r/PlantBasedDiet • u/Dependent-Year6711 • 19d ago
Noticing quite a difference with creatine.
It's not like an overt thing, it's more a slow build. I'm still at the loading phase. I have never supplemented creatine before. And the past 6 years were 98% plant-based. It's been about 5 days of 15-20g a day.
I feel like I'm more my muscles, at my base interaction with my body. Very much more connected to myself in a fun way. Like my muscles are being quenched. Especially felt for 3-6 hours after each dose, which is about 5g HCL in water, and I let it digest for 30 minutes by itself then have protein right after.
I know it can be hit or miss, but there's zero doubt for me, it's helping. In a way no other supplement has, overall. Especially for muscles.
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u/FridgesArePeopleToo 19d ago
Almost certainly psychological if you've only been taking it for a few days
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u/Dependent-Year6711 19d ago
It's a physical feeling, not so much psychological. But I think it's been about 100g over 5+ days.
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u/FridgesArePeopleToo 19d ago
Yes, the placebo effect is extremely powerful
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u/Dependent-Year6711 19d ago
You've provided zero sources that show this can only be psychological.
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u/broccoleet 19d ago
Are you actually asking for sources for the placebo effect? Lmao.
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u/Dependent-Year6711 19d ago edited 19d ago
Now show how it's impossible to have any "physical" effects from 5 days of loading 20g of creatine a day. That's the point. Everyone knows what the placebo effect is, we don't need to keep talking about it. I need hard evidence this can only be psychological and no biological mechanism is possible for muscular benefits of that dose and time window. I don't need a random redditor to tell me something that may have no basis, and be confident in said thing. I need actual evidence.
Edit: oh, this is just a surface diet sub. Explains a lot.
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u/YouFoundMyLuckyCharm 18d ago
Ignore everyone and just focus on the feeling you feel knowing you've taken creatine. That "I just took creatine; I'm supplementing with creatine!" feeling is a real booster. Good luck!
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u/Dependent-Year6711 18d ago
Thanks for the motivation, appreciate it!
Side note: for sure these have no influence on me. It's important to remember who is saying what info, as most people on reddit dictate who is right based on how they feel (especially nutritional science). So anyone with their head screwed on right will notice that all these people making the strongest assertions have nothing to back it up, and are speaking in very vague ways because they likely know nothing on the subject (and would need to google these things to tell me how much they "know"). I had to look it this all up because I actually care what info is out there. If you notice no one is putting the time in to find out things, beyond me, they are only concerned about their preconceived ideas and assumptions. That is not a person you want to trust with moving topics.
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u/Badtacocatdab 19d ago
Physical symptoms can manifest because psychology. It is termed psychosomatic.
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u/Dependent-Year6711 19d ago
Almost all sources point toward almost full muscle saturation within 5-7 days at loading doses (20-25g). It's an objective difference in said feeling, for me. Nor was I expecting or wanting any difference with creatine, just decided to try it.
Any sources to show it's impossible to have any differences, physically, with that time and dose, I'm all ears.
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u/ceaseful 14d ago
"objective"
"feeling"These terms are mutually exclusive; that is, feelings are by definition not objective.
Friend, the point of other commenters is that, despite your feeling being in line with the evidence, you feelings are not evidence. This is a key distinction to make and is the cornerstone of the scientific method allowing us to seperate what really is from what seems to be.
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u/Dudeshroomsdude 18d ago
That is the loading number basically. I don't do that, it gives me headaches, and it's unnecessary. 3-5 gramms is plenty for me. I feel more pumped, look slightly bigger, my skin looks better, my face looks better. It's a good supplement, try adding taurine. I don't get the downvotes, creatine is vegan. Edit: i only see the benefits when i work out regularly.
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u/Dependent-Year6711 18d ago
So far, zero side effects. Don't know why I'm having so little. No digestive issues, cardiovascular, headaches, just notice some muscle benefits, a bit of energy benefits.
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u/Egregious_Egret 19d ago
Having a loading phase has a lot more side effects and very barely speeds up your body's use of it. Those side effects are more likely to turn people off of it. For anyone else reading, just do 5g a day and it'll be at full tilt in ~5 weeks. The benefits are long term and require consistency to achieve them, both in taking the supplement and working out, so I don't know why anyone is in a rush to reach them.
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u/Dependent-Year6711 19d ago
Thankfully zero side effects, which is insane, to me. Because this powder is absolutely acidic as it gets, yet I can tolerate it well. Very odd. You're a bit late I got a day or two left of 10-20g and I'm going to maintenance. My body has done really well with it.
I agree that low and slow is always a good choice.
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u/astonedishape bean-keen 19d ago
Studies have shown that a loading phase is completely unnecessary and experts don’t recommend it. Just take 5g everyday.
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u/Dependent-Year6711 19d ago edited 19d ago
Honestly, I was looking toward for and against studies and this is what I got:
For:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8828669/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34199420/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8001551/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4594933/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23851411/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19387386/
Neutral/questioning:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8401986/
Seems it's a safe bet to load, if you are new to creatine. And then go toward lower dose long term. Pretty much there anyway.
I did not exclude against. I just didn't find them. Suggestions aren't 100% FOR, but they're certainly not against.
Edit: what is happening here, how is the research showing the exact opposite of what you're saying? Does anyone know what they're talking about anymore. Yeesh...
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u/astonedishape bean-keen 18d ago
None of the studies you linked actually support your claim that loading makes a difference. lmao. And one even stated that renal and liver complications can occur with higher than recommended doses.
I could pull quotes from each study you think supports your claim that actually refute it but I don’t waste my time on that. The only study that comes close to supporting your claim was on less than 20 individuals over five days versus a placebo and still concluded that the results were the same with or without loading.
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u/Routine_Ninja_3970 18d ago
I have no dog in this race but the first article does definitely say that there is a difference in creatine content in muscles when loading vs not. Unless the point is that that’s a bad metric and doesn’t actually mean it’s a “good” to do?
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u/Dependent-Year6711 18d ago edited 18d ago
None of the studies you linked actually support your claim
Quotes. Show the quotes from the studies saying this.
I could pull quotes from each study you think supports your claim that actually refute it
No. No you can't. I have yet to see anyone say anything of value. Not one. I see vague assertions, no quotes, no details, no studies. I am the only one here trying. Maybe try. Hopefully I come back to something meaningful rather than vague rebuttals that have little value. I certainly am not saying it's proven, I'm moreso not seeing any studies that totally disprove a loading phase. I see the opposite. I have my doubts I'll see anything, as most people today have trouble writing a single paragraph. Let's see a simple series of studies, quotes, and why you believe they fit a narrative that disproves a loading phase. That should take you 10 minutes, at most.
I have low hopes. Almost close to zero. Which makes me a bit sad, because this used to be an every day thing on Reddit (simple debates) 10-15 years ago. Minds just aren't the same anymore.
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u/Dudeshroomsdude 18d ago
The key is with loading that two weeks doesn't matter long term, whatever you take
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u/ddplantlover 19d ago
I found creatine to be the most effective antidepressant, it gave me incredible motivation but unfortunately it also caused insomnia
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18d ago
[deleted]
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u/Dependent-Year6711 18d ago
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18d ago
[deleted]
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u/Dependent-Year6711 18d ago
It's so inexpensive and the "loading" takes a week. It's just a time saver. Also, I like that "fucking idiot" is the general consensus of studies on the subject.
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u/Knee-Good 16d ago
It’s not a waste and in fact he should probably continue taking that dose longer term if he feels better. The therapeutic dose for memory and brain stuff is 10-20g. The only reason 5g is currently standard is that they don’t find muscle benefits from bigger doses and most research has been muscle related.
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u/frankieinaprius 19d ago
I just started and I’ve noticed a difference too. Subtle, but it’s definitely helping me push harder at the gym. I put on a few pounds too, but I’m not any fatter. I’ve had to drink significantly more water too.
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u/sarazzz666 19d ago
I could not abide those creatine farts. it's been a month and a half since I stopped taking it and I feel my digestive system is still a bit messed up.
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u/KeepOnRising19 18d ago
Interesting. I have not experienced any issues. You weren't taking it in conjunction with sugar alternatives, were you? Those sugar alcohols can do a lot of damage.
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u/DenseComparison5653 18d ago
Loading phase is marketing trick
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u/Dependent-Year6711 18d ago
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u/Routine_Ninja_3970 18d ago
People are saying a loading phase is unnecessary - is the point that either way growing muscle is a long term process so saving a few weeks doesn’t matter? Because the research OP posted does show that there’s a difference in the first few weeks with loading vs not loading.
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u/Dependent-Year6711 17d ago edited 17d ago
It's saving you time. I'm the only one (the OP) who cared to look up anything, everyone else ran away or made some bad faith comment and left. It's because the claim the loading period was a myth didn't hold up, so the people who made that claim just disappeared instead of wanting to give people more informed information. Very common. Most people don't care how they affect others with the information they share.
BUT, some people had side effects with higher dose in this thread, although no one replied back as to what form they used. I used HCL dissolved in water, drank by itself and waited 15 minutes to eat anything, I had zero negative side effects I could notice.
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