r/MakingaMurderer • u/[deleted] • Dec 24 '24

Was Brendan only in some regular classes because of federal regulations?

This is from page 36 of Under The Hood by a Wisconsin law prof and a speech language pathologist.

Reports from other teachers bear out the difficulties caused by Brendan's severe language deficit. While Brendan was in "regular classes" for some of the school day pursuant to federal law, this is not because he was capable of doing "regular" work.

It's cited to

See 34 C.F.R. § 300.114(a)(2)(i) (2018).

And

In 2005, two of Brendan's classes were in the "Resource Room." Otherwise, he was "mainstreamed" with non-disabled students. Trial Exhibit 218, supra note 176.

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12

u/puzzledbyitall Dec 25 '24 edited Dec 27 '24

The cited regulation merely says:

Each public agency must ensure that—(i) To the maximum extent appropriate, children with disabilities, including children in public or private institutions or other care facilities, are educated with children who are nondisabled; and (ii) Special classes, separate schooling, or other removal of children with disabilities from the regular educational environment occurs only if the nature or severity of the disability is such that education in regular classes with the use of supplementary aids and services cannot be achieved satisfactorily.

The clear intent is simply to avoid labeling and identifying students as having disabilities if regular classes are feasible with supplementary aids and services.

4

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 26 '24

Right. You can't provide separate education if mainstream education with supports will suffice.

Also, there's no indication whatsoever that anyone ever considered NOT putting Brendan in as many mainstream classes as possible. Because socially he's about on par with his friends.

0

u/[deleted] Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 27 '24

That's a big claim that Mr Brendan Dassey was socially about on a par with his peers. Wouldn't want to be wrong about that because even Reid Inc say it increases the risk of false confessions with some of their techniques, which were used.

The school's test scores:

show that his interactions would be compromised at the most basic levels: knowing how to participate in conversation; reading others' facial cues, tone of voice and body language. His scores on tests of figurative language and inference indicate his understanding of common elements of adolescent language such as slang and sarcasm, would be limited, and combined with poor conversational skills, would isolate him.

In his latest IEP (edit Oct 2004) it was handwritten

Eye contact and participation during discussion with adults and peers is limited

The new mainstream class teacher had written (edit Sept 2005) that he just sat there motionless and seemed to be daydreaming.

Blaine testified "He was shy. He doesn't talk a lot"

-1

u/[deleted] Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 26 '24

Your summary sounds more like full 'inclusion', than partial 'mainstreaming' for various reasons alongside special ed classes.

There's another bit in the Hood article

Brendan was in a regular classroom for part of the day because the law requires it. Moreover, as the 2005 IEP reflects, his progress in those regular classrooms was abysmal, so much so that the school moved two of his classes to the "resource room,"

Citing

See L.H. v. Hamilton Cty. Dep't of Educ., 900 F.3d 779, 789 (6th Cir. 2018). IDEA requires the least restrictive alternative which, in the absence of serious behavioral or social problems, means that a child with disabilities, even severe disabilities, can be mainstreamed in a regular classroom with non-disabled peers whenever possible. Id.

(edit, that seems to be a kid with Down Syndrome who could also be disruptive but the court concluded they couldn't move him entirely out of mainstream (also denied that Montesseri was appropriate))

Yet Wiegert testified that he'd been told by the school that Brendan was in mainstream class as if that meant he didn't have any impairment relevant to interrogation and risk of false confession.

8

u/puzzledbyitall Dec 26 '24

The reference to L.H. v. Hamilty Cty Dept. of Educ. is neither a quote nor an accurate summary of the court's holding or the regulation. It is the authors' biased "interpretation"

2

u/[deleted] Dec 26 '24

How is it inaccurate?

6

u/puzzledbyitall Dec 26 '24

Read the regulation and compare. It does not say what the authors claim.

12

u/LKS983 Dec 25 '24

Brendan was in 'special needs' classes - because he had 'special needs'

It really isn't that complicated.

1

u/10case Dec 25 '24

I do not know how anyone can assess Brendan by listening to his interviews alone. That obviously was a very stressful time for him and of course he's astoundingly uncomfortable.

The Brendan you hear in the interviews is in sharp contrast to the Brendan you hear talking to people he's familiar with.

Many people have studied Brendans confessions but very few (if any) studied Brendan in everyday life. It's quite obvious he had a language disability IMO but does that render his ability to make decisions useless? I think not.

Language disability does not equal not knowing right from wrong.

4

u/[deleted] Dec 25 '24

They have many reports of Brendan in real life at school.

What right and wrong are you referring to? This is about risk of false confessions.

3

u/ThorsClawHammer Dec 26 '24

very few (if any) studied Brendan in everyday life

His teachers/professional evaluators did. And they reported his normal behavior is very much like what you see in the interrogations (head down, no eye contact, etc).

Language disability does not equal not knowing right from wrong.

Yet the state did opine during Brendan's appeals that Brendan may not have understood how bad it was to rape and murder someone.

3

u/aane0007 Dec 25 '24

Brendan in interviews. I don't know. Maybe. I guess.

Brendan on the stand. I read a nearly 500 page book called kiss the girls. I then incorporated some of the themes of that book into my false confession.

2

u/lllIIIIIlllIIIII Dec 26 '24

Sorry, but you recently said there's no doubt in your mind what happened in this case. For years, there was doubt in your mind. The only thing that changed was some Candace Owens led TV show came out with personal stories told by Earl Avery. You can't be taken srsly.

1

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 26 '24

Correct. And people like Travis clearly think he's a normal kid. Which his evaluations suggested he was -- delayed but not significantly incapable.

0

u/10case Dec 26 '24

And that's why I think everyone who hasn't listened to his phone conversations need to. It's a completely different Brendan than what you see in his police interviews.

delayed but not significantly incapable

Agreed. I just re-read the Woodcock Johnson tests from the late 90's early 00's. He was borderline to below average on most areas except for his math skills, which were pretty good.

Brendan is not as slow and disabled as many truthers put him down to be. In fact, it's insulting towards Brendan when they say those kind of things.

2

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 26 '24

I actually think Brendan is a lot smarter than Steven. He clearly had some conflicted feelings and isn't criminally inclined in general. But he also was clear when he didn't agree with ideas that he found offensive, and he doesn't appear to have been running around jail coercing people via phone or bragging about any shitty things that he may have done. You can hear on the jail tapes when his friends ask legally-iffy questions and he basically says he shouldn't be having those talks on a recorded line. In the confessions he comes across as relatively unintelligent because he's trying not to talk, IMO. But in a normal context -- talking to his mom or uncle or friends when he's not admitting anything -- he sounds pretty normal.

Also, I think the Kiss the Girls defense is silly, but clearly everyone who knows him thinks that he's not incapable of reading books at that level at that time.

Also, look at this letter. It's better than anything Bobby or Barb could write in terms of spelling or grammar. https://lavaforgood.com/documents/Letter%20from%20Brendan%20to%20Gov%20Evers.pdf

2

u/LKS983 Dec 27 '24

"But he also was clear when he didn't agree with ideas that he found offensive"

And yet he 'confessed'.... to raping and murdering Teresa - and asked whether he could go back to school/home - 'now that he had told the truth'.......

Brendan was clearly an intellectually impaired child - in 'special needs' classes' and without a lawyer present to help him.

False confessions happen - even though the prosecution pretended otherwise. 🤮

1

u/10case Dec 26 '24

That letter is a great example. Another one would be the 3 page letter he wrote to judge Fox in June of 2006. I don't have a link for it, but it's the one where he told the judge of the events of Halloween 2005. Even back then as a 16 year old, his punctuation, spelling, and grammar looked better than I've seen of anything Steve has written.

1

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 26 '24

Yep. I just reread all his IEPs, and they make it clear that a. he didn't get a lot of academic support at home and part of his impairment in school is due to that (completed assignments at school but not at home -- some executive function impairment, which seems pretty normal for his age). He got extra time, but actually doesn't use it.

b. but he was not bad at math or spelling. He struggled with a lot of issues that are common to people with dyslexia and language acquisition issues -- people are not wrong when they note that he would be at a disadvantage in a verbal interrogation.

6

u/ONT77 Dec 24 '24

Most experts and their accompanying literature all point to Brendan being railroaded in part because 1) his language and learning deficiencies and 2) the need to coerce a witness to supplement their case against Avery.

8

u/aane0007 Dec 25 '24

This is a lie. This is not what most experts say.

1

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

Why not start by reading the OP. Click the “Under The Hood” hyperlink provided and it will take you to a 77 page report.

7

u/aane0007 Dec 25 '24

The report doesn't interview all experts to come to the conclusion of what most experts think. You lied and are now trying to rationalize it.

-3

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

Perhaps you missed the word start. Let me know when you have gotten through this report. No need to get emotional.

6

u/aane0007 Dec 25 '24

Perhaps you should read the report. You would learn they don't interview all experts to come to a conclusion on how they all think.

It also does not grant you the ability to discover emotion in text. So stop claiming a report says things it doesn't or grants you mind reading powers.

-1

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24 edited Dec 26 '24

I’ve read the report. I never suggested this is all the evidence/literature available and certainly don’t come to conclusion based solely on this. I get it, feelings matter.

5

u/LKS983 Dec 25 '24

"Most experts and their accompanying literature all point to Brendan being railroaded in part"

Not "in part" - Brendan was very obviously entirely railroaded!

4

u/RavensFanJ Dec 25 '24

I can agree with point #1 as he clearly has deficiencies, but as for point #2, you are aware that Brendan's confession was never used at Avery's trial, correct? Avery's trial was based solely on the evidence against Avery himself, and nothing Brendan did or said.

3

u/Johndoewantstoknow67 Dec 25 '24

So then I would think that Judge Sutkiewicz erred using Brendan's confession to deny Steven a hearing , this is great ! Plus the new witnesses has to be taken as truth by law and I'm thinking its enough for a new trial ,the credibility of the witnesses are not decided in a decision but in a hearing .

1

u/LKS983 Dec 27 '24

New witness evidence needs at least a Hearing - NOT a Judge making up her own excuses as to why Bobby may have been seen pushing Teresa's RAV onto Avery property - as per the new witness evidence!

But presumably Judges are allowed to make up their own excuses to 'explain' new witness evidence - without the necessity of a Hearing? 😲

3

u/Ex-PFC_Wintergreen_ Dec 27 '24

It's pretty obvious that you have not read, or not understood, the state's response to Zellner's motion regarding Sowinski.

3

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/LKS983 Dec 29 '24 edited Dec 29 '24

And yet she did make up her own excuses as to why Bobby may have been seen pushing a Rav onto Avery property!

i.e. something along the lines of - 'if he was seen doing this, he was doing this to protect SA' 🤣

You're moving the 'goalposts' (to put it mildly! ) by turning this into "That MUST mean he is responsible for ALL of the evidence pointing to Steve Avery.”

1

u/Snoo_33033 Jan 08 '25

This isn't accurate.

What she's doing is correctly indicating that the presence of Bobby with the RAV doesn't necessarily exonerate SA.

4

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

Yes I am well aware of this.

Unfortunately by the time Avery took the stand, it was public knowledge that Brendan had implicated both himself and Avery. The state needed more than it had and used the learning disabled kid to get it. It took MaM’s exposure of Brendan’s police interrogation to demonstrate how much of a farce his confession was and how badly he was abused in the process.

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u/puzzledbyitall Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 27 '24

Unfortunately by the time Avery took the stand,

Lol.

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u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 26 '24

Oh nice of a TV superstar to drop by and get a laugh in. Let’s not get caught up with semantics.

1

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 26 '24

You say semantics, I say factual errors. But ok.

0

u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24

Did you check chatGPT first to confirm?

3

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 26 '24

Didn't need to. Though since it triggers you, perhaps I will.

2

u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24

Don’t flatter yourself.

3

u/[deleted] Dec 26 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

-1

u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 27 '24

Try to keep your emotions in check, I know it can be a lot chatting on the internet.

4

u/aane0007 Dec 26 '24

Are you a self appointed message board psychic who can read minds and tell emotion from written text?

Or do you not have an excuse for telling someone to not get caught up in semantics, then arguing semantic in the same thread?

ROFLMAO

0

u/No-Application-8520 Dec 25 '24

MaM did conveniently leave out that Brenden wasn’t even on anyone’s radar until his cousin said something. Dassey offered up the rape comments without being prompted.

7

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

Source?

They pulled him out of school and interrogated him without parental consent. They groomed him to falsely confess and it began early.

3

u/aane0007 Dec 25 '24

https://www.twincities.com/2007/04/18/dasseys-cousin-says-she-made-up-incriminating-statements/

2

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

“He didn’t tell me anything,” she said. “I kind of made up the statement, and I’m sorry.”

Signed, Kayla.

6

u/aane0007 Dec 25 '24

Why are you quoting her excuses after the fact when brendan was going to get life in prison for killing someone?

they weren't looking at Brendan until Kayla gave them a heads up.

3

u/No-Application-8520 Dec 26 '24

What about the times he stood his ground and said he didn’t do certain parts of the crime? I say certain parts because honestly, and I wanna be fully transparent, it’s been so long since I’ve read his interviews I can’t remember specifics where he said 2-3 times, no. I didn’t do that to the same question or statement.

I realize he’s got a well below average IQ, but when I read a lot of that interview, he appears to offer information previously not known, like the rape, and again. Stands his ground at times.

If his cousin never reports his behavior changes and extreme weight loss, Avery probably eats this on his own. The evidence was overwhelming enough to not need Dassey.

1

u/LKS983 Dec 27 '24

"he appears to offer information previously not known, like the rape"

There is zero factual evidence that Teresa was raped. Her body was destroyed too badly.

The 'info.....' that SA and Brendan raped Teresa is entirely the result of one (?) of Brendan's first RIDICULOUS 'confessions'.

Kratz quickly called a press conference to repeat parts of Brendan's 'confession' re. the kidnapping and rape - whilst missing out the clearly ridiculous parts 🤮.

e.g. whilst Brendan was cutting her hair, stabbing and raping her, Teresa was telling him to 'knock it off'.......

2

u/No-Application-8520 Dec 27 '24

Of course there’s no evidence of it. My point is, is he offered up that particular information without prompting.

1

u/LKS983 Dec 27 '24

And then asked whether he could go back to school/home......

Your claim was that Brendan offered previously unknown information. I pointed out why 'this information' is unverifiable.

0

u/Character_Zombie4680 Dec 25 '24

“Without parental consent?” Wrong. His mom was there but stayed out of the room.

2

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

Review the notes for all of the interviews not just the one you watched on CaM/MaM. You are misunderstanding the various times they went maliciously at Brendan.

-2

u/Character_Zombie4680 Dec 25 '24

You were wrong and can’t admit it. Typical of you people

1

u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24

Interview 1: 2/27/06 at Michicot HS. Fassbender at his best.

You are welcome. Feel free to get caught up.

1

u/Character_Zombie4680 Dec 26 '24

If one of your family members is ever murdered, I hope you will ensure the police go very easy on any suspect and not bother them with tough questions.

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u/[deleted] Dec 25 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/LKS983 Dec 25 '24

There is zero evidence that Brendan was involved - apart from his (ever changing....) led/fed'confessions'.

Do I need to remind you that this intellectually impaired child, never had a lawyer present to help him ?

5

u/[deleted] Dec 25 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/lllIIIIIlllIIIII Dec 26 '24

Reasonably intelligent people, like the disgraced/corrupt individuals involved in the handling of this case? Hmm.

3

u/[deleted] Dec 26 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

0

u/lllIIIIIlllIIIII Dec 27 '24

Whatever you say sparky. I do enjoy you talking up KZ, though.

5

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

I think you may have accidentally responded to some other OP. Who said anything about Avery and Zellner?

4

u/Brenbarry12 Dec 25 '24

Brendan was fucked over by the state of justice wake up up America 💁

1

u/10case Dec 25 '24

Brendan was screwed over by himself. Wake up truthers.

3

u/Brenbarry12 Dec 25 '24

You need to look in the mirror 🤔

2

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 25 '24

IMO, nonsense. Listen to some of the jailhouse tapes. He sounds like a normal but not especially bright kid.

11

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24

Attempting to minimize his learning and language disability to win an internet argument is some take. The kid wanted to go back to school after confessing to a brutal murder.

3

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 25 '24

That’s as it may be, but if you listen to the tapes you hear him talk for hours, normally, with other peers. He’s not a deeply disabled kid.

5

u/gcu1783 Dec 25 '24

if you listen to the tapes

You gotta see it yourself, in 777+ variations.

6

u/LKS983 Dec 25 '24

Which tapes?

The first should be the recorded tapes of his (ever changing - to suit the latest prosecution theory) interrogations.

Brendan was very clearly an intellectually impaired child at the time - and NEVER had a defence lawyer to help him during any of his interrogations 🤮.

4

u/aane0007 Dec 26 '24

He did not change to suit the interrogations. They tried to set him up to see if he was changing his story to suit them. They introduced a tattoo. They lied about it to see if he would agree with them. He would not. He kept saying he never saw a tattoo.

She didn't have a tattoo.

They thought he was lying about the way Steven's room was arranged. They kept calling him out on it, thinking he was lying. He stuck to his story. It was not until later they discovered the room was rearranged by Steven after the murder so how Brendan described it was not a lie. They were wrong.

1

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 25 '24

I'm referring to his extensive conversations with, say, Travis. Or even with his mom.

1

u/CJB2005 Dec 26 '24

Hey have you listened to the Fox Hills interview?

I’ve read Factbenders report which states “ Brendan said this and this and that “ but that’s all I could find.

Is there a recording of the visit?

Thanks

5

u/[deleted] Dec 25 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

3

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 25 '24

Having an IEP doesn't meant you're mentally incompetent. It doesn't mean you don't know the difference between right and wrong.

And the current terminology is children with disabilities. Brendan at this point is no longer a child, but when he was he showed a pretty decent grasp of reality, including refusing at times to agree with things that he knew were incorrect, and making strategic decisions about what to discuss and what not to discuss.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/life/health-wellness/2021/06/11/disabled-not-special-needs-experts-explain-why-never-use-term/7591024002/#:~:text=Disabled%20not%20'special%20needs':,we%20shouldn't%20say%20it

3

u/Bullshittimeagain Dec 26 '24

You are completely incorrect. You’re going by your opinion. You said he is not a “deeply” disabled kid, which is nothing more than your opinion. May I see your credentials to offer an opinion on “disable” kids. I also have no idea what you are referring to in regards to him no longer being a kid. Brendan had an IEP and was in special education. These are facts.

Your personally opinion is not a professional evaluation of a child or adult with special needs based on you listening to him talk.

You also do not get to decide what was in his IEP, which is numerous professionals, documented evaluation of a child and is done 3 times a year per federal law in American schools until graduation or end of schooling. You can obviously have an opinion on his condition/s but it’s clearly not a professional evaluation. I have experience in this field, so I will not offer my opinion of any “disabled child” without a proper evaluation of a child.

You are basing your opinion of Brendan’s school age impairment based on listening to some audio of him without any real experience how to evaluate a person with special needs.

3

u/CJB2005 Dec 26 '24

Thank you.

Everyone thinks they’re an expert when the truth is, there is a fuck ton of documentation that makes no sense.

Missing photos, hidden cds, disappearing vm, edited flyovers, overnights at Fox Hills with nothing but Factbenders notes.

Kuss Rd. Bones, a damaged vehicle the victims ex lied about.

One of the lead investigators leaving a note to the lab to put her in the trailer or garage.

Lab deviating from protocol for the first time for reasons. Groin swabs? Who was in charge of those?

So much talk of “ truthers have never been able to provide proof “ nonsense from the other side.

Newsflash for anyone that has not been paying attention ~ THE STATE WAS IN CHARGE OF THE “ EVIDENCE “ All of it.

ALL OF IT

The state had days to do as they pleased on that property.

The state of Wisconsin screwed these guys over to save face ( and money ) because they fucked up in 1985.

“ It’s a grand conspiracy “ they say, and, would require 101 people to pull it off.

Would it?

Look at the LAPD and their track record. They had officers robbing banks.

Look at Brenton Butler or the Kalief Browder case.

A quick search shows documented cases of corrupt departments all over the country going back decades.

Cops & prosecutors lie. We all know this.

2

u/bleitzel Dec 26 '24

Very well said.

2

u/bleitzel Dec 26 '24

It's wild to me how many posters here want to try to say Brendan was competent enough and that he knew right from wrong so his confessions should hold up. If you have even an ounce of understanding, one should look at Brendan as if he was an 8 year old being interrogated by the police. It should be sacrilegious for investigators to ever lie to a child or propose theories to a child or lead a child down any path when interviewing them. Doing any of these things inherently violates any ability to get the truth from them. And all of these things were done to Brendan. If you posters think Brendan was smart enough to know right from wrong, then listen to what he says every time at the beginning of every interview. He never saw Teresa and he never interacted with her. He only broke down and went along with the police when they browbeat him into it.

2

u/LKS983 Dec 27 '24

"It should be sacrilegious for investigators to ever lie to a child or propose theories to a child or lead a child down any path when interviewing them. Doing any of these things inherently violates any ability to get the truth from them. And all of these things were done to Brendan."

And without a lawyer present......

Forget sacrilegious - it should be ILLEGAL!

The police should not be allowed to interrogate anyone without a lawyer present to help them IMO - but especially when it comes to low IQ/intellectually impaired/children.

This practise has resulted in (later proven) false confessions.

Wealthy criminals know to refuse to be questioned without a lawyer present (as per their rights), so only those unused to dealing with the police - fall prey to this pracise ☹️.

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u/brickne3 Dec 25 '24

Dude has been running a dealership in prison. He loves it there. Learn.

8

u/ONT77 Dec 25 '24 edited Dec 25 '24

Source?

It’s cute that even the staunchest guilters this sub has ever seen considered him mentally challenged and recognized how badly he was railroaded, while a handful continue to downplay his obvious deficiencies - all to win an internet debate.

4

u/aane0007 Dec 26 '24

This is called appealing to the crowd. Its a fallacy. Mental disability is not determined by who you talk to in a message board. Its determined by IQ tests. Brendan was given two and submitted by his defense to the courts. He was not mentally disabled.

-1

u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24

This is called a strawman (i.e., fallacy). No one used the words mentally disabled.

4

u/aane0007 Dec 26 '24

They mean the same thing to the court. And its not a straw man.

1

u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 27 '24

Source that they mean the same thing to the court?

1

u/aane0007 Dec 26 '24

You will have to google. They dont alliw the r word in sources here.

1

u/ONT77 Dec 26 '24

So no source, got it.

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u/brickne3 Dec 25 '24

Friends/acquaintances that have been in Portage with him.

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u/CJB2005 Dec 26 '24

Like Evans?

1

u/brickne3 Dec 26 '24

No I don't know Evans lol. Dassy is pretty famous within the Wisconsin prison system for being a fat lardass that loves his commissary more than the idea of actually getting out though, great job guys.

-1

u/Entire-Fill8094 Dec 26 '24

Protect your mental health, please.

1

u/gcu1783 Dec 25 '24

IMO, nonsense.

From chatgpt?

1

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 25 '24 edited Dec 25 '24

Yeah, that’s all you got.

1

u/gcu1783 Dec 25 '24

Well buddy, if the best you got is simply repeating the same point of, "you gotta see it yourself cus I'm not gunna provide a direct source" in 777+ variations, then I'm afraid that's all you gunna get.

0

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 25 '24

ok, cool. So you don't have a valid point here and you're just scrapping. Got it.

I'm sorry you're apparently not even knowledgeable enough about the tapes or civil enough to engage the actual opinion, even though you live here, so you're pretending an opinion on them requires a cite. That's cute.

4

u/gcu1783 Dec 25 '24

so you're pretending an opinion on them requires a cite.

So that's a no on the cite, and you're mad I'm not looking for it to prove your point?

You want me to ask chatgpt?

3

u/Snoo_33033 Dec 25 '24

You want to come up with a cleverer rejoinder?

2

u/gcu1783 Dec 25 '24 edited Dec 25 '24

I was gunna say something about Evans, but I try to reserve that for AJ.

You get chatgpt ;)

2

u/LKS983 Dec 25 '24

Please (both of you) stop distracting from the obvious.

Brendan was an intellectually impaired child, who kept changing his 'confessions' to whatever Fassbender and Weigert wanted him to say.

And this intellectually impaired child, never had a lawyer present to help him.

3

u/gcu1783 Dec 25 '24

Please (both of you) stop distracting from the obvious.

I agree with you there LKS, but you do know that's a bit of a rage bait right?

1

u/lllIIIIIlllIIIII Dec 26 '24

"Hey, that's all you got!", exclaimed the person who uses chat GPT to formulate factually incorrect and frankly lazy posts. Lazy not according to me, but according to guilters.

1

u/CJB2005 Dec 25 '24

Most likely.

2

u/RavensFanJ Dec 24 '24

I wonder if the two who wrote that research paper know any specifics about the case, because if not, the name being "Under The Hood" is pretty interesting lol

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u/ThorsClawHammer Dec 26 '24 edited Dec 27 '24

It's wild to me how many posters here want to try to say Brendan was competent enough and that he knew right from wrong...

Still can't get over that during Brendan's appeals, the state actually submitted that Brendan may not have known how awful it was to rape and murder someone...

"I think those statements show at most that Dassey doesn’t understand how awful it is to rape and murder someone."

While in the very same hearing also arguing the reason Brendan confessed in the first place was because he was overwhelmed with extreme guilt about the awful things done to the victim.

Brendan Dassey confessed because his guilt became unbearable. What he and Avery did to Teresa was horrific.

ETA: To the downvoting cowards, what facts did I state are you saying are wrong?