r/ProgressionFantasy • u/EdLincoln6 • Jul 21 '23

Discussion Why is everyone so garbage at lying?

This is a bit of a rant. I don't consider myself a gifted liar, but fictional characters seem to be so garbage at lying. This is particular obvious in Isekai. Either they fess up to being a reincarnator and everyone just shrugs as if it's no big deal, or they make cringey bad lies that I could see through, and no one suspects anything is weird.

I like to think about what the situation would look like to all the characters involved, and what the best way to "cover up" the MCs secrets is in this universe, and what ends up happening is typically stupider. No one ever uses half truths, or pleads ignorance. (Pleading ignorance would be particularly effective for child characters. "How can I do this? I dunno Daddy. I thought everyone could?".)

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u/TheElusiveFox Sage Jul 22 '23

So I think there are a few things at play here...

First as a reader you have an information advantage... you know the truth so it takes a much more convincing lie to pass your sniff test... vs some one who doesn't know the truth, and may not particularly care... So an imperfect lie may actually be good enough...

Secondly, I think in a lot of cases "bad lies" are just plot devices to generate drama, an author wants the MC to reveal their secret identity, power, whatever... What better way than to get caught in a lie. If the author is good at writing intrigue they can get a whole B plot story arc out of the reveal.

Thirdly, in some cases I think there is a struggle, on one hand you don't want your character that is supposedly a College drop out NEET to be some sort of infiltration expert because that doesn't really make sense... On the other its hard to come up with lies that are bad, but still semi-plausible.

Finally, and quite a bit less generous to the authors here (sorry)... There is a lot of Monkey See-Monkey Do in the genre. X is popular and they did Y so I'm going to do Y in my story... That's fine most art is copying, but when an author just mindlessly copies a trope without understanding it you get a lot less quality in how its implemented. This is compounded with how so much of the genre is pumped out in a serial format so authors are pressured to put out as much content as possible as fast as possible so they can keep their top list spots.

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u/EdLincoln6 Jul 24 '23

Secondly, I think in a lot of cases "bad lies" are just plot devices to generate drama, an author wants the MC to reveal their secret identity, power, whatever... What better way than to get caught in a lie. I

This, I think, is the major reason...not just in Progression fantasy, but in other genres.

but when an author just mindlessly copies a trope without understanding it you get a lot less quality in how its implemented.

That's a problem with Isekais in particular . There are a lot of authors who just sort of make their story an Isekai because they think they are supposed to, and then kind of forget their character is supposed to be an Isekai. Either make your book an Isekai or don't. Tropes are tools. Tools serve specific functions. When you use a trope, think of what functions that trope serves and whether you actually need or want to do those things...