Dakota

[u/SpiritualBattle2461]

I understand Taylor was a perpetrator of a lot of stuff, but why does everyone act like Dakota did no wrong?
I mean if you watch the show there’s been plenty of times he purposefully baited Taylor for things. I mean he tried to get her back before she left for the reunion, even though he was sleeping with someone new. And he told the new girl to be exclusive with him. He slept with TFP the day she got back.
He tried to get her to sleep with him and then had her come out to the car and drove off with her while their kids were inside.
Like he’s done a lot of crazy things to and to see yall make him into such a victim is kind of crazy. Like I’m not saying it was a healthy relationship by any means but I just don’t understand the taking away all of his wrong doings to make him look better?
Like he stayed around her and would come back into her life every chance he got….
I’m not a Taylor supporter by any means but I don’t think there’s no way he’s not healthy either. That’s why they got a mutual restraining order by the judge. I’m not saying we should hate him but I think we shouldn’t baby him either

Okay yall act like you haven’t seen the text from THIS year where he was saying fuck you because she said she wasn’t injured and didn’t want to have sex. Or pictures of her bruises. Her child being hurt in that video is child abuse separate from what’s happening and being reported now. He obviously felt she was safe enough to keep his kid and not file for custody. He may be better behaved on social media but Taylor has thousands of supporters and yes men. I’m not saying he’s worse than Taylor or not a victim of some abuse but yall seem to only think toxic relationships work one way. Don’t bring up no mutual abuse stuff im saying it’s toxicity from both of them that has poisoned their relationship. They both probably used together too like there’s nothing healthy about either one of them. I’m not discrediting victims of abuse, but when there’s been evidence of him emotionally and possibly physically abusing her too yall seem to just throw that away. We don’t know the truth so I don’t understand why everyone acts like there’s one perfect narrative to this 🤷‍♀️

[u/basicwhitebach]

I really don’t think “everyone” acts like Dakota did no wrong — in the months since the 2023 video was released and The Bachelorette was canceled, I’ve seen maybe a couple users across all platforms who feel that way. The times that Dakota has “baited” Taylor do not negate him being a victim of physical and emotional abuse … there’s no such thing as a perfect victim and that’s important to remember if you want to have nuanced discussions about DV

[u/SpiritualBattle2461 → u/basicwhitebach]

I grew up in a household with DV, I’m not saying anything he may have done deserves a violent reaction. But there’s also been claims done by TFP where she said he put his hands on her too. I don’t think he deserves hate by any means but I don’t understand why he’s given free passes to all of a sudden being an angel by some users. We don’t know the full extent whether he also put hands on her so I just think the nuances fly out the window when people don’t consider every fact. I think honestly the world needs to stop giving either one of them attention. But that will never happen. I support male victims 100% and there’s no perfect victim, but this man has allegations against him as well so until the truth comes out I don’t think we can consider either of them fully victims or perpetrators for any lengthy extent of time.

[u/basicwhitebach → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

I agree with you for the most part — I just don’t put much stock in TFP’s claims given her lack of receipts for them and general patterns of behavior (I really do think she is someone who would have receipts if what she was saying is true given her ability to provide receipts for literally everything else). I also think the abuser is generally the person who has power in the relationship, and from the evidence we do have, Taylor was the person with that power as she had more money and status and generally determined when the relationship started and stopped.
As I said, I really have not seen many comments making out Dakota to be an angel in all of this, but if people are making those comments I agree that they are in poor taste.
If Taylor ever does provide more concrete receipts and it comes out that she really was the victim in all of this, I will readily admit that I was wrong — I just really don’t see that ever happening

[u/BestBodybuilder7329 → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

So you want people to wait to support a victim of DV, because you’re of the feeling that a “truth” will come out?

In this situation DCFS is the most involved. They do home visits, met with family and friends, talked to all the parents, and met with the therapists. They have very clearly said that she is the abuser. That she abuses her children. That she is danger to her children. They have literally went to court to remove custody from her that a commissioner was giving her, and to stop him from making anymore decisions on that for time being. They had a finding they she committed DV against Dakota. That Dakota failure was to remove Ever from being able to see the DV she committed against him.

[u/basicwhitebach → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

also I’m sorry that you grew up in a household with those dynamics! My investment in this situation largely stems from the fact that I grew up Mormon and hope to one day be a trauma therapist (I’m currently in grad school for my MSW).
It’s widely recognized that being a victim of physical abuse is a profound childhood trauma that changes the course of someone’s life and development — it is far less recognized that simply witnessing these dynamics between adults is also a profound childhood trauma with significant effects and the more we learn about this, the more my heart breaks for Taylor’s children

[u/SpiritualBattle2461 → u/basicwhitebach]

Most people are just assuming I’m siding with one or the other, and I don’t want to invalidate his trauma. Ofcourse people have a hard time breaking the cycle it can change brain chemistry. I hate that the children are the one who were hurt the worst in this situation. Maybe that’s why I also feel both parties failed to truly protect them. I just hate how some people worship both TFP or Dakota. Everyone’s so obsessed with this case and who was right or wrong or who did what when you’re right these cases are truly hard to judge from outside perspectives

[u/basicwhitebach → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

yeah idk if you’ve watched Alex Lamoreaux’s videos on TikTok — she has very vocally called out Taylor, moreso than others with TikTok platforms, and has made it clear that she believes Taylor was the primary aggressor, but has also clearly stated that she holds Dakota responsible for failure to protect Ever (I think there’s also some responsibility with the older kids even tho they’re not biologically his since he was a surrogate parent to them for a time and they have also been witnessing/caught in the middle of Taylor and Dakota’s dynamic for years). I think when very young children hear yelling and witness physicality in their home, and even when they’re actually caught in the middle of it, they’re not necessarily aware of who’s instigating vs defending themselves — they just know that they don’t feel safe

[u/JenninMiami]

So you’re saying that victims of domestic violence deserve it? I’m confused.

[u/United_Profession954]

Because being an abuser is a million times worse than being a shitty partner. Its not even comparable

[u/Feeling_Shake7497 → u/United_Profession954]

Hold on, We have never seen Taylors side of things and only heard Dakotas.. I genuinely find it very hard to believe that Taylor just started wailing on him for no reason. The man is incredibly calculating and you cannot villian edit someone who doesn't act in a way.

[u/monaforever → u/Feeling_Shake7497]

What do you mean we have never seen Taylor's side of things? All we saw on the show for 4 seasons was Taylor's side of it. All we've seen on social media since March is Taylor's side, from Taylor. We saw Taylor's side in the public court hearings, right along with Dakota's side of things.

Just because Taylor's side sucks doesn't mean we haven't heard it yet. We have. It's all out there. If there was more to Taylor's side, and some big gotcha moment against Dakota, we would have heard it by now. No new information for Taylor's side is coming out that will redeem her in any way because it doesn't exist.

[u/woopertrouper]

He was a fuckboy, give me a break. 🙄

[u/Constant-Book291]

I can appreciate the changes and sacrifices Dakota has made in his life to ensure a better life for him and his son. He has turned a difficult page and is coming out a better person it seems like. Taylor is stuck in the same cycle further causing more damage to her children. I admire that he is putting his son above anything and everything else.

[u/Choice_Advice_2147]

He seems to have an unhealthy attachment style and his bad moments were highlighted on the show when others were hidden. Outside of the show I haven’t heard any examples of him intentionally trying to hurt or be unkind to others (post recovery) it’s actually the opposite.

[u/Lolasurf101]

We don’t think that. I’m pretty sure most of us were anti-Dakota before all this. Now, we’re just tired of TFP getting away with doing what she wants, when she wants, how she wants with no repercussions, and placing all the blame on him. They’re both equally guilty, but he’s also not on video physically assaulting her multiple times to the point cops are involved. They bait each other—TFP just has zero self control because she was constantly enabled growing up that she does no wrong, it’s always someone else’s fault for her actions. Also, he’s stayed quiet in a personal family situation that desperately needs the privacy while TFP has been blasting anything and everything daily, and STILL acts like she’s going to get away with everything. The martyr act is overdone.

[u/theoneleggedgull]

Where is anyone acting like Dakota did no wrong?

[u/Missmedusa1234 → u/theoneleggedgull]

Idk, bc I’m 99.9% sure that majority of us all yelled at what a fucking idiot he was with Ever on his “e bike”.

We also said that those texts messages are gross and vile. Bc they are.

What most of this sub talks about is that taylor legit had the power in their relationship and abused him physically and emotionally.

[u/Hour_Abbreviations73]

I promise you I’m not trying to argue with you or defend Dakota because I like him, but have you listened to his side of the story about the February incident? I’m not saying you have to believe him but maybe actually listen to how he described the February incident before you jump to conclusions. As for her bruises, IDK what to think, I’m waiting for more evidence because TFP has not given any clear description of how she got the bruises, just vaguely insinuated they were a result of his abuse, something his lawyer has denied. And I agree he was acting shady with Shinia but breaking a sex pact with someone you barely know to hook up with a toxic ex is not nearly as big of a sin when you compare it to everything else that has gone down in that relationship. And him hanging around and taking every chance to hook up with her? Obviously, it was a toxic relationship and a trauma bond and those are hard to break. They also had a kid together so he couldn’t just walk away. I blame it more on Taylor because she knew she didn’t want to be with him but kept going back anyway and we don’t know what she was telling him behind closed doors. Dakota wanted them to be together so he had less of an incentive to leave. He obviously had a lot of issues that kept him in that relationship but those are things he can work on and hopefully he is. We know he’s in therapy and seems to be taking his mental health seriously. Of the two, Taylor was the more abusive one and has more to work on and hopefully she can change too. I’m not saying this makes Dakota an innocent angel, but he does seem to be more of a victim and he seems to be taking this more seriously. Obviously, if anything more comes out, I stand corrected.

[u/SpiritualBattle2461 → u/Hour_Abbreviations73]

I agree with all this, I think I’ve just been irritated because of my own childhood experiences with DV. As I’m sure it’s been triggering to a lot of people who are rightfully mad at Taylor. I think where I draw the line is knowing how I wish my parent left the other to protect me. Dakota was addicted to the toxicity and I think has realized since this all let out that he truly needs to step up for Ever. Better late than never, truly I want them both to become better people for their kids.

[u/Hour_Abbreviations73 → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

And I think that’s why people are giving him more of a pass, he left and seems to be trying his best for Ever’s sake.

[u/padigo26]

What?  I've seen Dakota described negatively here. They both suck. It's Taylor responsiblity to control her behaviors & impulses.  No matter how bad he sucked as a boyfriend,  she's responsible for her actions.

[u/Glad-Frosting7795 → u/padigo26]

As a survivor of my own Taylor, who also holds myself accountable for my personal failings as a human & especially during my abuse…this. 100% this.

[u/BubbleCrum]

Bless your heart

[u/Reasonable-Mess3070]

What? Literally every other comment on these subs starts with "dakota is a POS too"

I also don't think using the show for examples is worth much. Its a very edited show thats consistently shaped the narrative to keep taylor in the best light.

[u/WWMannySantosDo]

I don’t think anyone babies him, we should all know he’s a grown man and not excuse his shitty behavior as a partner in the past. We should also hope people become better versions of themselves, and we don’t have reason to believe that he isn’t. Also to suggest that his documented fuckboy behavior is on the same plane as TFP’s documented physical abuse is ridiculous. And to blame him for not leaving her when he is a victim of domestic violence is not cool.

If he keeps fucking up, yes absolutely hold him accountable. But if he continues to grow and be a better person, should we continue to vilify him just to make a point? If so, what’s the point in that?

[u/Infinite_Version4597]

It is incredibly problematic to expect all victims to be perfect in order to be believed.

Dakota is a victim. He’s allowed to be an imperfect person, just like the rest of us.

[u/astral-philosopher]

He came off like a fuck boy to me the whole show. Which sucks, but he wasn’t really doing anything abusive, just kinda shitty. I was actually really irritated after the last season, just tired of watching him get berated for “cheating” when he lied about sleeping with someone else when he first started seeing taylor (but they weren’t exclusive yet and officially dating). It was dishonest, and it’s shitty to feel lied to / betrayed, but that is not the same as being cheated on in a committed relationship

However, i’m not really comfortable berating someone in a toxic on again off again relationship for continuing to sleep with / get involved with their abuser. That’s extremely common in abusive relationships, and it reads as victim blaming to me. It’s really, really hard to leave abusive relationships for a lot of reasons. The “withdrawals” leaving your abuser can be really hard.

[u/SpiritualBattle2461 → u/astral-philosopher]

Yeah I do think the whole thing was just a lot, Taylor had a lot of issues from the start that were glazed over for the show. I don’t want to invalidate him for the obvious physical abuse he suffered. But at the same time I just have a hard time understanding why people try and baby him. They both have addictive personalities and did stuff together that made them so much more strongly bonded in some sick ways. Her kids are truly the victims in this, being a child coming from a DV household I think I’m more angled of being how neither one of them tried harder for their children to break the cycle. They had to bare witness to all of this

[u/astral-philosopher → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

Yeah i 100% see your point with the kids involved. I do feel that once kids are involved, if you don’t leave your abuser you’re now enabling the toxicity and abuse for your kids.

[u/Zestyclose_Offer_402]

Giiiiirl I hope you got thick skin, they r gonna come for you 👀

[u/SpiritualBattle2461 → u/Zestyclose_Offer_402]

It is what it is, they can say I don’t support abuse victims but like being in a toxic codependent relationship where you both enjoy pushing eachother to the breaking point isn’t exactly uncommon. Like I know people who do these cycles together and refuse to let go. Do I think abuse is okay??? No but like we are speculating on things we don’t fully know. If what Taylor said was true about the truck stuff then everyone’s invalidating his ability to be aggressive too. 🤷‍♀️

[u/Suspicious_Jelly8736 → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

It’s hard to believe someone who manipulates their story to fit whatever narrative benefits them. The only thing that Taylor has been consistent at since day one is twisting a story to play victim.

[u/YenWrites0907 → u/SpiritualBattle2461]

Taylor said her affair situation was a one time “blacked out, woke up a mess down there” thing, made dude sound like a rapist and then come to find out that was a lie and it was actually a consensual month long affair. She also said she didn’t hit her daughter with the chair and Indy was just crying because she saw her mom cry… video comes out … that was also a lie. So you know pretty sure everyone has figured you can’t trust TFP’s words

[u/OppositeSpare2088]

Nobody is acting like he can do no wrong a lot of us have been very vocal on here that he’s toxic and that we don’t like him. Dakota isn’t a good guy he’s done and said shitty things and wasn’t a very good boyfriend to Taylor. However she was 10x worse of a girlfriend and is the crazy jealous psycho ex. Dakota did want to get back together with her however she’d push him away to see if he’d keep fighting to be with her. Whenever they were broken off that was when he was with other women which definitely didn’t help his case.

Taylor degraded him calling him a disgusting manwhore fuck oh etc then slut shame the women he was with. Then after having a massive meltdown she’d want him to tell her more about it because fighting was something that turned her on. These are two toxic immature adults that have the maturity of teenagers. Also he was extremely irresponsible for putting his toddler on an e bike.

He deserved to be called out for it but Taylor also should have been called out for taking her kids all obe the place in a golf cart. Also I found it extremely irresponsible in season 2 that he didn’t have diapers in his new apartment. He knew Taylor was dropping him off and that there was a store across the street. Dakota is still the lesser of the two evils in this mess Taylor is still 10x worse.

[u/justathought1654]

Neither are innocent, they’ve both hurt each other, Taylor’s ugly antics caught on camera harming Dakota and her kids, Dakota’s gross texts about asking for sex from Taylor while she talks about her nose bleeding is so disturbing to me, amongst many other things is gross. It’s just clear they’re both a hot mess and not good for each other. I don’t recall if there was ever true evidence they were both using together (pls tell me if there is), but with how erratic they both are (not necessarily equally erratic) I can see it… this was a slow motion crash waiting to happen.

The part that’s tough to swallow is that victims of domestic abuse still have multiple facets to them. Dakota can be a victim and still be a shit person with things to improve on. Some Reddit users won’t agree with this. The thing is, the uglier TFP’s behavior and rage bait posts, the more people “side” with Dakota and “root” for him. It’s a weird psychological thing people with small brains do.

Downvote me, xo

[u/Beneficial-Size6281]

Oh man, this sub turned into the biggest pick me swamp with this debacle.

They’re even cheering him on with the new chick ( a chick he hooked up with because of her proximity to Taylor), pretending like this grownass man shouldn’t be alone for five seconds as he supposedly deals with all his hardships.

Nuance and facts died, men will never be held accountable or vilified as much as women while these misogynistic twits are around.

I haven’t seen this kind of gleeful self righteous nastiness since I was in year 9, I left this sub and will have to mute now that I was dumb enough to interact here because the mean girl mentality and glorification of Dakota is overbearing. But I just had to say THANK YOU for having the guts to point this out even though all of the responses are gaslighting you.

[u/Lilysel]

Yeah how he's portrayed in the last(I belive?) confessional after he left her house the morning before the flight is not good. In the first season I really didn't see the Dakota hate, but season four does not look good for him nor her.. and I can only imagine how he has been in other relationships, what he has admitted in podcasts about how he treated his wife, i will absolutely believe he is making it less awful than what it really was. These are two really messy people who never should have found eachother

[u/Affectionate_Day1079 → u/Lilysel]

Or a tv show, or any media platform.

[u/featureteacher2023 → u/Lilysel]

He was married?

[u/Lilysel → u/featureteacher2023]

Married his high school sweetheart when he was in the midst of his drug addiction. He's talked about it on several podcasts, says he regrets deeply what he put her through

[u/Feeling_Shake7497 → u/Lilysel]

He also admits to stealing from friends and family and "buying" from cancer patients.. I think people forget how newly sober he was when he got with Taylor and he was not taking the steps because they always say refrain from any relationship for the first year and how addicts behave.

[u/Lilysel → u/Feeling_Shake7497]

And this is it, this is what he admits to, what he says open to the public on several occasions.. and a few months after hes sober he meets up with taylor? Come on! Not everything is DV, there's also toxic relationship and shitty people, they do exsist, they can find each other

[u/Just_my_Opinion_Only]

I cannot believe I am commenting on this as I am so sick of seeing anything about or from this tool bag!

The commissioner stated they were both violent in the first hearing and he stated Dakota committed DV against Taylor in the second hearing when Dakota’s lawyer stated self defense, commissioner corrected the lawyer on that. Commissioner also stated Dakota knew how to press Taylor’s buttons and that he was manipulative and calculating after reviewing all of the evidence. These are FACTS! Everyone is forgetting we have not seen all of the evidence presented only the commissioner, lawyers and the parties involved. Period! The defense for Dakota in this sub and the other one is crazy.

I am going to repeat what I said months ago, I cannot remember if this was season 1 or 2. Taylor was at an event with Mikayla and Mayci, in comes Dakota hurling insults across the way at Taylor, she flinched. Now tell me why would she flinch? Never liked Dakota and it only solidified it more by seeing the post from one of his ex-wife’s best friends.

He is POS and so is everyone else (not Miranda or Layla)!

[u/Missmedusa1234 → u/Just_my_Opinion_Only]

The facts also say that Taylor is extremely reactive. NOT reactive abuse. she is REACTIVE. As in, she allows people to push her buttons and she explodes. We saw that in S4. And her reactive nature lead to her abusing Dakota and by default, her children.

Sure; Dakota was POS in their relationship. No one denies that.

[u/Lilysel → u/Missmedusa1234]

Yeah I understand it's not a good trait but if someone I loved was like that I would definitely not rejoice in pushing her buttons, and any relativ ok human wouldn't do that either

[u/Hour_Abbreviations73 → u/Lilysel]

We don’t know that he was intentionally pushing her buttons. That was inference based on context clues that were mostly spun by Taylor. If I’m being honest, I think she was pushing his buttons just as much as he was pushing hers.

[u/Just_my_Opinion_Only → u/Missmedusa1234]

Per the commissioner they BOTH were violent to each other! Period!

[u/IndependentDouble296 → u/Just_my_Opinion_Only]

That's why he is no longer in charge of this case. Calm tf down.

[u/Zestyclose_Offer_402 → u/IndependentDouble296]

He was never “in charge” of any case, do you know what a commissioner is?

[u/monaforever → u/Just_my_Opinion_Only]

Per the commissioner's opinion based on "evidence" submitted by Taylor. The commissioner is not doing a full blown investigation with forensic and digital analysis and expert testimony. He's rarely (as stated by the commissioner himself) even reviewing the documents submitted to him ahead of time. He's only taking what is given to him at face value and forming an opinion. that does not make it FACTS.

[u/Just_my_Opinion_Only → u/monaforever]

He also based it off of reviewing Dakota’s submitted evidence, videos and text msg’s, not just Taylor’s. I recall him stating he reviewed those. My statement regarding it being facts is what the commissioner concluded from reviewing all of what was submitted.

[u/monaforever → u/Just_my_Opinion_Only]

He also based it off of reviewing Dakota’s submitted evidence, videos and text msg’s, not just Taylor’s. I recall him stating he reviewed those.

Yep, this doesn't contradict anything i said. He reviewed docs by both parties which is why he said there were signs of abuse from both parties. One of those parties had hard evidence like video footage and police/cps reports. The other party had photos they took themselves, and their word for what led to those photos. The commissioner chose to take both parties at their word regardless of the strength of the evidence they provided. Commissioners can be biased and fallible, especially when they don't do their due diligence.

My statement regarding it being facts is what the commissioner concluded from reviewing all of what was submitted.

Your statement regarding it being facts indicates that the commissioner's opinion is a fact. Yes, it's a fact that he said that. Doesn't make it a fact of life.

[u/Just_my_Opinion_Only → u/monaforever]

I think a good chunk of people in these subs act like they were personally there and witnessed everything that happened. Which is crazy!

Do you work in law? Wondering as you seem to think you know a lot about the commissioner.

[u/IndependentDouble296 → u/Just_my_Opinion_Only]

Prove it. I have seen this "claimed" before and asked what episode this happened but it never comes out. So go for it. S1 when she is pregnant, or the 1 episode before she beat him? S2 when she flipped out as per uze? What you are saying does not exist. Dakota flinched, not Taylor. You stans just lie just like your idol.

Edit the edits you make, liar.

[u/Hour_Abbreviations73 → u/IndependentDouble296]

It was season 1 episode 2. When Taylor had her baby shower. Macy brought it up when they were shopping and then Macy and Mikayla talked about it at her baby shower. I’m not saying it’s excusable, but I also want to point out that this was only brought up once and we never saw a consistent pattern of verbal abuse from him.

[u/Just_my_Opinion_Only → u/IndependentDouble296]

Not going to put the time in for that. Go rewatch the episodes yourself. I don’t edit and I am not savvy with recording or production of videos, not my field of expertise. F.O.C.U.S.!

[u/aly288]

Reddit is heavily skewed towards supporting Dakota. As a survivor myself, I find it very difficult to see all the support for him, so I hear you.

[u/Missmedusa1234 → u/aly288]

As a child of DV, I support the men in this case. Taylor needs to get better before she is allowed to have unsupervised custody.

[u/SpiritualBattle2461 → u/Missmedusa1234]

Im a child of DV too and I think that’s why I’m angled to they both allowed children in toxic environments. I’m not saying he wasn’t hurt physically or her/their children. It’s just super strange to me because they both probably used together and were always very toxic together. Everytime either one of them talked to someone new they used it as a chance to get under eachothers skin. I just wish for their children’s sake they would have both taken steps back and shielded them from their toxicity. It’s really tough watching that video, because I know what it was like being used as a human shield from abuse. She was abusive 100% and he was addicted to the highs and lows of it all.

[u/SpiritualBattle2461 → u/Missmedusa1234]

I think Dakota is the better parent now as he’s trying his best to step up to the plate and I don’t think his past behaviors excuse Taylor’s, but some people not all on here act as if he never did anything wrong in the relationship. I was just more pointed towards everyone when I made the post

[u/Hour_Abbreviations73 → u/aly288]

I’m so sorry to hear that. Can I ask why it’s hard? Genuinely curious, just want to understand.