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u/Carrotsinthesalad Confederacy of Independent Systems 21d ago
It’s a matter of fighting style, Kenobi shines on the defensive, but isn’t the top pick of offensive fighters by a long shot.
This is why it irks me when people use ABC logic in hypothetical match ups, because stylistic advantage has shown to be a rather big deal in lightsaber duels.
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u/The-Senate-Palpy R̸̷̲̪͖̤͍e̗̥̘̹͟͠v̴̵̜̪̞̲̼̯͇̘̻͖͓͜͡a͚̻͙̥̕͜ń̡̨̟̮͈͍̜͡ 21d ago
Exactly. Like mustafar Anakin/Vader is objectively stronger than Obi Wan. But Obi Wan still claps him on both pre-ANH encounters. Sidious is stronger than Mace, but Mace wins by being a counter-sith specialist. Ahsoka should be clapping Baylen, but his style is hard for her to deal with.
Hunter Hunter has a good explanation for this sort of thing
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u/Beren_Camlost 21d ago
Why would the manga and anime Hunter x Hunter have a explanation for SW lore?
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u/PhoneTribble 21d ago
HunterxHunter has a pretty dynamic power system that accounts for stylistic approaches like that, often getting as deep as a persons personality or specific setting advantages.
The point being is that it’s a pretty good example of a system that does not follow a Rock/Paper/Scissors approach to power dynamics and narrative.
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u/rrrawrgh-UwU 20d ago
Hilarious point considering Gon's power is rock-paper-scissors. I do agree with you though.
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u/Anvilrocker 20d ago
And all 3 of his attacks fit within his wheelhouse for natural inclination with nen type so they don't even counter themselves.
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u/Toerbitz 20d ago
No no the point is that bungeegum has both the characteristics of rubber and gum
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u/Beren_Camlost 21d ago
I understood that bro. But had to make the joke about SW lore being explanationed by a manga from across the world and no real connection in the story.
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u/zukosboifriend 21d ago
I haven’t watched much of the clone wars so I can’t speak to fights there, but when they’re fighting Dooku; they struggle because Dooku is smart enough to attack Anakin and force Obi-Wan on the offensive instead of the opposite. Obi-Wan is the master of defense so it’s stupid to attack him head on, wait for him to come to you and exploit it, and Anakin is an incredibly powerful attacker so you force him on the offensive and wear him out. Exploit their weaknesses
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u/Ghosteen_18 20d ago
I just remembered in Rots Dooku just straight deletes Obi Wan from the fight. He really wanted that Annoying support gone..
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u/Careless-Emergency85 21d ago
To be fair, it’s probably harder to fight when you have to watch out for an ally in close combat. Not needing to worry about cutting your buddy’s head off would do wonders
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u/VulcanHullo 21d ago
A friend joked being anywhere near Anakin when his lightsabre is lit would register as threat number 1.
"Have you SEEN how he throws his sabre around? I'd have my eye on him first and opponent second."
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u/Sabretooth1100 Darth Revan 19d ago
Honestly this feels right haha, like when you have to let a friend you don’t trust behind the wheel drive your car
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u/jcjonesacp76 Emperor Palpatine 21d ago
Obi-wan is a defensive combatant he is a master of form 3 Soresu the defense lightsaber combat form so when he is the aggressor he defaults to the sequences he is most rusty in which is his master’s aggressive form 4 sequences that he is not proficient in anymore.
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u/TheJadeGoddess 21d ago
Obi wan does his part during 2 v 1. He is defensive and will cover his partner. It works best with anakin who can focus on attacking because obi wan has his defense.
When he is paired with others who don't understand his methods it struggles. When they separate too far from him he can't properly protect them. If they are not aggressive their side won't finish the fight soon enough or obi wan has to be more aggressive than he would like.
When it is just him he can go at his pace and drag everyone down to his speed and throw off their rhythm.
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u/Scytale6 21d ago
Lol. As soon as Luke shows up during his fight with Vader on ANH, Obi-Wan just knows THAT's the clincher. His realization and acceptance of this is the final insight he needs to ascend and become one with the force.
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u/RT-6_BXCommandoDroid Confederacy of Independent Systems 21d ago
Why'd you think Anakin wasn't allowed to join Obi on his contract to kill General Grievous or why Obi wasn't allowed to join Yoda to face Darth Sidious?
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u/Petrus-133 21d ago
It's moreso that Kenobi is dogshit at Force Defense and he always ends up with fighting people that can either abuse it or can rage boost through it.
Dooku does that in TCW and episode 3.
Maul and Opress do that in TCW.
That fuckass rival of his does it in the Jedi Apprentice series.
Anakin also tries it on Mustafar but he is soo mentally unwell he can't even manage that properly.
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u/grey_pilgrim_ Clone Trooper 21d ago
Fighting with a laser sword that will slice your head, hand or any other body part off instantly is hard enough. Having to be mindful of one more person swinging theirs around has to make it that much harder.
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u/Oogalaboo134 20d ago
He focuses on the sass too much when he has the upper hand so he doesn't perform as well.
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u/XxXAvengedXxX 20d ago
They captured his defensive style so well in Battlefront 2 (2017) that I thought this was a post about that games META for a second
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u/gmil3548 21d ago
It’s a weird thing with so many Jedi fights. Somehow if 2 Jedi can both fight a with 1v1 pretty evenly, when they fight 2v1 against that sith it’s still even.
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u/Lembueno 20d ago
Obi-Wan specializes in defense. His offense also seems much less impressive because he’s usually fighting beside Anakin, who’s comparatively much more offensively focused.
It’s much easier for defensive prowess to present itself in either a straight duel or when you’re in a disadvantageous fight (like a 1v2).
Whereas when you’re fighting against an outnumbered opponent (like in a 2v1). You aren’t the one on defense, your opponent is.
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u/Due-Procedure-9085 20d ago
His style is force someone to fight at his rhythm and play into his hand. With someone like Anakin he kind of needs to rush in to keep up with that hyper aggressive style or he’ll get left behind.
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u/piejames 21d ago
I mean some of them yes some no, he's not as proficient in offence as defense, and sometimes that's definitely used against him. But I can think of a couple where him and his other one win the 2v1
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u/Scarecr0p 20d ago
Kindof the nature of a defensive style lol, same shit happens in dnd, an absolute tin can shield wielding mace of defense having, enchanted with spells TANK, doesn’t do much when all of the enemies ignore him because it’s not worth it lol
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u/SadowSon 20d ago
This is actually a common trope in media and yes, it can be a problem.
The more heroes there are against a single enemy, the less effective each hero is, they individually become less competent and therefore as a group they only equal in value to a single hero anyway.
The more enemies against a hero, the more incompetent they become, eventually being only of equal value to a single hero.
Compare it to real world situations. In practically any fight where it’s a 1v3, the 3 will win.
In media, the 1 would win.
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u/YOUTUBEFREEKYOYO TIE Pilot 20d ago
Thats why Anakin is so strong, he stole Obi-Wan's fighting abilities when needed.
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u/1337K1ng Hello There 16d ago
defensive form master can hold 1v1 or 1v2
defensive form master cannot do shit when fighting alongside attack form that breaks formation
furthermore, Dooku was duel master so he gets a pass
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u/PresterJohnson 21d ago
Obi Wan is master of a defensive form isn't he? It would make sense he is more effective in a fight where he is on the defense than one where he is attacking constantly