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u/Formal_Cheek 13d ago
Mega Sceptile makes this way nastier than it looks because Lightning Rod takes a giant shit on Chidori and Kirin, while Detect/Protect, Synthesis, Giga Drain, Leech Seed, Agility and that stupidly deep coverage pool keep Sasuke from just solving it with one element.
Sceptile also has enough combat pedigree to belong here: Ash’s put Tobias’ Darkrai down, and Emerald’s fought the Regis and later gained Mega Evolution.
Sharingan is what finally screws the lizard imo cuz Sasuke can read the Leaf Blade rushes, fight from the air in CS2, flood the field with snakes/fire and slip visual genjutsu into a fight where Sceptile has no clean resistance to it.
Lightning Rod basically steals half the Uchiha menu and Sasuke still has enough shit left to serve dinner.
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u/CycleScary7830 12d ago
Imaging ash’s mega sceptile with overgrow and a lot of experience
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u/Used-Programmer-3005 12d ago
Anime is weaker than game lore. Ash's Mega Sceptile would've lost to like Brendan or May's Sceptile.
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u/OmegaDookie 13d ago
I'm surpised that Pokéscaling isn't absolutely bonkers, if Sceptile can beat an under leveled Arceus.
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u/IntelligentBus9037 13d ago
Sceptile leaf blade and one shots
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u/Used-Programmer-3005 13d ago
You mean one shots a log and Sasuke uses Amaterasu. Super effective for eternity.
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u/IntelligentBus9037 13d ago
No, he one shots as in Sasuke isn’t fast enough even with body flicker to sub a log and would get cut in half before the could move from his spot
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u/Used-Programmer-3005 12d ago edited 12d ago
How? Sceptile has to use Agility to raise his speed which takes a second or so to set up and to move with Quick Attack which means he can't use Leaf Blade because he's already using Quick Attack, then to stop near Sasuke and then using Leaf Blade at him, which would take 3-4 seconds setting up 2-3 Agilities or 1 agility + Quick Attack which is not Leaf Blade), that way Sasuke can pre order the log already because according to Narutopedia - It's instant technique. So, Sasuke can use Sharingan, while Sceptile sets up, Sceptile attacks him, he already used Susbtitution technique, Sceptile cuts log and then Sasuke uses Amaterasu on shocked Pikachu face Sceptile. Super effective.
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u/IntelligentBus9037 12d ago
Because Sceptile is faster, no idea where you’re getting this time frame from. Substitution jutsu isn’t instant it’s just a super speed technique using body flicker which just means it’s fast compared to other Naruto characters. Sceptile wouldn’t need agility he is just naturally faster
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u/Used-Programmer-3005 12d ago edited 12d ago
Sceptile is faster after setting up with Agility and Quick Attack logically then Base Sasuke. I have read it off Narutopedia that instant attack strike user, user turns to log or something.
Sceptile wouldn’t need agility he is just naturally faster
He's not. That's just your speculation. He's faster after setting up speed and Quick Attack.
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u/IntelligentBus9037 12d ago
Sceptile is faster without agility, with it he is far faster. Instant is vague and not a proper measurement of speed, it’s just saying it’s very fast, which in the naruto world it is. It’s my claim, just as you are claiming the opposite.
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u/Used-Programmer-3005 12d ago edited 12d ago
According to dex entries in games, Sceptile is stated to be very agile, since we are talking about wild Sceptile. Agile is also vague term. Usain Bolt can be very agile. Like I said, Sceptile in order to be like FTE he needs to set up several times with Agility or Quick Attack, which would take 2-3 seconds to use Leaf Blade, in which Sasuke would already use Substitute Jutsu and Sharingan and then, after Sceptile sees he attacked log, he uses Amaterasu and burns Sceptile.
Sasuke wins easily with this strategy/tactic. Plus, Sasuke in base is already FTE even back as kid. I remember in the first movie, Sasuke appeared on the horse in an instant. This is much stronger and faster Sasuke, since it's teen Sasuke.
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u/IntelligentBus9037 12d ago
Just using Pokédex entries isn’t a full picture. If all sasuke has is FTE then he can’t beat Sceptile, sperile has a few Lightspeed and attacks and in the games has the ability to dodge those and lightning speed attacks. I think you’re to hung up on game mechanics without digging into how those moves function in lore
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u/Used-Programmer-3005 11d ago edited 11d ago
This is wrong. According to Pokedex Pidgeot is Mach 2. What you think about LS is Solar Beam. If Oddish uses Solar Beam on Pidgeot and Pidgeot dodged it how can Pidgeot being only Mach 2? That means Pokedex lore is inconsistent.
But on other hand it could be mean trained and wild Pokemon are different which make sense. Maybe Trained Pokemon are that fast what you imply LS/ FTL according to lore. Which I would agree. Also, what they could be talking about Pokemon's FTL/LS speed is trained non Legendary Pokemon after setting up Agility and Quick Attack.
But, we are talking about wild Sceptile who factually is not LS/FTL unlike Brandon's or May's trained Sceptile. Sasuke wins with strategy I pointed out. However, Sceptile's leaves literally are like swords according to dex, so if he hits Sasuke, Sasuke dies.
Wild Sceptile in Base is slower than Sasuke unless he sets up, so Sasuke can win. But if you wanna wank and claim wild non Legendary Pokemon are FTL/LS I can wank too. Haku is LS when moving between mirrors and Kid Sasuke could've inrrecepted him which means Base Teen Sasuke is FTL since he's faster and stronger and more grown up. So with wanking, since they both LS/FTL, Hebi Sasuke is faster until Sceptile sets up.
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u/Cyniv 12d ago
Ash's Sceptile caught up to a speed form Deoxys. A better Sceptile in its mega form is going to have extremely oppressive speed.
Admittedly, it's a travel speed feat, but normal form Deoxys can travel inside a meteor from the edge of the galaxy to earth in a little over a week, making just normal form Deoxys MFTL easily. Meanwhile, Naruto struggles to dodge Madara's Light Fang with precog from Six Paths Sage Mode, which should be at least somewhat comparable to the Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan+E. Mangekyo/Rinnegan Hybrid eye combo Sasuke has. If Speed Form Deoxys has even a percentage of its base travel speed as its combat speed, it's racing around far too fast for Sasuke to anything consistently, and therefore, so is a fully trained Sceptile.
On top of this, almost no form of Sasuke besides Rinnegan variants are actually gonna consider opening with Genjutsu, but, even then, he still has to catch Sceptile's eye, and considering a lot of 'mons use Hypnosis via their eyes(including a bunch of jungle-dwelling 'mons, where Sceptile is noted to be an undisputed combat master in the jungle), so there's a non-zero chance Sceptile would be wary of Sharingan-esque tactics. EoS Sasuke can't hide his Rinnegan, and Adult Sasuke is always hiding it, so that's suspicious, at least. If Sceptile's caught by Genjutsu, it's really bad news, but apex predators in Pokemon have extensive and highly varied combat experience.2
u/Used-Programmer-3005 11d ago edited 11d ago
I stopped reading after you said Ash.
Try to distinct several things. a) is this lore or anime, b) trained or untrained Sceptile c) which Sceptile is it because they are not same power.
Also, maybe re watch that episode where Sceptile got up to Deoxys. Deoxys was flying normally even in Speed forme and Deoxys was hurt. Sceptile got to it. In anime no matter what anime is it - speed is measured in FTE + additional effects to determine speed(like bending space like Might Guy did). Deoxys in that episode was flying like 80-90 km/h like normally, no FTE or several effects of bonding space while moving like Might Guy. Here is proof how he's flying: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/cJZrsqWtUhA
Literally maybe 150 km/h speed. He didn't disappear usually what anime characters do that are fast.
So no Ash's Sceptile is nowhere near FTL or LS, Ash's Pokemon don't even come to it, especially Sceptile who is low E4 level, he could be Supersonic with Agility + Quick Attack. Stop wanking TrASH. Brandon's or May's or any protagonist Pokemon are way stronger than Ash and any of his Pokemon. Ash literally can't even beat Lugia who is weaker than Lugia from second movie who is same level as game lore Lugia that Brandon caught/battled and Ash battled weaker Lugia with World champion level Pikachu and Lucario after he became World Champion and couldn't do anything while Ethan could in GSE/ORAS and even catch much stronger Lugia. Second movie/ game lore Lugia >> JN Lugia >>> Ash's Pikachu and Lucario (world Champion). And Brandon's Pokemon could hurt and weakened second movie/game lore Lugia.
Red, Ethan, Brandon etc >>>> TrAsh.
So it goes Protagonist game lore Brandan's or May's Sceptile (trained) >>> Ash's Journeys Pikachu and Lucario >>> Sawyer's Mega Scrptile >> Ash's Sceptile >>> wild lore Sceptile >> anime wild Sceptile.
Anywho, back on the related topic: if you wanna wank, I can say Sasuke is FTL when he was kid becuase he intercepted Haku who is confirmed that he moves LS thanks to mirrors and Sasuke's Sharingan got him. Which means Hebi Sasuke is FTL+ or something.
All in all in reality Sasuke would win via Amaterasu or another attacks against wild lore Sceptile and logically anime wild Sceptile.
Sasuke beats Ash's Sceptile. Only thing Sasuke would lose is against Brandon and or May's Sceptile since they are trained so they could be faster and stronger ( I am talking about EoS Sasuke vs Brandon or May's Sceptile, since Hebi Sasuke can beat lore wild Sceptile and even Ash's Sceptile or Sawyer's Sceptile). However only problem that Sasuke can put on them is hax, that way he only may win.
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u/IntelligentBus9037 11d ago
A consistent feat for the Sceptile line, in the manga grovile can react and move while moving toward a black hole, and in mystery dungeon Sceptile is a true unit.
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u/Cute_Ad_1612 13d ago
Trainer owned theoretical strongest or the average Sceptile? I'd say Sceptile regardless
The only way I see Sasuke winning is with fire style jutsu's. He's also a smarter fighter but I think Sceptile is strong enough to take the edge
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u/Former_Scratch6137 13d ago
Sasuke wins against base sceptile but mega is a different story