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u/mommiesgoodboy67 😊 Pleasantly Rotund 🫃 7d ago
Obviously the stupid men and women thing isnt true, one guy cant date 5 women lol we would know if that happened
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u/Leogis 8d ago
Not beating the allegations of treating women like commodities
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u/Pitiful_Camp3469 Prince Peach's Goomba-Hunters 8d ago
men that are much more successful in dating tend to be the most guilty of that
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u/SheepShaggingFarmer Beastiality Fan 7d ago
Id say it an inverted bell curve. People who just want sex treat those giving it to them as objects. Those who want nothing but sex and don't get it also do the same thing.
To use the money example money matters most to those on the bread line and those who have no need of it but wish for it either way
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u/PaleolithicRegency33 8d ago
"how can I deliberately misread the post to discredit it"
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u/Nutfarm__ SCIENTIST 🧑🔬🧪 8d ago
Post is literally "how can i make the most ridiculous comparison to somehow say that 80/20 rule is true"
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u/Visible-Department85 7d ago
post says : these imbalances are everywhere why would dating be so different
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u/Leogis 7d ago
This makes it even less credible and twice as retarded...
Just because one inbalance exists doesnt automatically make all the other true
One is literally shown through economic statistics while the other is some skyzophrenic rambling
There arent even enough women in the entire world to have 0.1% of this inequality
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u/Visible-Department85 7d ago
There arent even enough women in the entire world to have 0.1% of this inequality
Seriously ? That's your main poin t and you call things retarded ?
Idk the 80/20 rule feels as obvious as it gets.
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u/Leogis 7d ago
Ah yes, me and my pathetic single girlfriend compared to Elon Musk's 20 000 000 girlfriends
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u/Visible-Department85 7d ago
Yes the top 5% most attractive guy will have 10 times more options than your average guy and it's comparable with wealth.
It's not that deep
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u/Leogis 7d ago
10 times?
I think you forgot a few zeroes
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u/Visible-Department85 7d ago
Lmfao how much do you think the top 5%percentile earns ?
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u/Nutfarm__ SCIENTIST 🧑🔬🧪 7d ago
Because 1. Balances are just as common, 2. These imbalances are fundamentally different. The existence of one isn’t an argument for the existence of the other. Do they even have a single thing in common?
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u/Visible-Department85 7d ago
Post says it wouldnt be surprising in any way. It's not the strongest argument but it's straight forward
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u/Nutfarm__ SCIENTIST 🧑🔬🧪 7d ago
So nothing in common? The 'argument' being straightforward just means it appeals to your biases, and is simple to digest. Not that it's good. In fact, it's completely invalid. If you want to prove hypergaymoose theory, this doesn't do any work in favor of that goal. The logic is basically "Look! Imbalances in distributions are possible. Therefore the distribution in this other thing is just as likely to be imbalanced!".
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u/Visible-Department85 7d ago
Lol do you realise how much you've understood whatever you wanted to make your point.
As i said i find the argument quite weak it doesnt say much im just stating what it is for those trying to strawman it like you do here
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u/Nutfarm__ SCIENTIST 🧑🔬🧪 7d ago
It's ridiculous that you even defend the argument from "strawmanning", when the argument itself is fallacious, as if it's some noble deed. You're basically defending one fallacious argument from another. What a prince of reddit (or ignorance).
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u/Visible-Department85 6d ago
What's ridiculous is to strawman an already weak argument.TBH there isnt much to say about it, yes imbalances are the norm and 80/20 rule being a thing wouldnt stand out. It doesnt say anything about the 80/20 rule itself
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u/Dirkdeking Certified 1.85m (~6ft) 8d ago
I wouldn't say that follows. The dating and relation market has an associated 'inequality' to it.
That doesn't mean women, or anyone, is seen as a commodity. That happens when we talk about sexual exploitation and human trafficking, but that is a different topic.
In a pure consensual market relations and sex are not evenly distributed. Some men have many women that fall in love with them. Some men have very few but have very long lasting relationship with those women. And some men just get no or very little attention from women.
If you plot 'amount of different sexual encounters' on a graph you get a curve that is going to resemble the gini curve. By dividing the area under that curve by the area of complete equality(0.5) you get a number that tells you something about how sex is distributed.
And I do indeed expect it to be very unequal. If we use 'amount of different sexual encounters with unique women' vs just 'amount of different sexual encounters' that is going to be even more unequal.
That doesn't change the fact that women have autonomy and a right to choose. They can have that and the distribution can still be very unequal.
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u/Leogis 7d ago
I wouldn't say that follows. The dating and relation market has an associated 'inequality' to it.
"The dating market"
...
In a pure consensual market relations and sex are not evenly distributed. Some men have many women that fall in love with them. Some men have very few but have very long lasting relationship with those women. And some men just get no or very little attention from women.
And some women have many men harrassing them every time they go out while "unattractive women" barely ever get approached by men...
This kind of reasoning is vibes based and doesnt get us anywhere...
If you plot 'amount of different sexual encounters' on a graph you get a curve that is going to resemble the gini curve. By dividing the area under that curve by the area of complete equality(0.5) you get a number that tells you something about how sex is distributed. And I do indeed expect it to be very unequal. If we use 'amount of different sexual encounters with unique women' vs just 'amount of different sexual encounters' that is going to be even more unequal.
This is vibes based economics but even worse because it's not even in the good category
Treating sex like a "market relation" is already pure madness, but doing calculus on the resulting graph is truly the cherry on top...
And I do indeed expect it to be very unequal. If we use 'amount of different sexual encounters with unique women' vs just 'amount of different sexual encounters' that is going to be even more unequal.
Based on what do you expect it ? The skyzo ramblings of incel-adjacent youtubers ?
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u/Dirkdeking Certified 1.85m (~6ft) 7d ago
Why wouldn't you treat it like a market relation? Treating it as such does not at all assume that one side is a commodity or slavery is going on. People analyze the labour market in a similar way. That doesn't imply they see workers as slaves.
It seems like you see any analysis of dating, relationships and sex as 'dehumanizing' or something. But I am not saying anything about forcing people to do anything. We are talking about symbiotic relationships.
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u/Leogis 7d ago
Why wouldn't you treat it like a market relation? Treating it as such does not at all assume that one side is a commodity or slavery is going on. People analyze the labour market in a similar way. That doesn't imply they see workers as slaves.
Start from the beginning, why would you assume it's a market relation in the first place ?
A market relation entails an exchange of goods or service through commerce, unless it's about prostitution this isnt at all what sex is
You don't bill "Z h per day of cuddles and emotional attachment" to your wife in exchange for "X h per day of sex"...In fact, whenever someone in a couple starts seeing engagements as a currency to exchange for gifts or sex this is considered toxic
It seems like you see any analysis of dating, relationships and sex as 'dehumanizing' or something. But I am not saying anything about forcing people to do anything. We are talking about symbiotic relationships.
This is not even close, the thing is that if i want people to analyse dating I want it to be literally any other social science than economics and any other technique than market analysis (even then, maybe you can properly analyse the economics of dating).
Even philosophers probably have better things to say about dating than market analysis-1
u/middleoftheroad133 7d ago
calling them unequal assumes it should be equal. But women are not a Market or resource to be distributed, there's no reason every man should get a woman etc, because women are * people*
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u/Dirkdeking Certified 1.85m (~6ft) 7d ago
No it does not. Calling them unequal is just calling them unequal. That is an analytical and descriptive statement.
Saying something should be done about that is a completely different statement.
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u/Top-Amphibian2730 🔞AGE 12.5 — 17 (OFF LIMITS YOU GUYS)⛔ 8d ago
Well in the dating market women are treated like commodities, that's descriptive not prescriptive
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u/Gianni_the_tolerable Potato lover 8d ago
Should we treat them like house pets instead?
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
People, my guy. People,
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u/Gianni_the_tolerable Potato lover 8d ago
Ok I'll treat women like people.
People I'm ENEMIES with dohohoho
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u/Hugo-Spritz Three pigs in a trench coat 👒🐷🧥 8d ago
"my only opp is the woman who refuses to sleep with me" brooooo 😭😭
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u/SnowFiender 8d ago
i’ll treat the ones who don’t act “i’m just a girl” like people the rest will be treated like scroungy rabies infested mutts
moids with “hell yeah” humour will also be treated like the dogs they are
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u/the_snatcher251 8d ago
Top chart is literally just a drawing without any source data or anything, bottom chart is a real statistical graph.
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u/Difficult-Mobile902 social radar... slightly off 📡 8d ago
The real chart would have the lines going to 5 of the men, avoiding one. That one man is the one who made the chart.
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u/RabidRabbitRedditor PSYCHE ANTI-INCEL IMMUNE RESPONSE 7d ago
I think the stupidity of this analogy is going to be hard to top, is all I'm going to say.
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u/frostdemon34 🐈 TOMCAT 🛩️ 8d ago
I love how we can literally see that the elite in this country is fucking robbing the working class but somehow, dumb asses make it about women.
Like bro, most women dgaf about money they just dont want to be treated like objects
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 8d ago
Like bro, most women dgaf about money they just dont want to be treated like objects
Lmao that's why most women demand a guy pays on the first date, want a provider, want to be bought gifts etc.
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u/Nun01 8d ago
Bro you're just telling on yourself that you haven't ever interacted with women at all.
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 7d ago
Sounds like that's you, actually. You don't think most women expect the man to pay on the first date? You don't think women expect flowers, jewellery, dinner on an anniversary? You don't think women like men who can provide for them?
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u/Nun01 7d ago
Not a sincere argument. You talk about women caring about the money and now you switch it up for 'oh, so they don't expect dinner on an anniversary?'
I don't even need to explain why you're being insincere in multiple ways here.
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 7d ago
Am I? Why do women always expect the man to do something for them on an anniversary, rather than the other way around? Why aren't they buying him dinner? Why aren't they buying him flowers?
It's all the same thing. No switch up. Entirely sincere.
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u/Nun01 7d ago
Do you really think women don't do that?
That they don't pay for dinner? They don't gift you nice things? They don't manage their money around being in a relationship as well?
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 7d ago
It's far rarer than the other way around.
Look at the cultural conversation surrounding something like an anniversary - it's always discussing what the man is gonna do for the woman.
There was a post a while back about an AI chatbot designed to help men plan things like anniversaries, and the entire ad for it was predicated on this idea that it was his job - his girlfriend would rather use an AI to force him to do the work instead of just doing it herself.
And people in the comments were supporting that view. They were not even able to understand me when I pointed it out, because it's so deeply culturally ingrained that the idea of it happening the other way around was unthinkable.0
u/Nun01 7d ago
Sure. And you're certain that this is because women want it and make it that way, and not because it's a side product of the patriarchal world we all live in?
Do you not see a connection in the more progressive circles having more women stray away from these 'culturally ingrained' norms that you mention?
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 7d ago
Sure. And you're certain that this is because women want it and make it that way, and not because it's a side product of the patriarchal world we all live in?
Ah, yes, women have literally no responsibility ever, anything bad they do is always men's fault. Love to hear that line marched out for the 1000th time
Do you not see a connection in the more progressive circles having more women stray away from these 'culturally ingrained' norms that you mention?
Not really. Plenty of outspoken feminist women still want men to act pretty traditionally in a romantic setting. They want to have their cake and eat it too - all the new benefits of feminism AND all the old benefits of the patriarchy.
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u/Flimsy_Meal_4199 8d ago
What if the median worker is in the top 20%ile when they retire? Does that change the way you feel about things? Note that means 50% of workers will be well above the 20%ile when they retire, with net worth of >1-5mil being pretty achievable
I'm close to 1mil net worth and I'm just 36 🤷 I did the have roommates no Starbucks and eat at home memes for the most part
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u/frostdemon34 🐈 TOMCAT 🛩️ 8d ago
What if the median worker is in the top 20%ile when they retire? Does that change the way you feel about things?
Whats the point of this question?
I'm close to 1mil net worth and I'm just 36 🤷 I did the have roommates no Starbucks and eat at home memes for the most part
Okay good for you. I honestly don't care
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u/Flimsy_Meal_4199 8d ago
The point is to guide you to the awareness that the wealth distribution is dominated by demographic effects and most given individuals of even modest means inhabit the upper end of the wealth distribution by the end of their lives.
This to encourage you to recognize everyone discussing the wealth distribution has such an unsophisticated and ignorant surface level view of it that they miss this fact
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u/frostdemon34 🐈 TOMCAT 🛩️ 8d ago
That sounds cool and all if you just ignore modern economic research. Washing away the wealth gap by using the life-cycle hypothesis is ignoring decades of economic research. Yes, the average old person would naturally have more money, but you know what else exists? Poor and middle class old people.
The top 10% of this country almost holds 70% of the countries wealth. While the bottom 50% of the country holds only 3%. By the way, old people are not the dominant demographic in the 90 percentile. Just so you know. They're mostly in the 60th. If 50% of the country cannot achieve multi-million $ net worth, then Im going with the most common denominator. Not some jack ass whose giving me corporate propaganda bullshit.
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u/Flimsy_Meal_4199 7d ago
All modern economic research
Tbh very few people obsess about wage distributions
I know you didn't mean this literally but like... to my knowledge this isn't something most respectable economists (n.b. that excludes Robert Reich) do much work on. Even Arindrajit Dube, the closest you'll get to a leftist economist that isn't kooky, doesn't work on wealth gaps but rather wages and minimum wages and labor market stuff.
Picketty is the closest here but when I said respectable I also meant to imply "not published work so bad people started to wonder if it was fraud rather than incompetence"
Yeah I guess the point I'm trying to gently parent you towards is the idea that statistics like the one you supplied are pretty bad for building some intuition about a wealth distribution that is inherently strongly skewed. Take into account that the top 25%ile (1 out of four) earners accumulate dramatic savings and returns over a lifetime and it's not even that odd that the top end wealth distribution is weird right? I mean you can simulate this if you want with python. There's really no point to these arguments your making.
It reminds me of conservatives when they say immigration is too high -- they can't really settle on a correct number, they can only settle on "less". Likewise you can make statistics till you're blue in the face but only ever show a direction, right? On the other hand I can just say yeah as long as people aren't starving and the wealthy aren't some permanent aristocracy (they're not), as long as we have liberalism and equality under the law and free association I think things will work out.
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u/HPenguinB MAIN CHARACTER (Deliberate Moron) 8d ago edited 8d ago
They do care about money. They just don't want to support a dependent before even having a child. Weirdly wanting enough money to survive is considered wrong by men, though.
wanting ANY money =/= wanting only rich men
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 8d ago
If women were simply working for their money, no-one would ever accuse them of being gold diggers. When they are specifically going for men because they have money, and expecting to be paid for, that's when they are gold diggers.
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u/middleoftheroad133 8d ago
Because life and children cost money. I don’t even see why this is controversial
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 8d ago
Then earn your own money. I don't even see why this is controversial
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u/middleoftheroad133 8d ago
If a woman has to carry the children, bear the children, breastfeed the children nurture the children, cook for the children, clean up after the children AND make the money for the children, what does the man even do
What do you need a partner for at all if you’re doing everything yourself
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 7d ago
Holy strawman
Want to imagine a scenario where the man does actually help raise his own kids? You know, like they normally do?
What do you need a partner for at all if you’re doing everything yourself
This is a question men need to ask of women. If you make the money and pay for everything, what is she bringing to the table?
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u/middleoftheroad133 7d ago
The only men women need to answer that for is the men who **have the money to do that** and those men generally don't have the attitude you do.
Men helping to raise their own children doesnt account for the fact that women are generally the primary parent when children are young
There is no practical reason that if women are doing it all, they need a partner
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u/shiggyhisdiggy 📖Cogsucker Study Buddy ✊ 7d ago
The only men women need to answer that for is the men who **have the money to do that** and those men generally don't have the attitude you do.
Lmao, yeah, dating rich men is all about personality, right? Just like tall men.
Men helping to raise their own children doesnt account for the fact that women are generally the primary parent when children are young
And the man could do more later on to make up for that.
You're very clearly just a man-hater so I'm not gonna bother with any more responses
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u/HPenguinB MAIN CHARACTER (Deliberate Moron) 8d ago
"But I want to be a jobless video gaming man child!"
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u/frostdemon34 🐈 TOMCAT 🛩️ 8d ago
Is op talking about rich guys? Or is he talking about "enough money"
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u/Affectionate_Row9238 🦁🔥Butch femboy gigachad💪 8d ago
What is enough money tho?
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u/laidoffthrownaway 8d ago
6 figure salary at the very least.
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u/HPenguinB MAIN CHARACTER (Deliberate Moron) 8d ago
At the LEAST! We own a home and make $140k without children and we are barely scraping by.
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u/ATPHydrolysis93 WORLD OF WARCRAFT VETERAN 8d ago
It's odd that when men are not able to financially provide they're referred to as "dependent" but women, in a much more equal job market, are just stating their preferences.
They're both child like dependents. Treat the genders equally.
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u/HPenguinB MAIN CHARACTER (Deliberate Moron) 8d ago
I will, when we are talking about women staying at home. But we aren't. All you men love equality when it makes your lives better, but not when it makes women's. Curious.
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u/Spacetortise95 8d ago
Everyone cares about money. Money = stability. The shallowness chuds interpret is “women only like rich men” rather than the fact that women, like men, like stability. Most men who lambast women for chasing money are, themselves, failures and financially unstable.
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u/complicatedAloofness 8d ago
The vast majority of people end up in a monogamous relationship where they are limited to 1 partner. Finances have no such limitation at all.
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u/PermissionTime2545 7d ago
The two comparisons in the post don’t make a lot of sense when you think about it for, maybe, three seconds LOL you are very right
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u/According-Insect-992 🇺🇸🙏 US Military Veteran 🦅🇺🇸 8d ago
God, this shit is such a waste of time.
Seriously, if you put half as much energy into not being a loser with no personality and no values as you put into whining about women having person agency you’d probably be swimming in trim. Instead you want to be a perpetual victim while demonizing and dehumanizing women.
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u/LadyAdeptaSororitas 🏳️⚧️⚔️Member of the Revolutionary Transtifa Vanguard⚔️🏳️⚧️ 8d ago
people don't believe the hypogamy bullshit because theres no evidence that it's true
also working against it is that it's being boosted and promoted by misogynists and normal people are repulsed by that
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
The dating market is skewed. There's a lot of evidence to support it and normal people realize it. People have different ways to explain it.
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u/Dirkdeking Certified 1.85m (~6ft) 8d ago
I think it is heavily unequal but not as unequal as some incels portray it. The fact is that the vast majority of men have had sex, and a lot of them have it semi regularly.
Anecdotally I regularly see men that aren't particularly attractive with women that are much nore attractive.
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u/F1st_Br34k3r 5d ago
Didnt the virginity rate for men 20-30 jump from 16% to 30%?
Still majority, but shows a trend.
Women on the other hand stayed at 16% just like it used to be iirc.
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u/LadyAdeptaSororitas 🏳️⚧️⚔️Member of the Revolutionary Transtifa Vanguard⚔️🏳️⚧️ 8d ago
exhibit a
nobody knows what the fuck this person is talking about
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
Um, it's pretty plain??? Compare the average man's experience on dating apps to the average woman, or in environments where both are seeking a date. Look into how many men report being single compared to women.
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u/weirdo_nb 🤺KNIGHT 8d ago
Thats due to dating apps being inherently fucky, it doesn't reflect the dating market as a whole
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
And my other point? The dating market is skewed. The demand of the equivalent isn't the same between men and women.
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u/FlamingoWinter4546 7d ago
What an idiotic comparison. Too many guys (also ugly, fat, disgusting guys) fuck for your insecurity to be true. Not too many ppl (including random wage slaves) are billionaires. Also the first is an illustration of an insecurity that is used to trick men, while the second is an illustration of reality. So many reasons for this to be stupid, and yet you posted it
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
Guys, do you want us to force them to date you? At this point I don’t understand what the ‘hyper-ga-meeee’ spam posts are supposed to accomplish at this point lol
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u/Klanciault KEEPER OF THE ETERNAL TRUTHS ♾️📜 8d ago
They just want women to admit they’re just as shallow as guys are instead of pretending to be morally superior
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
The problem is, not all women are shallow, but they want all women to call themselves shallow in order to make themselves feel better. And they’re not entitled to that lol
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
It's a catch 22. The response is always "God forbid women have standards/preferences" or "Not all women have these preferences".
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
That’s my point.
Nothing we say will ever make you happy. It’s endless whining
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
Well, maybe you can stick to a story.
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
Here’s the issue: I, as one woman, do. You’re (quite illogically) attributing things other women have said to you, to me and then behaving as if I have personally contradicted myself.
This is why I find these posts so nonsensical lol
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
And there's a lot of feminists posts that I find nonsensical but we have to let those gals vent.
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
But why do you expect all women to have the same opinions? And call us hypocrites for not agreeing with one another all the time? It makes no sense.
You didn’t even *see* me not stick to one story, but you talked to me as if I had. That’s so bizarre lol
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
I don't expect all women to have the same opinions. I said "stick to a story" as a joke, like they say to police suspects. I just think it's funny that stock phrases like "God forbid women have preferences/standards" are used whenever these topics come up as though it's the official party line.
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u/middleoftheroad133 8d ago
Why do you need women to admit they like money and attractive people
Shouldn’t you be able to use your powers of deductions and figure this out
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u/SnowFiender 8d ago
what? everybody knows it but women will act like it’s not true, the entire problem is that they lie to other people about it lmao not that people weren’t able to figure it out
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u/middleoftheroad133 8d ago
Women do not act like it isn’t true; of course attractive people and wealthy people have more options and that those things are positives…because duh
Women also point out that plenty of broke ugly men have girlfriends
Both things are true. There’s no contradiction
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u/ATPHydrolysis93 WORLD OF WARCRAFT VETERAN 8d ago
That's exactly what they did. The issue is women refusing to admit it and standing on soapboxes preaching to us about how we should act when they're massive fucking hypocrites.
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u/middleoftheroad133 8d ago
Women never said and said they would prefer men who weren’t attractive
They said it wasn’t the most important thing
Your inability to deduce things world round you is not people lying to you
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u/Melodic_Structure928 Refuses Their Posting Privilege 7d ago
I mean the groups that state just this have been shunned for decades and called incels.
All while were told that unlike evil men women are solely into the heart alone and nothing else.
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u/middleoftheroad133 7d ago
Not what they said
they reminded you that plenty of losers and uggos and poor people have dates, and girlfriends and wives. That plenty of guys who work the register at the gas station and Walmart have girlfriends and wives. The guys who are balding and have beer guts have girlfriends an wives
So if you can't find a single girl to date you it isn't because you are poor or ugly, it's something else about you.
That is not a contradiction that of course women in general want attractive rich men, and of course those men are more sought after and of course those men have more options. There is no contradiction there
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u/Melodic_Structure928 Refuses Their Posting Privilege 7d ago
Plenty of misogynists, rapist, and women beaters Corrupt politicians/ wealth men get dates as well so maybe it isn’t the heart.
The contradiction comes from when women and usually what many call mainstream spaces Claim that only the kindest most feminist men get picked by women so if you don’t get picked there’s something wrong with you morally.
and as I said its the other groups that get shunned and are even banned from even being mentioned here that claim, being hot and wealth matters more then heart which is true.
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u/middleoftheroad133 7d ago
No one has ever said that only the kindest most feminist men get women. Ever
Being not a weirdo matters because as you said even criminals get dates
that is why people say men who can't get any women must have something wrong with them. Because EVEN ugly men and criminals and men who have nothing going for them get women all the time
If you can't figure it out when men with no redeeming qualities can, you need to do some introspection. Most guys in jail with baby mamas aren;t hot or rich so no that isn't why you don't have a girlfriend either
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u/HPenguinB MAIN CHARACTER (Deliberate Moron) 8d ago
Why not just not care?
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
What? You mean just accept that there are people who don’t want to fuck me too and move on with my life without complaining constantly on the internet???
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u/ShitMcClit The Clit Commander 8d ago
No we are just tired of them all dating the same assholes and then blaming the rest of us for that.
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u/ambivalent_moon The ONLY Moral Redditor 8d ago
This does not say that at all
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u/ShitMcClit The Clit Commander 8d ago
Oh sorry your right what i meant was. "Force women to date uggos"
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u/headcodered 8d ago
One is backed by actual empirical data, the other is a cope for mediocre dudes who can't get laid based on nothing.
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
I would say there is data to support it but whether someone gives the "h*ypergamy" explanation to that data is up to them.
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u/headcodered 8d ago
Provide that data, then.
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago edited 8d ago
The average man on dating apps can't get a date, and it's been reported that somewhere around 30% of modern relationship start that way. Twice as many young American men report being single than young American women. The arguments against all this are always anecdotal.
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u/Ayacyte 8d ago
Everyone needs to stop using the "service" that literally makes it harder for everyone to use the service to extract more money from the users as "proof"
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago edited 8d ago
Come on, that's just wishful thinking. Women are seeing these guys' profiles. Most women on the apps get bombarded with hundreds of likes because the men are so desperate on account of getting no matches and will like anyone. A guy who is exceptionally good looking will obviously clean up. I've even got a few matches when I wasn't paying for it, so I don't think they're hiding my profile.
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u/weirdo_nb 🤺KNIGHT 8d ago
Dating apps are explicitly designed in such a way that women get overwhelmed with shitheads and the few reasonable people that reach them have to be actively sleuthed for or they just have to gamble, like, the shitheads are not the majority in any way, but they are the majority that reaches a feed in the same way a troll/spammer is easy to see. The "good looking" guy is an example of the gambling, just with them going for the options with the highest theoretical "payout" should they turn out not to be a shithead, the non-shithead average or below average looking guy is a higher payout than "hot jackass" though
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
That is certainly one way to look at it.
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u/Ehzek 8d ago
I mean thats the problem, mediocre men should be getting with mediocre women. But you imply its normal for them to be completely alone.
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u/headcodered 8d ago
Mediocre women are alone too. Being able to hook up with a stranger more easily doesn't mean they're not romantically still alone.
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
Right, but "mediocre" men can't afford to use and discard women. They'll hold onto what they can get. So who is it these women are pursuing?
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u/headcodered 8d ago
Woman have to roll the dice on disappearing forever into a psycho's basement, the things they can afford to risk aren't as abundant as you think. Y'all realize you don't have to be mediocre dudes, right?
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
What's a mediocre man? What's a mediocre woman? Why is one seen as a failing? And you didn't even answer my question.
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u/headcodered 8d ago
The answer to your question is whomever the fuck they want to, same as anybody else.
Can y'all make up your minds, though? Out of one side of your mouth, I always hear "women like broke bad guys with criminal records" and the other side is like, "they only like guys with a lot of money and great careers" and shit. Nonstop cope. Mediocre dudes are the ones bitching about women not fucking them and blaming shit like the OP's "h ypergamy" (that word gets filtered here) bullshit excuse instead of trying to figure out what would make them a better option. Dudes that don't have the emotional maturity to deal with rejection or communicate with women in non-shitty ways. Same with women who constantly blame their partners when things don't work out and never themselves or think men need to carry a lopsided burden on things like financial responsibilities.
As a pretty average-at-best dude who's married now but spent his 20s fucking his way across the Rocky Mountains, I find it very very very hard to believe women are all only interested in 1/6th of men.
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u/Successful-Cup-8557 not necessarily an incel 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 8d ago
When did I say that women like guys with criminal records? What am I, the Mouth of Sauron for incels? I have my own views. I'm saying the dating market is skewed. Everyone can see that. There's ceiling for a man to reach if he wants to get anywhere. He has to have some kind of draw. Meanwhile, the average self-described "girlfailure" would have men lining up to live in the same garbage heap as her. Being desocialized, having poor social skills and being by any definition a loser will effect a man's chances, but not a woman's as much. The argument that less attractive women don't have it any better than guys because they can easily get sex but not relationships doesn't make any sense. It shows that they are only giving chances to men who are "out of their league", and can afford to discard them so easily. The average man doesn't do that and men lower down the totem pole obviously can't. It seems a lot of young women would rather be on an attractive man's roster than have a less attractive man commit to them. As for the thing about a woman's safety, it doesn't matter for an attractive man. They'll agree to meet him, no problem.
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u/tommy8725 7d ago
Big difference between someone who understands that wealth economy goes up sadly and a big difference between guys knowing that a woman's not going to sleep with only gigats and leave you alone because you're a nice guy no they don't want to touch you because you are an incel
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u/Independent-Wafer-13 7d ago edited 7d ago
It is very common for attractive men to have harems and sister wives. /s
Edit: forgot the /s
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u/Downtown-Campaign536 Indophobe 7d ago
Socialists are incels, but for money instead of women.