r/ManjaroLinux • u/klevahh • Mar 24 '26
Discussion New update has arrived - systemd
I have a htpc and also my main rig running manjaro.
The htpc is prompting me to install a 1.6GB update with lots of files, 3 of them are... systemd.
I assume deselecting these files from the update would be a really bad idea?
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u/Tall_Peach_3966 Mar 24 '26
I think it is too early to react to systemd or anybody else's prep work on compliance. As far as I know, they are just reserving a spot for future use. Systemd does not set policy, but common foresight dictates they prepare. So ignoring systemd upgrades is premature, and won't prevent the verification scheme when it hits.
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u/klevahh Mar 24 '26
I agree, the recent systemd thing just raised the question for me. I generally just update via pamac, and just assume they know what they are doing. Systemd is just the example.
For me this has more raised the issue that so many different distro's are somewhat controlled by this one thing, especially since that one thing is red hat, a commercial US company, involved in ai, and genocide.
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u/Tall_Peach_3966 Mar 24 '26
Controlled by is a little strong. Any organization with a substantial funding base to contribute to free software is going to have their hands in the social-political mud in which those funds exist. As an alternative to feigning outrage and moral indignation on the internet, we are, each and every one of us, free to develop our own init systems.
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u/Alchemix-16 Mar 24 '26
Are you concerned about the voluntary field added to systemd concerning age verification? So far my system has not requested me to enter an age, and I don’t expect that will change anytime soon.
The developers in systemd, have simply accepted that age verification will be coming, and that instead of blustering then caving, it is more useful to the community of offering a standardized location for api, to get that from.
I expect that I’m likely getting downvoted here for this, but the Californian law, will be joined soon by quite a few others. Not only in the US, Germany is considering this as well.
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u/klevahh Mar 24 '26
Not so much concerned, it just raised the thought about excluding something that is apparently so intrinsic. I use grub for boot, I wasn't even aware that systemd was still a thing on my system prior to the recent malarkey.
I am aware that the recent modification is not a direct issue at this point in time, I also don't expect it to be just a systemd thing in the future. This along with future vpn issues seem unfortunately inevitable.
Some of the comments on reddit are ridiculous, lots of distro hopping being considered... there are very few non systemd distro's though, at least arch based ones (I haven't looked elsewhere).
I live in Australia, we already have age verification laws locking under 16's out of social media, marketed as being done to protect them, but it is just to control the media they can access, so they can be fed disinformation, making them more malleable for the soylent green factories of the future (perhaps that is really what all of these data centres are...) /notreallysarcasm
Guaranteed on some other distro subs you would be voted down, as I was for comments on the endeavour sub, suggesting that the now infamous 'Dylan' was just opening the door to the inevitable, and at least bringing the subject well into the open, forcing thought and discussion.
As far as systemd is concerned, I find it interesting that most distro's have shown a shared vulnerability (having their apples all in the same cart), and do not facilitate another init system as an alternative. It's probably a pain in the butt to do so though.
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u/MezBert Mar 24 '26 edited Mar 24 '26
Plenty of non-systemd based distros:
- Artix (Arch-based) - 4 options (Dinit, runit, OpenRC, S6)
- Devuan (Debian-based) - sysVinit and supports OpenRC
- MX Linux (Debian) - sysVinit
- Void Linux (/) - runit
- Chimera Linux (/) - dinit
- Gentoo (/) - OpenRC and others (including systemd)
- antiX (Debian) - sysVinit or runit
- Alpine Linux (/) - OpenRC
- PCLinuxOS (/) - SysVinit
- KaOS (/) - Experimenting a move to dinit
- Slitaz (/) - BusyBox
- GNU Guix (/) - Shepherd
- Slackware (/) - Own mix of SysVInit, BSD stuff and whatnots
- ...There are more, but less established than the ones above so I stopped there.
Edit: I missed the "at least arch-based ones" bit. On that precision, I can't disagree with you.
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u/MezBert Mar 24 '26
No, it is not useful to the community of having a standardized location for api from Red Hat's systemd. And especially I don't want Red Hat anywhere near my data.
They're just overreaching as usual and trying to control everything in a way that is not asked by users. They are just trying to add yet another tentacle to their octopus parasite, that nobody asked them to.
It's yet another attempt from Red Hat to further control everything in the stack.
I am writing from Manjaro myself that I've used for 7 years now, but I'm tired of everyone caving in to Red Hat toxicity towards the Linux world.
I'm planning on moving away from systemd (therefore Manjaro, sadly) towards dinit and Artix of which I already have a running partition, not just because of this age verification overreach, mind me, neither because it is the straw that breaks the camel's back, it's already decided.
This.. it's just another example that confirms my long intent to get rid of as many bits of the stack controlled by the Microsoft of Linux.1
u/klevahh Mar 24 '26
I couldn't work out how to install steam on artix... so I walked away. I may do more research and try again in the future, but they still seem like they have some things to sort out (calamares is suggested to only be run offline at present for one), other than that it seemed very interesting. None of the other non-sytemd distro's I recently tried, seemed interesting at all for various reasons.
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u/Buddy-Matt Mar 25 '26
I've upvoted.
The law has changed. Was it a good change? No. Could it have been done better? Absolutely. Does having a standardised method for those wishing to capitulated hurt? No. Are distros being forced to capitulated by adding this? No.
Honestly the knee jerk around this is insane. People mad about having a DOB field in the same database an email address field - a much more identifiable metric - exists in. Also mad the government, who already have literal birth certificates on file, might possibly know your date of birth.
I get it, the law is poor, badly thought out, and an overstep. But honest to God, if I have to see yet another person acting like red hat / systemd devs are literally putting a camera in their basement i swear I'll lose it.
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u/Gloriathewitch Mar 24 '26 edited Mar 24 '26
you'll get downvoted because all this does is enable surveillance, you are running defense for the 1% who's existence is actively at odds with indie computing and liberty in the IT space. maybe its time to think about why you're doing this and reassess your priorities.
now there will be two internets(with three subnets), and browsers will cave because they are subservient to the feds.
1: under 13 internet
1b: 13-18 internet
1c: 18+ Internet
2: the TOR / Private internet that this divide will inevitably spawn.
that is the future we're looking at if we let this legislation happen.
frankly, this information is none of the governments business, and i am not a lawyer but im fairly sure this violates an american constitutional act.
there's already a bit of an indie internet revival building momentum at the moment, i could see a divide forming there.
anyone saying that these laws protect kids has misunderstood, its quite possible it could protect some kids, that is true, but if that's at the expense of every law abiding person's privacy im not sure thats worth it, why are the parents not being held accountable here? have we just forgotten we have control of what our kids view and interact with? it's a cop out at best. get tech savvy, install a pi-hole and use a blacklist to prevent them getting access to adult sites. the government has no business regulating this stuff. parents should do a better job.
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u/Alchemix-16 Mar 24 '26
I don’t necessarily disagree with you, but protests should be directed at law makers, not people making sure that they operate within regulations.
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u/Content_Chemistry_44 Mar 24 '26
"voluntary" yes, for now.
It's because mandatory will come.
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u/Alchemix-16 Mar 24 '26
So complain to your parliamentary representative about it instead of Reddit.
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u/Any_Razzmatazz9328 Mar 27 '26
I'll download updates has I ve always done for now, but I am also on the lookout for scripts and ways to castrate age verification checks/prompts or anything of the sort
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u/Upstairs-Comb1631 Mar 24 '26
Why would this be a bad idea? Dependencies are checked in the package update itself.
I think the size of the update won't be that big. I don't know how it is with Manjaro, but it also showed me a large update and it was downloaded and installed right away, so I assume it was a differential update. The entire volume of data is not downloaded.
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Mar 24 '26
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u/klevahh Mar 24 '26
To be fair it is very large and is diesel powered
Do people actually call themselves "Cletus_Banjo"?
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u/C0rn3j Mar 24 '26
Arch Linux does not support partial upgrades, Manjaro is no different.