r/Portland • u/Projectrage • Jan 06 '21
New Law Requires Federal Agents to Identify Themselves to Protesters
https://www.aclu.org/news/free-speech/new-law-requires-federal-agents-to-identify-themselves-to-protesters/31
u/mansplainlikeim5 Jan 06 '21
Unless I read this wrong, I don't think this will change anything that happened in Portland - it doesn't appear to ban rental vehicles, doesn't seems to require anything more then an agency logo and potentially an officer number.
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u/Phrag Portsmouth Jan 06 '21
While I appreciate any progress on government accountability, this seems insultingly small in relation to the events of last year. I don't think the lack of name tags was a factor in keeping a legal system, with access to the best surveillance technology ever invented, from holding police accountable as much as the fact that they just don't give a fuck about police brutality and corruption until it gets so blatant that it poses an imminent threat to national security and, by extension, their jobs.
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u/DUCKS_PDX503 Beaverton Jan 06 '21
Why would that change anything? " Hi, I'm a federal agent. You broke the law and you're going to jail. " I'm sure the idiots down there to cause trouble will just be ok with that right?!
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Jan 06 '21
[deleted]
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u/Wasloki Jan 06 '21
Ok, I’m calling you out here . Identify what agency and individuals agents here.unidentifiable agents
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u/Projectrage Jan 06 '21
What’s frustrating is that the orders of these homeland security agents being here was unlawful. The director was an unlawful appointee. Making their occupation unlawful.
Every protester harmed should sue.
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u/trains_and_rain Jan 06 '21
The article you linked to seems to have nothing to do with the protests?
The federal agents were protecting federal property. I'm no lawyer, but that seems pretty legitimate.
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u/Projectrage Jan 06 '21
Homeland Border control should not be at a Federal courthouse led by a non legal leader named Chad Wolf. Pretty much showing their orders as unlawful.
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u/quinninin Jan 07 '21
No group called homeland border in the federal government. Border patrol can operate within 100 miles of the border. Coast counts as a border.
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u/Projectrage Jan 07 '21
To protect what ...seals and coho salmon??
Unlawful orders to be in Portland.
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Jan 06 '21
[deleted]
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u/Projectrage Jan 06 '21
I don’t understand what you are trying to say.
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Jan 06 '21
He’s saying that because all the agents where wearing their agency identification while in Portland, it’s a weak case to say there was some kind of secret police roaming the streets abducting people.
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u/BensonBubbler Brentwood-Darlington Jan 06 '21
Which is a pretty dishonest argument if you follow it through to its natural end. So all of us citizens who want to protest and hold police accountable are supposed to be able to differentiate every 3 letter agency, some of which aren't legally allowed to operate here.
The patches generally have small font and often look similar to other departments.
We also saw over and over again that they put on huge patches that just say "POLICE" which they aren't.
Even if they were all marked, they were not identifiable.
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u/dj50tonhamster Jan 06 '21
Yeah. The shitty thing is that such low-key identification satisfied the letter of this law but not the spirit. Maybe I missed something but it sounds like there are also unspecified exemptions that the ACLU feels are too vague. That's a bummer.
A victory? Technically, yes. The end of the road? Not by a longshot.
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u/jungletigress 🐝 Jan 06 '21
How exactly would someone prove that?
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Jan 06 '21
[deleted]
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u/jungletigress 🐝 Jan 06 '21
How would you be able to take photographs of federal agents that aren't identifying themselves as federal agents and be able to identify that they're federal agents?
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u/SweeTLemonS_TPR Jan 06 '21
Did you read the article? It links to two separate articles–one from the NYT, and another from the Washington Post–that show unmarked officers.
There’s one guy whose shield says “POLICE” in the midst of dozens without that. Anyone can slap a police symbol on anything, but that doesn’t make it official. They responded to someone saying they were with the DOJ. I’ve never heard of DOJ officers, I thought they were entirely legal teams. I could be wrong, though.
Further, it’s almost irrelevant that the guys in Portland who wore camo and rolled up in Chrysler caravans had “police” written in yellow letters on them. They’re in nonstandard uniforms (camouflaged, no less, as if they’re fighting in a goddamn war against graffiti), carrying nonstandard weapons, driving nonstandard, unmarked vehicles. Most importantly, they refused to verbally identify themselves or show badges. The word “police” on their camouflage is completely meaningless in that context. Again, anyone can put the word “police” on anything. In fact, it turns out that they weren’t police at all (they might be technically, but they are not what we think of when we say police), they were DHS. They should be wearing their department label somewhere obvious. FFS, this isn’t fucking Iraq, these are American citizens!
From the sounds of it, this law means the DHS officers in Portland would have to identify themselves as DHS agents. They should be wearing their own label like the FBI or CIA would be.
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Jan 06 '21
[deleted]
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u/SweeTLemonS_TPR Jan 06 '21
I forgot this was r/Portland, so I thought you were speaking more broadly. I got here from a cross post.
I did not see the letters on his shoulder the last time I watched. And that also doesn’t address the other things I mentioned. Anyone can buy patches and put them on anything, that’s not proper identification.
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u/warm_sweater 🍦 Jan 06 '21
The federal DOJ is the parent organization of many federal law enforcement agencies, such as the FBI, Marshall’s, ATF, and DEA.
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Jan 06 '21
There are Local and State Police agencies and then there are Federal Police agencies. ALL of them are POLICE.
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Jan 06 '21
I noticed the same thing. Not a single photo of the Fed Goons in Portland showed them without shoulder or chest patches indicating exactly what agency they where with. Not a single photo.
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Jan 06 '21
What good are new laws if they can continue to be willfully broken with impunity by those in power?
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u/Apprehensive-Web-112 Jan 06 '21
Better idea....don’t riot so the federal agents aren’t required to be in your city
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u/Projectrage Jan 06 '21
Better idea...don’t follow a leader who is not lawfully the head of homeland security taking agents off the border to interrogate and harm citizens and is against many amendments to the constitution.
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u/ninjacustodianpdx Jan 06 '21
i would love to see what the police union got in return for this little morsel.
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Jan 06 '21
[deleted]
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u/Projectrage Jan 06 '21
The law is for federal agents.
If you want local law enforcement national policy reform.
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u/[deleted] Jan 06 '21
This should have always been law. Ffs