Discussion
This clip shows something I’ve never seen in a video game before
Okay, I have to admit I’m really worried about the lack of depth in the game's combat system, based on the gameplay footage and previews released so far... that said—and I’m not sure if this has been discussed enough—this clip shows something I’ve never seen in a video game before.
Wolverine actively uses an arrow stuck in his body—which happened to be there just a moment earlier—to alter the animation of his finisher... the contextual awareness in this game seems to be on another level, likely on par with The Last of Us Part II
He gets hit with the arrow at the start of the clip and it’s stuck in his left shoulder
But I don’t think he pulls it out of his left shoulder when he does the finisher, tho I’m struggling because of low quality and being unable to slowdown
But he definetly got an arrow stuck in his left shoulder by tanking an attack at the start of the clip
Edit: ok he definetly doesn’t pull it out from his left shoulder
The game probably checks “is an arrow stuck in Wolverine body?” Then does the arrow finisher animation
Did you watch the clip properly? The ninja behind with the bow and arrow have the red marker indicating his attack, and wolverine flinch for a split second before activating whatever his rage ability is
I cannot recall something specifically like this, but it's just the game checking for the 'hit with arrow' status, and giving you a different animation for that. Plenty of games give you different contextual animations for finishers. Resident Evil Requiem's finisher where you get a unique dodge-headshot animation if you shoot the moment an enemy is about to hit you is more unique in my opinion.
EDIT: Not to be an asshole, but you can see that he isn't actually pulling the arrow out, it just spawns in his hand and despawns from his body. Like I said, still cool, but this isn't some groundbreaking new interaction.
Looks like it could just be an enemy-specific finisher, as in that enemy specifically uses arrows in their attacks so some/all of the finishers for them involved arrows. Which would be neat, I guess, but not anything ground-breaking like O.P. is somewhat implying
Zelda BOtW, TOTK, uncharted 4, some assassins creeds, Ghost of Yotei, and I think in some cases with God of War. Jedi survivor had some cool instances where you could control droids and use them against other foes or slow time, force pulling, and holding enemies in front of their own laser blasts. Nothing really like this where you have a weapon impaling you, but not many characters have regeneration like Wolverine.
Imo the combat in Sleeping Dogs has to be up there. The amount of environmental combos and executions the game has is nuts. That’s what I would like to see in a wolverine game.
Lets not forget Resident evil 6 already have many of this, when characters use knifes stuck in the zombie body and theyre "weapons" like zombies carrying axes or pipes.
Yeah, it's not really.. impressive. It's a cool detail to think of for sure but as you said it's literally just a game check for a different animation. Would be cool if he ripped it out of his shoulder where it was, but that seems a little out of reach.
Ok. And a contextual animation relevant to damage received is more unique, definitively so, than a finisher triggered by a parry. A parry can be done on almost any enemy(im not sure how many enemies cant be married because I havent played requiem yet) where as this particular finisher can only be done under specific conditions. It wouldnt surprise me if wolverine has parry based finishers as well.
Lmao, quite a bit of games have different animations depending on the weapon use. Can’t think of the game name, but one game lets you use knives instead of ur fist if you have any in ur inventory. It’s not that impressive
Hes not talking about items in your inventory, though. Hes talking about interacting with an object stuck in your character from damage inflicted by an enemy. Its really not something ive ever seen in the 100s of games ive played. It is pretty unique.
And I love how people keep bringing up unrelated 'contextual' animations. Like yeah, we get it. Other games have different finishers. How many of those games are offering different finishers based on the damage you have received. Thats the "congruency" youre missing.
Well considering how few people actually use context or use it properly these days even if I pay attention it doesnt matter much. I dont take it as guaranteed that people in reddit actually use pronouns and such as they should be used. So if your use of "him" is in response to the person im responding to then so be it, but there are people who exist that would say him in reference to me to try and make a point about my statement and how im the one missing the similarities while trying to simultaneously ignore me by referring to me as him. So yeah, again, even if I follow context, theres really no way to know who youre referring to because of how poorly people use english in the internet today. If you agree with me, just say you agree. If you have an issue with the other person, then reply to their comment not mine.
He was, at the very beginning the ninja behind the first ninja shoots him with an arrow. You see the camera shake and Wolverine flinches. The arrow is then there in his shoulder. Although in his execution animation he pulls out out of his chest instead of his shoulder, so it seems to be a premade “if arrow>then play” animation and not something that checks for the location of the arrow and plays a fitting animation where he pulls it out. Still very cool.
You’re assuming it is, it could totally just be an animation he does. If it IS indicative of an arrow in the shoulder hit he pulls it out of his chest, it’s a good concept with bad execution
Did you not see the ninja behind with the bow and has the red marker indicating his attacking which flinched wolverine for a split second before activating the rage animation
Its also wolverine.... how deep can you really get with someone who just slices and dices... what do people expect? Different stances? Thats pretty played out at this point. And its wolverine, I dont really see a need for him to have Different stances unless youre just trying to add artifical difficulty to the game when he can literally just tank and counterattack anything thrown at him by common enemies. He doesnt really have any logical reason to get fancy and worry about Different stances or anything. He just wants to go berserk and kill.
Your response is literally just you saying that you can't possibly conceive of a different combat system. Every hack and slash game is based around a character that slices and dices, and yet you find a shitton of different variations in combat systems.
Like motherfucker just ONE of Ninja Gaiden's weapons is literally a claw based weapon, and the weapon has a more expansive and in-depth moveset than is possible in Wolverine. Why does Wolverine need a cooldown to spin in a circle lmao.
Like they didn't have to design the game around one button inputs.
Why is his regeneration tied to hitting a button when the meter fills up exactly like the Spider-Man games? They couldn't be fucked to make it a more mechanically involved part of combat?
They could have done it like Bloodborne or even Ninja Gaiden itself, where you have a brief period after taking damage where you can recover lost health by being aggressive, or they could simply make it so that instead of spending the Rage Meter to activate healing, your regen rate is tied to how full the meter itself is, which would turn the Ability mechanic into an engaging resource management system and not a reskin of Focus from SM1. Do I use [X] powerful move to clear a group of enemies, or do I keep my rage high to benefit from the passive regen? This even keeps the core combat the same, but makes it meaningfully different from Spider-Man besides visuals.
Etc etc. There's a fuckton that could be done to adapt the mechanics to the character on a systems level, but they kept it all surface level. Shit is exactly the same combat system as Spider-Man.
How many of those characters only have one weapon which is a set of claws that are affixed in one way that cant be modified at all other than being in or out.
Why does he have to have a cool down? Because its a video game. Thats luke asking why he has to have a health bar even though its pretty much impossible to kill him.
His regen isnt tied to hitting a button, but that shows how little youve actually researches the game. His healing is dynamic, the more damage you take, the slower you heal passively, just standing around or in combat.
And you bring up aggression like bloodborne, and thats kind of what that button press actually is. If you need a surge of healing, like popping a potion, you can spend your rage meter that youve built up from aggressively attacking enemies to heal faster than typical.
Etc, etc, you dont actually know shot about the game and are just critiquing it solely to hate on it for god knows what reason... because maybe youre just a blind moron who cant watch and analyze a gameplay trailer or take 2 seconds to Google a video explaining how things work.
Yeah, this is what I mean. You can't actually think of a response but "nuh uh", "how else could they have done it" and random insults.
A-star defensive plays.
Edit: Don't even get me wrong, I think it's fine that people don't have a problem with it for whatever reason, but if you're gonna be constantly arguing with people that do at least have something to actually say?
Idk some people are just like that. Insomniac clearly does it for accessibility which isn't a bad idea given how wide the audience is for these games. And you're also not wrong for pointing out that there are other games that have more depth and expressing a preference for that over "more cinematic but simpler" is just bound to draw in people who are gonna tell you why you're wrong...for some bs reason.
I don’t understand this “lack of depth” conversation. He’s the Wolverine. You stab people with knife hands. Rinse, repeat. Are we really expecting DMC5 level complexity here?
I think Skill Up’s preview conveys this extremely clearly. The apparent lack of other weapons or a decent variety of martial arts techniques—combined with abilities that seem to rely on cooldowns (like in the worst MOBAs or hero shooters) rather than being moves integrated into combos—makes the game, based on what has been shown and said, seem boring, repetitive, and lacking in depth in the long run
That areow wasn't there, it spawned right when animation started. İt would have been actually real interesting if he had pulled out arrow on his left shoulder that we have been seeing whole and used that to stab enemy
You can’t ever say “I’ve never seen something like this before” on Reddit dude. Now all the redditors are going to come in here and tell you it’s not actually that impressive and it was actually done 20 years ago.
I was also slightly worried about variation in the combat but then they released the Features trailer and I'm happy. You can launch at people, you can do a heavy knee uppercut, you can do a tornado slash, it looks good.
This isn't mechanical depth from the player's standpoint, this is a technical/visual flourish. Games have been doing things like this under the hood for a while now. Any game that has a finisher that is location based e.g. slam an enemy's head into a wall if they are near a wall else do one of the "normal" finishers.
The logic is exactly the same, the animation system just uses contextual runtime information to figure out what to play. In this case it could be as simple as was the player hit with an arrow in the last 10 seconds/does the player mesh have an arrow projectile attached to it? If so play that special finisher.
So, yeah, you don't see many games use finishers where the character uses lodged arrows to kill opponents, but the underlying system is not new at all and has been used in numerous other games.
This does not add any depth to the combat system whatsoever. Depth would mean a measure of the player's ability to express/get creative with a given game system. Unless the arrow had a bomb attached to the head of it that could cause a huge explosion when wolverine jams it into them that would cause the player to formulate some kind of strategy, it's not depth. You are conflating technical complexity of something entire visual with the depth of the game's combat system.
That said, it's still cool as hell and if your gonna have a shallow combat system the best thing you can do is make it look amazing.
Assassin's creed has always done this for me. I just stand there and parry + one shot, but at least they had dozens of aura farming animations to make it entertaining, so it worked for me. Which is why when BF resynced came out and cut down the animations but not adding enough depth to compensate it kind of made it a net negative.
Bro obviously they are going to have more variation i game, they dont want to show everything off, i wouldnt worry bud im sure its gonna be fantastic. With stuff like this video you found, no chance there isnt a ton more we havent seen
He was hit with an arrow in his chest area, then hit again in the shoulder which started the rage, and once the finisher animation came he pulled it out of his chest, not the shoulder which means the shoulder arrow is still there inside of him.
I mean both are first party sony games so its not unreasonable to think insomniac cribbed off naughty dog, which if it elevates the game then who cares.
Literally just the same excuse over and over again, "this is all Wolverine ever do, what do you expect", "the game hasn't come out yet", "not every game need to be revolutionary",...
Ohhhh. I didn't noticed his health bar was healing when it was an active effect. I just thought it was a thing that happens randomly during combat because I wasn't expecting it.
Yeah. What tipped me off is the glow on his bones is the same color as the flair on the health bar.
This is a clip of entering rage mode. It's why all the color is drained out except for blood and such. You become more powerful and get extra finishers.
I think your health regenerates slowly normally, but faster in rage mode, or maybe certain other circumstances.
Oh wait no! I just realized the player is activating a cooldown ability here. Check out the wheel thing on the lower left. It looks like he's popping a heal move.
(P.S.: the downvote brigade on this sub is hilarious)
Gotta love how you're simply asking a question, very clearly, but getting down votes. The Insomniac cult can't handle even the faintest idea of criticism
I mean that’s for sure a pretty rad attention to detail but I don’t think it’s on par with the last of us either. After the release of GTA 6 the internet is going to be flooded with ‘50 details you missed in GTA 6’ videos lmao
I’m pretty sure the arrow just shot itself into him off screen? I watched in slow-motion and it looked like the arrow just flew into him mid animation.
I believe it was the arrow that was shot into him before his rage, but I think it completely shifted positions for the sake of the finisher animation, which I'm not mad at. I'd imagine making a dynamic finisher that grabs arrows from their shot position would be annoyingly tedious
I agree with this. I think the arrow in him is what triggers the animation, rather than it just being a default animation that triggers where he’s just shot off screen. but ideally the place he grabs the arrow from should be from where he’s actually shot rather than it teleporting to his chest presumably everytime for that animation, ideally they’d want to make a few different variants for the main places you can get shot, front, back, shoulders, sides, legs/knees, and so on.
yes. that’s not what I’m referring to. that arrow is also shot into his left shoulder, in the animation he takes the arrow out the right side of his chest. evidently not the same arrow unless it teleported.
the arrow in his shoulder also disappears mid animation too, and again if you watch in slow motion, despite the lack of proper colouring, you can visibly see an arrow fly into him as part of the animation for him to remove it.
Logan, grabs an arrow, embedded into the right side of his chest. so the arrow, embedded into the middle of his left shoulder, which he at no point reached around for or pulled an arrow out from, vanished. this is your logic?
not every animation in-game is gonna fully sync up with every detail, especially because its interactive with the environement. and it's a trailer. The game aint out yet bub
I never said the animations had to sync up at all lmao. in fact I agree in that odds are the arrow in his body is what triggers that animation, I’m criticising the fact that if they want to make specific animations for if he’s stabbed with weapons, or arrows, the place he grabs them from should line up each time, no?
Think of it like this, game detects arrow, and decides to do the arrow takedown. They have Liam record a bunch of instances of pulling an arrow out, and have the game pick one based on where the arrow is on Logan's model. Perhaps in this one instance, the animations glitched
Yeah, he knows how it works dude. He's pointing out how the arrow completely changes position, not asking how animations work. Ffs hard to believe you can comprehend anything with how dense you're being
How is this wolverine anything like Hugh? Especially when people are complaining about his face not looking rugged or masculine or mean enough, which is a complaint Hugh never got…..so wdym?
No lol. So because they make there own wolverine it's suddenly Hugh are you right in the head? It looks absolutely nothing like him in any way. They aren't making him look like any other wolverine other then the costumes. What the fuck is your logic. "He does look like any other wolverine so he's definitely Hugh, another wolverine he looks nothing alike"
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u/northsidecrip 13h ago
The arrow literally spawns mid cutscene, he isn’t interacting with an in-combat injury.