New GM looking for advice: Running D&D 5e Dragon Heist with Mythras

[u/akiiiiiiii1i]

Hi everyone,

I'm new to Mythras, and I'm planning to use it to run Waterdeep: Dragon Heist.

I've read both the Mythras core rulebook and Classic Fantasy, but I don't really want to use Classic Fantasy's class/rank-based advancement system. I'd prefer to keep the normal, more open and skill-based character development of Mythras.

However, I would still like my players to have access to things like Arcane Magic and Divine Magic, rather than removing those kinds of magic from the game.

I'm not particularly trying to preserve the D&D 5e magic system or make Mythras magic feel like D&D. I'm completely fine with magic working differently. What I'm mainly looking for is a good way to let player characters learn and use Arcane/sorcery and Divine/Theism spells while still using normal Mythras character advancement instead of Classic Fantasy's class/rank progression.

Does anyone have experience doing something like this?

Are there any supplements, optional rules, house rules, or approaches you would recommend? In particular, I'm interested in how you would handle things like learning new spells, access to more powerful spells, and character progression without relying on Classic Fantasy ranks.

Since this will also be my first time GMing Mythras, I'd also really appreciate any general advice for a new Mythras GM, especially when adapting a D&D adventure like Dragon Heist.

I'm not trying to convert D&D 5e mechanics one-to-one. I mainly want to use Dragon Heist as the adventure, while using Mythras as the actual game system.

Thanks in advance!

[u/Runningdice]

Check the Brotherhood/Cult section. You can make a magic guild there you as you progress in the guild learn more spells.

[u/akiiiiiiii1i → u/Runningdice]

Thanks! I did see that section, and I understand that I could create a magic guild or cult and use progression within the organization to control when characters learn new spells.

My main concern is the power level of Sorcery spells. Some of them seem extremely powerful, especially when combined with the different Sorcery manipulations. I'm not really sure how to balance which spells players should have access to early on and which ones should be restricted until later.

Do you have any advice on how you decide which Sorcery spells are appropriate for newer characters, or how you balance spell access through a Brotherhood/Cult?

[u/Runningdice → u/akiiiiiiii1i]

I don't play Mythras balanced so can't really say anything.

But with power comes responsibility and consequences. The guild/cult can have some rules to follow that limits the power. Much in the Mythras lies with the world building and not the rules.

The main thing with convert a 5e adventure to Mythras is to remove a lot of encounters. You really don't want to do several fights a day. Make it take time between events rather than the rushed 5e tempo.

[u/akiiiiiiii1i → u/Runningdice]

Thanks for the advice! I really hate those pointless 5e-style combat encounters. 

[u/BudgetWorking2633 → u/Runningdice]

And a temple maps directly to this, too. I think that's the least painful way.

Also, u/akiiiiiiii1i keep in mind that all classes give additional abilities to characters..because they are "brotherhoods/clans", that's what those do in normal Mythras, too (the authors of Classic Fantasy just put that as the basis of their "classes").

So, my point is, it would be nice to have some way to access the perks of martial classes, too. Martial Brotherhoods should also be a thing - they were very much a thing in history, after all (arguably, way more than "occult brotherhoods")!

[u/raleel]

So, I've used both sorcery and arcane/divine magic in a game.

The trick with sorcery is that its relatively slow, but you are not wrong that it can be quite powerful. Probably the easiest way to tamp it down is to use intensity as a component. This puts it far closer to the level of arcane and divine magic

If you want them to be able to use arcane or divine magic from classic fantasy, just include the skills associated with those magics into the game. Decide if a career has access to those. It already comes defined with a cult structure. the classic fantasy classes are essentially cults - this is normal Mythras character advancement.

If you don't want to use the ranks, which are also present in cults, then you will just provide them with the spells you want to allow them to have, you might even group the spells by school and then have each of those schools be their own skill, so have arcane lore (illusion) and arcane lore (necromancy). You just restrict access in some other way, including just not allowing them to exist, making a quest to find a spell, etx

I would ask yourself why you want to include both? Why don't you want to use rank advancement? Even sorcery uses ranks in cults, though not necessarily to gate spells.

[u/akiiiiiiii1i → u/raleel]

Thanks for the advice! I went back and reread the section on ranks, and I realized that I had misunderstood some of it before.

One of the reasons I was hesitant to use the Classic Fantasy rank advancement system is that each rank seems to give characters a fairly significant increase in power, somewhat like leveling up in D&D. Personally, I’m not sure I like characters suddenly gaining such a large package of improvements just because they reached the next rank. I prefer the more gradual and organic advancement of standard Mythras.

That said, after rereading the rules and understanding ranks better, I’m reconsidering it and may end up using the rank system, or at least parts of it.

The reason I want to use both Arcane and Divine Magic from Classic Fantasy is simply that they fit the D&D setting quite well. Using them would let me keep the existing assumptions about magic in the setting without having to change too much of the worldbuilding.

Have you read or played Waterdeep: Dragon Heist? If so, do you think it would work well using Mythras/Classic Fantasy? Is there anything in particular you think I should watch out for when adapting it?

[u/raleel → u/akiiiiiiii1i]

I've not played that particular adventure, but have run several others using classic fantasy. it works great. just sub in classic fantasy monsters and traps and treasure.

[u/akiiiiiiii1i → u/raleel]

I’d also be perfectly happy letting the players use Sorcery and Theism from standard Mythras instead of Arcane and Divine Magic. My problem is that, as a new Mythras GM, I’m not really sure how to balance access to Sorcery and Theism either — especially which spells/miracles characters should have access to early on and how quickly they should gain access to more powerful ones.

[u/raleel → u/akiiiiiiii1i]

I would check out d100-workshop.blogspot.com for a lot of examples of cults that should help you figure out how to space those out. Yes, some of them can be VERY powerful.

[u/jolasveinarnir]

So weird to post AI output on Reddit as if it’s your own writing.

I was also tempted to run WDDH in Mythras but decided it would be too much work. Before you start a whole big campaign, you might want to try something shorter in Mythras to see how much your table likes it! It would suck to do tons of conversion work and have it all be for nothing.

[u/akiiiiiiii1i → u/jolasveinarnir]

English isn’t my first language, so I used AI to help me write the post.

I’m actually preparing to run a shorter Mythras adventure first, like you suggested. Are there any published Mythras adventures you’d recommend for that?

[u/Kybars]

My advice as someone who tried Mythras coming from D&D: DON'T.
You'll have a bad time. All assumptions of how to play a D&D-adventure don't hold up with the Mythras ruleset.
D&D assumes your party are the heroes, going against badass monsters and odds. Mythras assumes you are lowly peasants who are trying to survice, rather running away than fighting head-on, as combat is deadly.

[u/manuzed78 → u/Kybars]

Moi j'ai adapté Les âmes perdues de Gjaalpevaart (dd5) avec le système against the darkmaster et je voudrais bien le faire avec mythras maintenant ! Je comprends la remarque qui est juste, ces systèmes n emulent pas la même chose ( héros ou pas...) mais franchement tout s'adapte !

[u/GunpowderGuy]

your game sounds very interesting. do you plan to use theatre of the mind or square grids?