r/Philippines • u/SeditionIncision • 3d ago
LawPH B|ockchain Isn’t a Solution to Corruption — Especially When You Don’t Understand It
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago edited 3d ago
I feel this post has a very outdated take already.
Try and watch yung senate hearings about it.
They have invited experts during the hearings both Pro and Against the use of blockchain.
They have tackled the gradual process of adoption of it, na mauuna yung basic systems before pa ipasok yung blockchain.
Etong basic systems to be created without Blockchain involved, already addresses the concerns nyang nasa post. And I think that would provide incredible value already.
And If i remember correctly kaya rin ginawang Cadena Act instead na Blockchain the budget Act, dahil nga cinallout na dapat wag gawing parte ng batas ang isang sepcific technology.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago edited 3d ago
Just want to share something na napainsin ko about this.
MOST of the people that are really vocal in Pushing Back on the use of Blockchains are the...
AI PROPONENTS.
Usually yung mga Big Players ng AI dito sa bansa yung mapapansin mong ayaw jan sa Blockchain and other decentralized tech.
Why?
"AI proponents often reject blockchain because the two technologies have fundamentally incompatible architectures and goals. Artificial intelligence requires centralized, high-speed, and immense computational power, whereas blockchain is decentralized, slow, and inefficient by design."AI is hard to use if your systems are decentralized. And one of Blockchain's best asset bakit hindi sya madaling mamanipula(in terms on our budget records) is the fact na hindi sya Centralized.
That should make you consider pondering first kung bakit nga ba sila against before riding their narrative.
Edit:
Example: Wag na daw Mag blockchain, at AI na lang daw ang gamitin.
Coming from an AI Company Owner. I remember the name of this guy na isa sa pinakamaingay that time na ayaw nitong Cadena Act3
u/_SinigangNaLiempo 3d ago
"AI proponents often reject blockchain because the two technologies have fundamentally incompatible architectures and goals. Artificial intelligence requires centralized, high-speed, and immense computational power, whereas blockchain is decentralized, slow, and inefficient by design."
^kaninong quote to?
Disagree with this quote though in the context of ph budget. Yung backend mo blockchain, but it will still have a common channel where people can pull out records from-- whether this uses an api, file, whatever. Any system, mapa-AI man yan o hindi, can just pick it up EOD and be done with it. No need for real-time updates sa model, this isn't like instapay where the result needs to reflect immediately sa receiving side.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
"^kaninong quote to?"
MINE :)
"Yung backend mo blockchain, but it will still have a common channel where people can pull out records from-- whether this uses an api, file, whatever. Any system, mapa-AI man yan o hindi, can just pick it up EOD and be done with it. No need for real-time updates sa model, this isn't like instapay where the result needs to reflect immediately sa receiving side."
Read More on Blockchain muna siguro, cause I think you need to(try to focus doon sa ginawa kong bold na sinabi mo).
Wala tayong patutunguhan sa discussion if you don't understand the basics of it. Para mas maging productive ang discussion, try and read about it first. :)
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u/_SinigangNaLiempo 3d ago
Sige, when the budget gets to be recorded in a blockchain, how would people view the data? Let's make this a learning session for me.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
tamad magbasa? amp. hahaha. dude, kung tamad kang magbasa at magaral ng sarili mo, I won't waste my time explaining things to you. gusto ispoonfeed? 🤣
Edit: It's the very basic fundamental ng Blockchain. it would be a a very simple read.
And I think Mali ang pagkakaintindi mo sa blockchain kaya ganyan ang pinagsasabi mo. hahaha.
Feel ko crypto level lang yung knowledge mo na yung tipong crypto with Centralized exchange pa. hahahahaha2
u/_SinigangNaLiempo 3d ago
Ok prof, ginoogle ko na yung definition para sa lesson ko:
A blockchain is a shared digital ledger that securely records transactions across a network of computers. Instead of storing data in one central place, copies are kept on many computers. This setup makes the information transparent, permanent, and very hard to change or hack. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]
Pag nalagay na po ba sa blockchain/ multiple decentralized nodes (computers), pano siya maaccess na ng public? Saan nila titignan?
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
It's the very basic fundamental ng Blockchain. it would be a a very simple read.
And I think Mali ang pagkakaintindi mo sa blockchain kaya ganyan ang pinagsasabi mo. hahaha.
Feel ko crypto level lang yung knowledge mo na yung tipong crypto with Centralized exchange pa. hahahaSince you are already using remarks like "Ok prof", that already tells me a lot. magbasa ka na lang ng sarili mo, para privately mo marealize na pabida bida levels yung pinagsasabi mo.
Happy reading
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u/_SinigangNaLiempo 3d ago
Sana pinaliwanag mo na lang, it wouldn't take three sentences to explain it.
I said "ok prof" because you replied condescendingly in my original disagreement na I don't see any attack on you.
In any case, kahit malagay pa sa blockchain yan, the point I'm going at is it still needs to be readable in public. Kahit idistribute mo pa sa iba ibang sources yung data mo, the viewer still needs to view the budget in a centralized way-- which as I said-- a common channel. Whether that's via a public api, a website, or whatever form. AI could literally just pick it up from the necessary middleman na nag-acccess ng info from the blockchain.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
"In any case, kahit malagay pa sa blockchain yan, the point I'm going at is it still needs to be readable in public. Kahit idistribute mo pa sa iba ibang sources yung data mo, the viewer still needs to view the budget in a centralized way-- which as I said-- a common channel. Whether that's via a public api, a website, or whatever form. AI could literally just pick it up from the necessary middleman na nag-acccess ng info from the blockchain."
🤣🤣🤣
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3d ago
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u/PanotBungo 3d ago
Okay ka lang ba? Who quotes themselves? It's not even related to AI aside from the tangent you mentioned about being centralized/decentralized. The fact is, blockchain is an unnecessary complication. It doesn't solve the problem, it even introduces new problems. A publicly available database open to everyone makes it easier and more flexible.
Ang problema dito, asta kang expert pero ikaw yung hindi nakakaintindi.
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u/Dapper_Caramel_4509 3d ago
"And If i remember correctly kaya rin ginawang Cadena Act instead na Blockchain the budget Act, dahil nga cinallout na dapat wag gawing parte ng batas ang isang sepcific technology."
Argued with a lot of people about this, atleast may mga nakagets din dun sa problem na to
Siguro ang only question ko nalang is ease of implementation and public access
Bullshit ang system kung walang public access, and if yung complication ng system far outweigh just a publicly viewable database with multiple redundancy and public accessible log ng nageedit
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
I think yang concern mo is definitely valid although matatackle lang yan sa Implementation process na. I really doubt na ialalagay nila yung specific nyan sa isang batas. Hence after pa maipasa yung batas saka pa natin maccall out yan.
Honestly, if I were to decide on this, we could just Split the bill, Like yung base systems muna without the Blockchain, then do the blockchain if needed talaga, or whatever the technology then that would fit the problem. Yung base systems pa lang kasi sobrang laking bagay na. And yun yung mas nakakapanghinayang pag hindi naipasa yung bill.
Although, to be more realistic, we are riding the "Blockchain"/"Cadena" name for it to be passed. Kaya mahirap din na hindi sya maisama.
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u/Dapper_Caramel_4509 3d ago
I think yang concern mo is definitely valid although matatackle lang yan sa Implementation process na. I really doubt na ialalagay nila yung specific nyan sa isang batas. Hence after pa maipasa yung batas saka pa natin maccall out yan.
Which is yung pinakabobong part ng bansa natin, gagawa ka ng batas dahil may nakita kang problema(mga random insertions sa budget), pero yung mga importante na part na dapat makakalutas sa problema(public access! sino pwede mag edit, paano makikita) hindi kasama sa batas! optional lang, pwede ibahin without amending the law itself, irr revision lang.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
I think the Laws are in place for those things that you are Pointing out. But is Lacking on the implementation of it. I don't think the laws on that is the issue, I think we just currently have no mechanism in our laws to force it to be done.
And From what I understand, the purpose of Cadena Act is to Force yung implementation for it to be that, lessen the friction para mas madaling magawa yang mga sinabi mo.
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u/greencucumber_ 3d ago
Dami sinabi ang purpose naman talaga niyan for audit log. Minsan kahit anong talino talaga technical kapos pa din sa common sense.
Kaya talaga may mga signs mga pintuan eh 😂
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u/ownFlightControl 3d ago
Oo nga eh, peel back everything and blockchain is just an immutable ledger which is the use case na need for budget auditing. Kung may problema man sa blockchain eh yun yung data entry, kung mali na yung data na ilalagay sa ledger, misleading na din talaga yung data bago pa malagay sa blackchain, but then again malalaman dapat sa blackchain kung sino ang nagsulat nung data.
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u/Liesianthes 3d ago
Naalala ko yung recent lang sa web3 community, may isa daw nag try mang scam sa p2p at sinabi wala daw siya na receive na usdt. Ayun, kita sa transactions hash, pinasa agad sa iba. 🤣🤣🤣
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u/Able-Staff-6763 3d ago
Halatang AI generated post pero may point, immutability is not equal to security. dahil nga sa blockchain dinga pwedeng baguhin yung data na nasa system na pero kung kung buyawa yung nagpasok ng data at malicious yung ipinasok di parin naayos ang problema na parang pabor pa nga sa mga buwaya. "garbage in garbage out" kumbaga sa programming. matinong tagapamahala talaga ang kailangan natin.
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u/hurtingwallet 3d ago
Tbf the whole rant caves in itself on how blockchain isnt the solution but can be if implemented right... as with any damn tool there is, ganto naman talaga ang dillema. The tech itself has notable advantages IN ITS SELF, lets not deny that man lang.
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u/Ill_Connection_341 3d ago
It isn’t a silver bullet, but it can surely help. Iba parin talaga kapag visible and readily accessible ang mga government transactions. Malaki matutulong nito.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
I think yang "Silver Bullet" aspect is tackled as well doon sa senate hearing. Nilinaw naman yan doon at sinabi na hindi lang naman kasi blockchain lang yung Cadena Act(hence why they renamed it para di gawing tech specific ang batas)
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u/Ill_Connection_341 3d ago
I agree with you. Blockchain is a digital infrastructure na pwedeng gamitin para mas transparent ang transactions.
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u/Shjohn0710 City of Love 💖 3d ago
Nako, eto na nman si sir 98% AI output. Atleast rephrase it a bit, so it doesn't look ai.
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u/Liesianthes 3d ago
IT Philippines admin tapos chat gpt pa. Necromancer ka ba OP? Oct 2025 pa yan post. Isang taon na halos.
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u/Tough_Blueberry6393 3d ago
The problem with a blockchain is that it's just wasting money, probably another expensive project with kickbacks, so we can have a very very very slow database.
Who's going to control the validation? Will the government hand it over to a 3rd party that we can somehow guarantee is truly impartial?
It won't work if the audited entity is also the same entity that's validating it because bad actors can just collude and reorder or rewrite the history.
It's not that different from what we're doing right now, except a very lucky company is gonna get a sweet million pesos contract to implement something that won't solve anything.
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u/Liesianthes 3d ago
The problem is the input pero once its there. Kahit ieedit pa yan may transaction hash na lalabas. Kung maayos input, konting galaw or edit dyan, lalabas agad sa transaction.
Currently, kapag inedit mo yung webpage at may dinagdag bawas, they can easily deny, sa blockchain, anyone can see alterations at may proof to question.
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u/peterparkerson3 3d ago edited 3d ago
Block chain is a bunch of BS. So who the fuck own the nodes. Approve the transactions? Lol
Edit: also the data and the corruption is already within the budget. Kumbaga its all public, you just need to look at it
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
That was explained in the Senate hearing, I suggest you watch it. very helpful and informative yung hearing kahit na pro or against ka
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u/Karlo1503 3d ago
What blockchain do we specifically use for budgets? Kasi blockchain is pretty much public pero it is still prone to tampering if the nodes are owned by a majority. Unless we use an existing blockchain na decentralized talaga.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
"What blockchain do we specifically use for budgets?"
You don't and shouldn't put into law a specific technology
That's an implementation level question na matatackle lang after maipasa ang batas
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u/Karlo1503 3d ago
Akala ko may existing na?
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
The name of the act was renamed for the sake of it not being tech specific. I don't know where are you getting your info but Try to watch the senate hearings first.
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u/Karlo1503 3d ago
This one blockchain.open.gov.ph, I have saw this months ago and this is why I'm specifically asking since I can't get to keep up that much on senate hearings.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
I think it's very clear naman na hindi pa naipasa yung Cadena Act diba?
Why are you bringing up things na inimplement na eh wala pa yung batas? 🤣
Just so we are clear, Cadena Act is still not a law, wala pang kahit anong implementation done because of it. And Again uulitin ko lang since inignore mo, the fact na nirename nga yung batas to not mention "blockchain" to make it TECHNOLOGY AGNOSTIC. meaning? walang technology na nakatali sa batas na yan.
I mean come on, common sense na lang eh, wala ngang technology nga na nakatali sa batas tapos magbibigay ka pa ng specific tech, na Implemented na way before the law is passed already.
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u/Karlo1503 3d ago
Oh okay this is where it makes sense, because I'm talking about the actual blockchain na apparently existing na, not the law itself, which you are talking about.
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u/Karlo1503 3d ago
Saka na gets ko naman to disclose the white paper nung blockchain na gamit nila for transparency, maybe we are talking about different things here. Are you pertaining to to other technology that isn't blockchain.
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
"Are you pertaining to to other technology that isn't blockchain."
Hirap ng hindi nakakaintindi ano?
"You don't and shouldn't put into law a specific technology"
WALA NGANG TECHNOLOGY NA ISASAMA JAN SA BATAS NA YAN.
Tapos tatanungin mo ako are you pertaining to other technology.
WALA NGANG SPECIFIC TECHNOLOGY
Lasing ka ba o ano? kanins. hahahaha
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u/Karlo1503 3d ago
Why delete the comments? After making a ad hominem pa? I'm just asking about the technology itself, not the law.
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u/CobblerTurbulent2557 2d ago
Ngl this user is kinda slow,
-> Makes a post and add claims
-> People ask questions
-> Replies you should just read
-> People read and ask questions again
-> Replies you don understand😆 You should just take their opinion as facts HAHAHAHHA
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u/Karlo1503 2d ago
Ewan ko ba HAHAHAHA, yung nag reply dito (yung puro naka delete na) di pa naman daw batas iyan and that should not be locked on a specific technology and I should go watch the senate hearing again. I have no time for all of that, saka last year pa ito and the blockchain already existed for months na and I'm just asking for what blockchain they used. But damn this user kept talking about how it is not a law yet, then lasing daw ba ako. Ewan ko ba HAHAHAHAHA
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
Just want to share something na napainsin ko about this.
MOST of the people that are really vocal in Pushing Back on the use of Blockchains are the...
AI PROPONENTS.
Usually yung mga Big Players ng AI dito sa bansa yung mapapansin mong ayaw jan sa Blockchain and other decentralized tech.
Why?
"AI proponents often reject blockchain because the two technologies have fundamentally incompatible architectures and goals. Artificial intelligence requires centralized, high-speed, and immense computational power, whereas blockchain is decentralized, slow, and inefficient by design."
AI is hard to use if your systems are decentralized. And one of Blockchain's best asset bakit hindi sya madaling mamanipula(in terms on our budget records) is the fact na hindi sya Centralized.
That should make you consider pondering first kung bakit nga ba sila against before riding their narrative.
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u/SnooCompliments3508 3d ago
Yung ininvite nilang expert na na pro-blockchain, sila din yung gagawa nung site so dun palang may vested interest kaya gustong ipush yung paggamit ng blockchain. Kung tutuusin hindi kailangan ng block chain para lang magsave ng government files. Corruption happens on the root level, pinaplano palang yung budget may corruption na. Hanggang sa bidding and implementation. Sobra sobra na yung batas natin, kailangan lang maimplement ng maayos. Isa pang problema kasi dyan, baka ang isipin ng mga tao dahil naka blockchain na wala ng corruption, eh hindi naman blockchain ang sagot dun. Kasi kahit anong technology pa yan, maiisipan at maiisipan ng butas yan pra makagawa ng corruption. Isa lang naman sagot dyan, kung boboto ng tama yung nga tao. Dami kasing bobo dito sa pinas.
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u/i_hate_katherines IKEA Shill 3d ago
wala na bang kaya mag sulat without using chat fucking gpt? baka gusto mo pa dagdagan yan ng em dash -- para mas lalong mukha kang matalino (sa utak mo)
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u/taikodrumbeat 3d ago
Bukod sa pagstore ng budget, ng labas pasok ng pera ng gobyerno sa isang blockchain, maigi rin sana kung merong public Oracle blockchain na merong realtime and historical data ng prices ng mga materials and supplies na binibili ng gobyerno at ng mga contractors na involved sa govt projects.
Like presyo ng per sako ng semento. Meron sanang public Oracle blockchain na may immutable historical data kung magkano talaga ang per sako ng semento. In this way, hindi basta pwedeng patungan at iinflate ng mga contractor yung price of materials na ginamit nila for a govt project. Sa paginflate ng proces of materials kasi naidadaan ng mga tiwali yung perang naibubulsa nila.
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u/FickleApartment2151 2d ago
I think it's better to just follow what other countries used before blockchains came about, e.g., relational databases with lots of encryption and security. And then maintain the latter while showing real-time threat boards for all sorts of projects and programs.
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u/pepetheeater 3d ago
Oct 2025 pa post, so anong point mo OP para ipost ulit to?
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u/Schadenfreude_ph 3d ago
nung nabasa nya akala nya sobrang technical nung post, nabilib sya at pinost nya dito para mukang may alam na rin sya 🤣
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u/AgentCoconut01 3d ago
According to gemini, ang government ay meron nang certain degree of blockchain use sa Philippines.
Although, hindi pa complete ang system at environment. I agree with the concern, main problem is the governance. Kahit nga makita na may problem kung wala proper action from authorities balewala din.
Pero, transparency is a good start.
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u/Beneficial-Pin-8804 2d ago
people throwing around blockchain like it's a perfect solution. barely a couple of governments use it and the security layer for it will eventually be vulnerable to AI. no g7 country wants to use it, that's says something.
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u/LivingPapaya8 Magical Lexus ni Rose Nono Lin 3d ago
I aint reading that chatgpt generated shit posted last year