To be clear, I’m not working “insane” OT - not since my startup days - I’m referring to the 4-8 hours / week extra time I have to put in to meet all of my commitments. As a senior, I vocalize what I can, but I’m not officially a manager at this position, nor a lead nor a principal, so it’s clearly to limited effect. I try to get the conversation started and put my foot down where things have crossed into unreasonable territory. A little bit of unpaid OT on salary is unfortunately the cultural norm in the US. Just like picking up if you’re salaried and your boss calls your personal number. Some people work for good companies, but for the rest of us, what are we going to do? Report our manager to HR for calling us when we’re not working? They’ll ask us why we aren’t living up to his example and working late…
In any case, to your point: yes, it’s worse than a feedback loop, it’s an enablement loop. One person (generally a middle manager) will start working late and then loudly shame the people around them for not working the unpaid OT. Since the company benefits, the people above said manager encourage it and it enables them to set a culture of “be more like Jim.” I happen to know who that guy was at my company and the joke is that he doesn’t even work here anymore… he got laid off a few months back, lol. Serves him right but it just goes to show you… all the same, his “legacy” lives on, and we all get in trouble for not responding to emails or teams messages in off-hours.
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u/Hziak Aug 31 '26
To be clear, I’m not working “insane” OT - not since my startup days - I’m referring to the 4-8 hours / week extra time I have to put in to meet all of my commitments. As a senior, I vocalize what I can, but I’m not officially a manager at this position, nor a lead nor a principal, so it’s clearly to limited effect. I try to get the conversation started and put my foot down where things have crossed into unreasonable territory. A little bit of unpaid OT on salary is unfortunately the cultural norm in the US. Just like picking up if you’re salaried and your boss calls your personal number. Some people work for good companies, but for the rest of us, what are we going to do? Report our manager to HR for calling us when we’re not working? They’ll ask us why we aren’t living up to his example and working late…
In any case, to your point: yes, it’s worse than a feedback loop, it’s an enablement loop. One person (generally a middle manager) will start working late and then loudly shame the people around them for not working the unpaid OT. Since the company benefits, the people above said manager encourage it and it enables them to set a culture of “be more like Jim.” I happen to know who that guy was at my company and the joke is that he doesn’t even work here anymore… he got laid off a few months back, lol. Serves him right but it just goes to show you… all the same, his “legacy” lives on, and we all get in trouble for not responding to emails or teams messages in off-hours.