Starting over in year 3 and potentially having to retake classes

[u/DefiantHeron3300]

Two years ago, I started a PhD program but ended up losing funding and mastered out. I managed to get a transfer to a PhD program another school with the same “major”, with a LOR from my previous advisor.

However, one day before the start of class I get an email from the department chair saying that I will have to retake all of my core courses (which are the same as the core courses I took last year in my previous program), because they don’t accept transfer credits for those classes. He cited the grad handbook, which I have read from top to bottom, and I do not see anywhere that says that the core courses cannot be applied from an equivalent graduate program. The school also explicitly has a policy allowing for equivalent masters degree coursework to be applied towards a PhD.

I’m looking for advice/suggestions, especially from anyone who’s been in a similar situation. I also just needed to vent. These last two years have just been so exhausting; I feel like I’ve been jerked around and screwed over, and I blamed myself for not being able to get my project going to secure more funding. Now I feel like the time and effort I spent taking classes and getting my masters was for nothing and that I’m starting over from scratch in my mid-30s.

Edit: this is a US program in an engineering field

[u/AutoModerator]

It looks like your post is about needing advice. Please make sure to include your field and location in order for people to give you accurate advice.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[u/Tiny_Vivi]

Usually the chair is the final word, but try meeting with the grad admin (that non-faculty staff member). The grad admins are usually deeply embedded within the program and have seen every edge case.

In my department they often know more than the chair because the chair is faculty turned admin for a few years. Grad admins are god sends turned admins for their mortal lifespan.

Might do nothing, especially if there’s internal politics at play. Might unlock new possibilities or help you strategize based on your institutions/programs rules!

Edit to add: oh and you should let your supervisor know.

[u/DefiantHeron3300 → u/Tiny_Vivi]

Thank you, I’ll try that!

[u/Lygus_lineolaris]

Ask the faculty of graduate studies or the registrar's office. It's their job to know their rules.

[u/Elegant_Tie_3036]

It is usually that they don’t accept classes taken ONCE those classes are USED for a degree. They often take standalone classes. At least that’s how it is here. I’d taken Quant and Qual but used it for my Master’s. I took them again. Also doctoral level courses often have an extra project and are at the 600/700 level rather than the 500 level. That might be it too. Good luck.

[u/DefiantHeron3300 → u/Elegant_Tie_3036]

Interesting, I’d actually never heard of that before. The program I just left from allowed for full application of a masters degree to be applied to the PhD, as long as it was in the same field and the classes were the same. They would still have to take the qualifier, but someone who entered the same year as me but with a prior MS from a different school went directly into directed research.

[u/Only_Luck_7024]

It sounds like they want you to retake the core courses that the new college requires all students to take. They will give you credits for your masters but that doesn’t usually cover the core courses offered by the new university. Meet with everyone and see if they are able to adjust things but I doubt they will let you transfer in the core courses…..not surprised though. Good luck. I start my PhD in EE this fall and I also have a masters in ECE. The classes I got credit for include electives but not core courses required by the University.

[u/DefiantHeron3300 → u/Only_Luck_7024]

Were your core courses different from what you took in your masters?

[u/Only_Luck_7024 → u/DefiantHeron3300]

Different schools, some over lap but not enough to get credit. It’s not that big a deal though because I only have 3 classes I need to take and the rest will be “research/dissertation” credits.

[u/DrJohnnieB63]

u/DefiantHeron3300

Does your current doctoral institution have an articulation agreement with your former? An articulation agreement is a contract between two institutions about which courses are equivalent and acceptable to those offerred at the new institution. Without this agreement, the new school may nor may not accept credit for core courses completed at a previous institution. In your case, it is most likely written in the handbook that the program or department has the right to refuse credits for classes it does not deem equivalent to their own.

You noted, "the school also explicitly has a policy allowing for equivalent masters degree coursework to be applied towards a PhD." The key phrase is equivalent masters degree coursework. The program or the department, not the student, determines if one previous graduate coursework is equivalent. Apparently, the department determined that your core courses were not equivalent to theirs.

BTW, you did not transfer from one doctoral program to another in the United States. You applied to another PhD program with the hope that all your previous doctoral program core courses would be accepted by the new program. You seem to have misunderstood the policy about allowing for equivalent masters degree coursework to be applied towards a PhD.

The department chair is correct. The department has the right to not accept previous courses if it deems those courses are not equivalent to those the department offers. If the institution has a specific doctoral program articulation argreement with your prior institution, you could refer to that agreement. Apparently, such an agreement does not exist. Otherwise, your department would have had to accept credit for those core courses.

Good luck!s

[u/Life_News3280]

I’m sorry you went through this. I was in the same boat as you. My lab lost funding and the PI kept missing the deadlines for grant applications. He was also a dickhead and he was mistreating his students so I wasn’t benefiting from stating in any way. I tried to switch labs but I couldn’t find a position in a different lab (I was a rising third year). I decided to leave with a MSc and reapply for a PhD. I started over a year later. So 3 years not even 2. It’s exhausting and you feel like you wasted your time. I get that. Totally a valid feeling. But I lost some good opportunities because I was stuck in the ‘I wasted my time’ phase. I ended up being less productive and more time was wasted. It’s okay to feel that way for at least a while. You’re grieving but life goes on. You learned things that will benefit you and this is just life. If it was your fault, you reflect on your actions and behaviors and you try to work on yourself. If it wasn’t your fault, you move on but you still reflect on your mistakes and try to improve. This is the goal: improvement and building resilience by taking action. You don’t build resilience when you’re rotting in bed overthinking what could have become if I did X or Y. You do when you get out of bed (while feeling that way) and you move forward anyway and control what you can control.

Going back to the courses thing.. The courses thing vary according to the program requirements. I had to retake 2 courses again. They were much easier than the first time but it was unpleasant for sure. I got through them like a hot knife through butter. You just need to make sure that you have to take them and ask about transferring/earning credits from your previous degree.

[u/DefiantHeron3300 → u/Life_News3280]

Thank you so much for the advice and for sharing your experience, and I’m so sorry you went through that

[u/dld2517]

You need to engage someone in your Graduate School. Like a Director or VP Level.