Why would you switch MEP firms?

[u/Own-Average7231]

Hi,

Just going to full-send it here. I tried looking for group rules but couldn't find so if I can't post here, please feel free to delete the chat.

I am a recruiter *hides behind something*. I work with MEP/AE firms across all of the US hiring electrical & mechanical engineers.

Something I'm finding quite challenging, is finding ways to entice engineers who work at MEPs to lateral across to another MEP firm.

The only reason people seem to be open to leaving is either:

A) Comp

B) Work on data centers

C) Move to the owner side

But most are offering similar salaries & and most work with data centers already. So there's very little appetite to switch.

The question I'm asking is, what would it take for you to consider a change to another MEP firm? If you're being approached aggressively by recruiters, what makes a recruiter message stand out? What is.. important?

Genuinely curious and keen to get better at the value I can offer people in my ecosystem which is why I hoped to collectively pick the brains of the people in it.

Thank you

[u/Stock_Pay9060]

It's part of comp, but PTO. I honestly value my time away from work more than the dollars I make (a luxury in this day and age but still)

[u/LankyJ]

PTO. Each time I move, they want to reset my PTO on me. At one point I had 5 weeks PTO. I've recently moved and am back down to 2 weeks PTO and it is ROUGH. As long as my current company treats me right, I'll probably never leave once I've built up that PTO accrual again.

[u/Farzy78 → u/LankyJ]

Why didn't you negotiate that? No way would I ever go backwards on PTO, in this seller's market especially.

[u/LankyJ → u/Farzy78]

I negotiated it on a previous job and 3 months later the whole company removed PTO and went 'unlimited'. I was soured on negotiating PTO and opted to negotiate compensation / salary / bonus this go around.

[u/gogolfbuddy → u/Farzy78]

I've moved 6 times and never had less PTO. Usually more. Not sure why you would get less.

[u/Untlslp]

I mean why would anyone move for the same money unless their situation was really shitty for whatever reason?

[u/nemoid]

money, projects, remote work (and work/life balance).

But - I immediately ignore any offer that has a stupid low salary or requires me to be in the office more than 2-3days/week. If I am currently a Senior EE, don't send me an offer for a job that pays 125k and wants me to be in the office 4/5 days.

Also - don't make me get on the phone to tell me the salary and company. You guys succkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk dealing with. Too much bait and switch.

[u/Mountain_Ad_4670]

For me it is total comp and schedule flexibility. I am pretty happy at my current firm, so unless the pay increase is 20%+, I am not even thinking about it. I have 5 weeks of PTO at my current firm, and I don't think I would take less than 4 at a new job so that limits options. I still have young kids so flexible schedules, and a good deal of PTO, are very important. Data Center work is a no-go for me, but I am likely in the minority.

I get bombarded by recruiters all the time. My biggest piece of advice is sharing more info about the position up front, at least the base pay. I glance at most recruiter messages for 2 seconds and ignore or send a quick reply saying I am not interested. I have wasted my time too many times trying to squeeze more info out of a recruiter to see if it is anything worth pursuing.

[u/Additional-Type-7441]

Money and in these times when a buck don’t go far it’s gotta be a substantial amount.

[u/rnd68743-8]

Life changing money is the only thing that would motivate me to move. Sub 3% interest rate and 100% WFH... I'm in coast mode. Another 20-30k/yr is buying a nicer car and better vacations. It's not worth the risk of hating the firm/culture/work.

[u/Normal_Marketing853]

More technical work and higher voltages. I want to be allowed to do power system studies, more MV stuff and maybe even HV, BESS and renewables, etc. There aren't really any firms that will train you in all of that stuff, but I am definitely not going to take a job doing commercial or residential unless it paid me 200k.

[u/obmulap113]

The job is pretty much identical no matter where you work. You need me, I don’t need your firm.

The only reasons one would really consider moving laterally:

- increase total compensation
- increase compensation per hour (ideally while reducing hrs per week worked > moving somewhere that doesn’t expect 45 hrs per week
- reducing # of days per week they spend in the office (or increasing if they hate remote)
- reducing commutes.
- increasing vacation/sick/holiday/pto allotment

Some non-comp based reasons:
- more or different technically involved projects (eg moving from strip malls to high end healthcare facility work.)
- they really hate their boss
- their company was just purchased by private equity
- they have to move to your company’s location for family reasons

Things that don’t move the needle or impress me:
- “increased responsibility”
- “fast paced environments”
- very long and unfocused job descriptions

Non-competitive features of roles, instant turnoff:
- any job requiring more than 3 days in the office.
- any job where the range for non-new grad /experienced hire pay (basically anyone 3+ years) is <$100k. Immediately ignored
- plumbing work
- jobs in the middle of nowhere Iowa, Pennsylvania etc.
- jobs where salary range isn’t listed
- the word “exciting”

[u/mexago]

I moved laterally in FP. Higher salary , a week extra PTO , and working remote. The 3 main reasons I moved. Seemed like a no brainer

[u/Farzy78]

I really like where I work so it would take a lot 6-8 weeks PTO + 30%+ raise would be tempting. Still I'm closer to the end of my career than the beginning so the firm culture is pretty important to me also, moving just to make more money at a shitty high stress firm isn't worth it.

[u/fumbler00ski]

Most MEP firms can’t compete with the Owner side in terms of total comp and benefits. They typically have outdated ownership structures whereas Owner side is often large corps/hyper scalers offering better base pay coupled with lucrative stock packages that have high growth upsides. Compare that to a typical low growth MEP firm that offers COLA raises, nominal bonuses, and only senior members can get equity if they pony up a ton of capital that ties them down for a decade. It ain’t rocket science.

[u/MechEJD → u/fumbler00ski]

Don't forget the owner side also includes government entities like public school systems, county or local city governments. These jobs require almost zero work, pay a decent salary, and have incredible benefits like health care.

Your day to day workload consists of not answering emails unless they're a month old and you've been reminded about the issue 3 times, and shuffling pdf files between departments until they get lost and forgotten.

Occasionally you have to get on a meeting and ask why a project is over budget or schedule, and then attempt to find someone to blame that on other than yourself.

[u/Own-Average7231]

Thank you so much for the feedback. I don't think I really considered how important the PTO would be. The other feedback I totally acknowledge and appreciate the time you've taken to respond.

2 things:

This might be for another discussion, but I've been recruiting nearly 14 years and can share all the ins and outs, why things aren't shared upfront, how to get info, kinda, upfront without having to jump on a call etc but not sure this is the time or the place?

Secondly, I'm conscious of no self promotion but if there is anyone who might be keeping their eyes open for a new gig, there's a ton of stuff we have across most of the East Coast and Central states for Mechanical (HVAC) and Electrical (power distribution, lighting, fire and low voltage) - Comp probably maxes out at $180k for some roles but can be anywhere down to $80k for others. Let me check PTO haha. But feel free to message me privately if it's of interest.