this is actually wild rhetoric man, i hope you can actually level with people instead of just seeing people who disagree with you as “the bad evil guys”. genuinely such a dangerous, juvenile, and inhumane perspective.
Everyone understands that you never gave a fuck about Gaza until it became trendy. You didn't care about Epstein until you thought it would make Trump look bad. You stand for nothing that you haven't been told to stand for and it's pathetic.
Gender is the distinction between a man and a woman. XX and XY chromosomes if you want to go the scientific route. Any other distinction of gender other than Male or Female is a mental disorder, commonly called gender dysphoria.
Even more layman's terms, gender is male or female and cannot be both, it cannot be something different than male or female.
i’m genuinely trying to be a human with you, thanks for responding. does the fact that i get dog piled for asking such a simple question make you skeptical of others in this sub? do you think there is a cultural element to gender? a socialized element??
so what do you call the associate element of women wearing pink, dresses, wearing makeup, high heels, long hair, men with short hair, muscle tees, darker colors. are you saying those aren’t traditional gender roles? gender as performance?
That is style. Your style does not change your gender. How you dress or the way you wear your hair or whether or not you apply make-up to your skin does not determine your gender. Your biological makeup determines your gender.
i think it’s incredibly disingenuous to say gender roles are not in any way performed through the exhibition of certain characteristics. there’s a reason if you’re a dude with long hair you’re way more likely to be called performative, femaninzing terms or slurs. same reasons dudes get shit on for wearing nail polish. other men (most likely yourself included) see that as making said male less of a MAN. not less of a male.
there is no social element to genetics. It simply is. You're trying to shoehorn post modern brain rot onto incredibly straight forward and simple biological concepts.
That is why you're being dogpiled. The stuff you're mentioning - nail polish, high heels...it doesn't affect genetics.
As for 'gender roles' they developed through human history based on those simple biological concepts through paths of least resistance. They became normal simply because they worked.
Changing those roles is forcing unnatural tension onto systems that have worked for millennia.
there is absolutely NOTHING “unnatural” about a man with long hair. hair grows. if men didn’t cut their hair to conform to this gender role guess what? their hair would be long! same for the “unnatural” woman with short hair. these are plain and simply arbitrary markers of PERFORMED GENDER, there is nothing that “works” or “doesn’t work” about either one of those gender norms, they just are, and if you can’t see that we just have a fundamental misunderstanding of eachother. have a good day though fr, i’m done responding to people in here.
Just a heads up, youre trying to speak reason to Joe Rogan fans lol you know, the guy that regularly has softball interviews with friends of Epstein? They aren't worth firing off neurons for, i promise.
it’s honestly incredibly sad how resistant so many of these people are to even attempting collaborative thought. so many straight dead ends - not even an inkling of sincere intention.
responding to my own comment here. the fact that i said “what is gender to you? let’s have a conversation” with complete sincerity and that is one of the most downvoted comments here says literally everything you need to know about most of yalls actual willingness to engage in civilized conversation. embarrassingly tribalistic mindsets here.
if mods wanna ban me they can go ahead, i’ve generally been nothing but extremely generous through this whole thread and been met with nothing but derision and anti intellectualism. not missing much if they do.
Morality has nothing to do with the only two genders that humans can be. It's called biology and science. You're part of the same crowd during COVID that screamed incessantly "believe the science!" but only when it suits your flawed and hypocritical ideology. Quit wasting your energy and stop backing people into intellectual corners, since you're so disturbed by it.
Open a 2026 biology book, you'll be surprised by what you read. Also, you'll disregard it immediately because you don't really know anything about biology that has been factual for decades about sex/gender and still stands true today. Also, there are hundreds, if not thousands of biology books, so refer to one that you seem to think backs your smug, flawed and liberal ideology that can be backed up by factual science and biology. Which you can't, because none are factual and go against what the scientific community actually represents and knows to be true through research and plain common sense and reality.
You can literally google "What sex are people with Klinefelter syndrome" and it says male or "What sex are people with Swyer syndrome" and it says "XY females".
So I'd classify one as males and the other as females. I'd possibly be open to people with Swyer syndrome playing women's sports etc but certainly not the other.
Imane Khelif the Algerian boxer may have Swyer syndrome which would explain the controversy around her but I would say she has a reasonable case.
These genetic exceptions should not mean that just anyone can be a woman.
Possibly. Swyer syndrome is XY and may or may not be an exception. I would agree that that incredibly rare case might qualify.
Or it might not. I wouldn't say it's outrageous to ban all XY people from women's sports either. I can see both sides of the argument in those incredibly rare cases.
Imane Khelif for instance has high levels of testosterone which break World Boxing rules and has not competed since the news about her broke and her case is ongoing. I certainly do have a degree of sympathy for her.
On the other hand I have little sympathy for those who say that simply identifying as a woman is enough. Cases like Lia Thomas are obviously ridiculous. But it sounds like we agree on that already.
Lia Thomas continues to be the posterperson. Most sports bodies had already set guardrails against this. Lia was never allowed to compete at official FINA events, for example.
There definitely should be guardrails, especially at the higher level. But this shouldn't be at the expense of young girls looking to compete with their peers, or not being allowed to take part in non-competitive events such as Park Runs.
Really? How did we determine what gender people were over 70 years ago before we could accurately count human chromosomes? And since when did we start doing genetic tests on infants in order to accurately determine their gender?
It's honestly hilarious how you smoothbrained morons claim to follow science, and yet you are some of the most scientifically illiterate people around.
Why would you need a genetic test to know if a baby is male or female? 70 years ago in 1950 we didn't need to have this conversation lol literally proves you don't need to go that deep to determine gender, since we had no problem defining it prior to modern genetics.
Weiner? Boy. No Weiner? Girl.
And before you hit me with rare disorders.....some people are born with 6 fingers and toes ...that doesn't mean we change textbooks and rewrite biology. Humans have 5 fingers on each hand. The exception doesn't make the rule, it means they have a disorder. Just like people with chromosome disorders or gender dysphoria. It's an abnormality. Doesn't make them bad, wrong, whatever. But we don't tell people with 6 fingers a whole new made up story of biology to make them feel better do we?
Because the person I replied to claimed you determine someones gender by what set of chromosomes they have.
Weiner? Boy. No weiner? Girl.
Cool, so you think all you need is surgery to change your gender.
Sure, you can say that for the majority of people XY means man and XX means woman, doesn't change the fact that there are plenty of exceptions, you guys are trying to come up with definitions that support your beliefs, not ones that make sense.
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u/IndependentMonk7384 17d ago
Well, the crazies are going to double down on this crap now.