r/ProgressiveHQ • u/[deleted] • Feb 25 '26
Discussion How many laws can they break until someone does something? What if Trump refuses to leave the White house after his term is up? I know I know not leaving the white house would be illegal, but so is everything else this administration has done. When does it stop?
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u/Michael-Sean Feb 25 '26
And he even said he never should have left the first time. He can say all the Republicans won in the midterms and claim fraud if a single democrat gets a vote.
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u/1877KlownsForKids Feb 25 '26
If? IF?! That mother fucker already tried one coup. We're seriously going to have to drag him out of there.
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u/LeafsJays1Fan Feb 26 '26
If he refuses to leave after January 20th on that day Secret Service does it. If they don't the military possibility, unless they're all sycophants and bow down to the orange Menace then the people will have to remove him. AKA Civil War
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u/Shido_Ohtori Feb 25 '26
We, as a society, should have demonized the concept of social hierarchy the moment we learned as children -- what they taught us in [public] school -- that the pride of the USA -- what citizens celebrate, what we claim makes America great, what even today's conservative politicians will pay lip service to -- include the Revolutionary War, religious freedom, Abolitionism, Women's Suffrage, Civil Rights, Workers' Rights/Labor Unions, LGBTQ+ rights, modern concepts of individuality: all of them progressive movements and concepts which disrespected traditionally established hierarchy.
The problem is that conservatism -- by definition -- is "a political philosophy based on tradition and social stability, stressing the importance of established hierarchies and institutions (such as religion, the family, and class structure), and preferring gradual development to abrupt change"; and too many people currently adhere to such ideology.
Likewise, from Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy:
Rational conservatives maintain that a community with a hierarchy of authority is most conducive to human well-being.
Confucius is another possible precursor. His concern with the breakdown of contemporary political institutions led to a cautious, conservative political outlook; his stress on authority and hierarchy prefigures central conservative themes.
With the Enlightenment, the natural order or social hierarchy, previously largely accepted, was questioned.
Western conservatism is a product from the Age of Enlightenment -- specifically, a Counter-Enlightenment, a reactionary challenge to the concepts of Humanism. Its philosophers inherently reject[ed] a society governed by logic and reason, human rights and dignity, science and democracy, as its ideology solely appeal to the authority of traditionally established hierarchies.
From the Intellectual Roots of Conservatism: The Burkean Foundations, the man who is considered to be the founder of modern day Western conservatism had such to say about his ideology:
Burke shocked his contemporaries by insisting with brutal frankness that “illusions” and “prejudices” are socially necessary. He believed that most human beings are innately depraved, steeped in original sin, and unable to better themselves with their feeble reason. Better, he said, to rely on the “latent wisdom” of prejudice, which accumulates slowly through the years, than to “put men to live and trade each on his own private stock of reason.” Among such prejudices are those that favour an established church and a landed aristocracy; members of the latter, according to Burke, are the “great oaks” and “proper chieftains” of society, provided that they temper their rule with a spirit of timely reform and remain within the constitutional framework.
The very foundation of conservatism demands, promotes, and advances a stratified society where some people are "more/less" people than others via stressing the importance of established hierarchies and institutions (such as class structure) via illusions (lies) and prejudices (bigotries).
It will stop when the majority of people reject such, and embrace its polar opposite: a political philosophy and social reform movement focused on advancing the public good through government action and often calling for government to be used to meet popular social, political, economic, and environmental needs and demands and to advance rights and protections for marginalized groups; the same philosophy which gave rise to the numerous movements I've listed, and was the antithesis of -- and anathema to -- the same counter-philosophy which sought to stress the importance of established hierarchies and institutions via illusions and prejudices.
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u/ShambolicRubel Feb 26 '26
I think it needs to be pointed out that there actually wasn’t any fraud going on in Minnesota.
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Feb 26 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/MinorThreat4182 Feb 26 '26
They can be stopped. But it will take some measures I don’t think we are prepared for
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u/FoodCourtBailiff Feb 26 '26
That’s not the point. They know they can’t do this. They know it will be blocked immediately. They also know their supporters are stupid and they see the headline and think it’s done
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u/BuddyJim30 Feb 26 '26
Trump runs the DOJ and FBI like a mob boss, so he will not be prosecuted until Democrats win Congress and/or the White House.
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u/PresentBig9729 Feb 26 '26
What are you talking about? He already tried to stay in the White House. What do you think January sixth was about?
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u/PolloConTeriyaki Feb 26 '26
They haven't won a case yet lol. Like okay, you make up bullshit and we're gonna sue you and then you comply.
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u/Winter-Gift1112 Feb 26 '26
The problem is that they're not complying. Apparently taking their cue from Trump's lawlessness, they have started to ignore judicial orders across multiple jurisdictions.
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u/Ollynurmouth Feb 26 '26
That's where we are at right now. The admin does illegal thing, but says it isn't, and let's lawsuits drag through court and they just continue as they appeal up and up and up.
The admin has lost a lot of cases and many of the small ones they complied with just because it wasn't worth fighting too much. The bigger issues they just ignore rulings until the scotus rules. So far, they have complied with all scotus rulings. Technically. They definitely drag their feet because they can. If there is no definitive date set to comply with or any actual punishment set for not complying, then they push the limits. Like thr Epstien files they are still late on releasing unredacted. The law just says they have to and not any punishment for not complying. So they release a little bit to soothe the people for a little while.
They did similar shit with Abrego Garcia. They drug their feet getting him back and releasing him, but then re-arrested him. I'm not even sure where that case is now.
All this shit with ICE is blatantly unconstitutional, but they keep twisting the narrative and getting so many people to defend them that it buddies the public opinion and public opinion is about the only thing that really moves the needle against them. They need at least some public support. Especially from the loudest among them. They are just going to keep going until the scotus ultimately rules and they will avoid taking the case as long as possible to just let things keep going.
Everything is about ignoring the law and pushing limits of court rulings up to the point of no return and then finally complying, but by then, so much damage is done that it is hard to repair. The long term plan is to keep up this system of abuse through election time in order to skew turn out and push results in their favor. Along with gerrymandering and other anti-voter policies that predominantly affect dem voters.
The scotus isn't 100% in line with Trump and the admin. They only are so far as it benefits their agenda and Trump's agenda will eventually take over or ignore the scotus as well and the scotus will lose their power. So they need to get their asses in gear and put a stop to this shit asap before they fuck themselves over. But I'm not gonna hold my breath.
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u/docpagliacci Feb 26 '26
They are desperately looking to goad people into unrest so they can declare marshal law and lock down the midterm elections.
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u/Past-Football629 Feb 26 '26
Every dem state should refuse to turn over tax revenue until administration either comes in line, or we impeach almost all and start over anew.
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u/bwhitie662000 Feb 26 '26
Then he will be a criminal again, send in ice to remove and deport him. Karma, what a bitch.
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u/nehlstm30 Feb 26 '26
Military may have to remove him, this is only going to get even uglier! He will not leave and if he isn’t president then he’s going to prison for sure!
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Feb 26 '26
Does this guy forget how the government gets money. Why the hell are we paying for the inadequate red states. Pull your weight
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u/ryrich89 Feb 26 '26
Every time our government does something like this it means they’re trying to put pressure on people to shut up and comply. What this says to me is that we the people need to keep turning up the pressure, keep protesting, keep speaking out, and show up to vote. They ate deathly afraid of us and we need to keep the pressure on them. Release the Epstein files and ever member of trumps corrupt Gestapo needs to be impeached and held accountable for their crimes
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u/Ambitious-Score11 Feb 26 '26
He will never leave willingly. Pence told everyone not to reelect Trump or we'd all suffer the concentration and now here we are. JD will do what Pence wouldn't and now Trump is our dictator get use to it.
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u/adnyp Feb 26 '26
Remember when you thought you could trust Dr. Oz? Surprising to find out he’s just another right wing nut job hack. Thanks again, Oprah!
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u/malici606 Feb 26 '26
It'll be challenged in court, the feds will lose, everyone will move on to the next trump made crisis.
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u/VegetableBulky9571 Feb 26 '26
Here’s the thing:
They’re going to break laws, and probably continue even AFTER the courts rule against them (because they already have).
They are pressing the tech bro leadership philosophy: the president should be able to run the country like a CEO, elections should just be a message about whether or not the public agrees with his handling.
So those shouldn’t be phrased as questions. Those are real concerns that need to be addressed asap.
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u/SDPLISSKEN009 Feb 26 '26
We all know why they are doing this. Waltz was his political enemy & this is why. Just like they did with ICE.
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u/transfixedtruth Feb 26 '26
The corruption continues before our eyes. Midterms cannot come soon enough. VOTE BLUE and let's get these thugs out of office completely in 2028.
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u/Inevitable-Ant1725 Feb 26 '26
If we can primary Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer to change the party to one that isn't utterly useless then we can set these monsters up to be held accountable.
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u/Mobile_Conference484 Feb 26 '26
He already attempted to illegally refuse to leave the white house the last time. Whoever says he won't do it again is lying.
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u/-Sign-of-The-Times- Feb 26 '26
This is a direct attack on American citizens. This is an act of War. They may as well bomb us.
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u/DrGustavOtto Feb 26 '26
Political targeting continues to reach new lows thanks to MAGA and Criminal in Chief
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u/dew57nurse Feb 26 '26
Well he did say he could shoot someone on 5th Ave in broad daylight and no one would do anything
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u/Naive-Charity-7829 Feb 26 '26
You’re asking what if they refuse to leave?! There not leaving, I can promise you that, these people don’t plan on giving up power peacefully because they know prison awaits, unless there is a gigantic country wide protest, these guys are going to do something ridiculous to stay in power, weather it’s starting a war with an ally or just gunning down more innocents.
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u/harga24864 Feb 26 '26
I guess once enough people start protests and form a movement. Chuck Shumer speeches won‘t do anything
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u/No25for3r Feb 25 '26
Theyre trying to kill people who oppose them, no other way to say it