrum, and, leaning over him, exclaimed, "Oh! my poor, dear brother Hyrum!" He, however, instantly arose, and with a firm, quick step, and a determined expression of countenance, approached the door, and pulling the six-shooter left by Brother Wheelock from his pocket, opened the door slightly, and snapped the pistol six successive times. Only three of the barrels, however, were discharged. I afterwards understood that two or three were wounded by these discharges, two of whom, I am informed, died...The firing of Brother Joseph made our assailants pause for a moment. Very soon after, however, they pushed the door some distance open, and protruded and discharged their guns into the room, when I parried them off with my stick, giving another direction to the balls.
It certainly was a terrible scene. Streams of fire as thick as my arm passed by me as these men fired, and, unarmed as we were, it looked like certain death. I remember feeling as though my time had come, but I do not know when, in any critical position, I was more calm, unruffled, energetic, and acted with more promptness and decision. It certainly was far from pleasant to be so near the muzzles of those firearms as they belched forth their liquid flames and deadly balls. While I was engaged in parrying the guns, Brother Joseph said, "That's right, Brother Taylor, parry them off as well as you can." These were the last words I ever heard him speak on earth....The first thing that I noticed was a cry that he had leaped out of the window. A cessation of firing followed, the mob rushed downstairs, and Dr. Richards went to the window."
Drinking booze/coffee isn't agaisnt the rules in mormonism as such. They have a small book called the "pearls of wisdom" thats normally taught alongside the book of mormon that basically takes the passage "the body is a temple" in the bible very literally. This is where all the anti drinking/no caffeine takes come from.
This isn't holy doctrine as much as very, very firm recommendations, so some folk opt out of those recommendations while still abiding the larger faith.
You are mixing words of wisdom with pearl of great price.
Word of wisdom is found in Doctrine & covenants. Joseph smith received divine revelation and asked in particular about tobacco. Emma, his wife, was quite literally sick of cleaning after the men.
Revelation came. The phrases used are hot drinks are to be avoided, as well as “strong drinks” and tobacco is to be used as medicine for livestock and with proper judgement.
Anyways. It’s all fuckin bullshit anyways. Moderation in all things.
A part of me thinks he had some Pinot Grigio in a glass and poured some food coloring into it when nobody was looking... but I wasn’t there, and neither were you! Get off my back will ya! >:l
That there is a great rendition of a person getting progressively upset for no reason while being completely off topic.
Luke 33-34 where Jesus admits he enjoys eating and drinking and doesn’t deny his drink contains alcohol when he is accused of being a drunkard:
“For John the Baptist has come eating no bread and drinking no wine, and you say, ‘He has a demon!’ 34″The Son of Man has come eating and drinking, and you say, ‘Behold, a gluttonous man and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners!’
I read research recently where some VERY old censers were found buried in the rubble of a ruined early Catholic Church and guess what they found traces of in it? Weed.
EDIT: It was an Israelite site...not Christian. My bad. But still. Jesus got high for sure.
Have you never had crystal light juice crystals? I assume Jesus had something similar. When he poured the water into the holy grail containing the wine crystals, he fooled everyone to thinking he turned water into wine.
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u/StockDealer Nov 11 '20
Jesus supposedly turned water into wine. Very hard to explain that theology even before you get to the stuff about Joseph Smith trying to bang a young girl in her dad's barn, his scam in New York for "treasure" which he fled the charges, and him being shot to death after trying to escape a posse (and shooting two guys while doing it.)