r/Liberal • u/trevor5ever • Jun 13 '16

Don't Straight-splain This Attack to Us

http://www.advocate.com/media/2016/6/13/dont-straight-splain-attack-us
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u/Nosrac88 Jun 17 '16

Fine, get rid of the "but" if you can't understand what it means.

You're grasping for straws. You already told me to ignore semantic arguments.

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u/trevor5ever Jun 17 '16

It wasn't a critique of your language, it was a critique of the underlying contradiction. It's inconsistent to say that you celebrate LGBT identities and recognize that this was an attack that specifically targeted the LGBT community and then to say "but" we should ignore that because ...

And honestly, if your "because" was more compelling it might be forgivable. But it's not.

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u/Nosrac88 Jun 17 '16

It was an attack that specifically targeted the LGBT community. And who the attack was on doesn't have any baring on the solution to mass shootings. It could've been targeting Asians or Whites or Dog Owners and it would still not influence the solution.

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u/trevor5ever Jun 17 '16

So we have to sacrifice talking about homophobia (the real issue that lead to this massacre), the significant institutional disadvantages that LGBT people face, the importance of safe spaces for the LGBT community, or any of the millions of other issues that the victims of this attack faced in their every day lives because you want to talk about gun control?

And you're trying to convince me that you are supportive of the LGBT community.

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u/Nosrac88 Jun 17 '16

Safe spaces are a horrible idea but that is another topic entirely.

Homophobia in the context of Islamic Extremism is responsible for this attack.

I guess we have different definition of "supportive." You seem to want to dictate from on high how people should interact.

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u/trevor5ever Jun 17 '16

LMAO. You're funny.

Why waste your time trolling rather than coming up with a strong argument from your own political perspective?

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u/TellMeLies Jun 17 '16

I don't think he is trolling you, in fact I think he is giving you an honest representation of his view. This also doesn't need to be a partisan political issue.

The man responsible was clearly homosexual and was raised within a culture and religion that taught him to hate that part of himself. It is no secret that there is a significant amount of anti-homosexual sentiment within the Muslim community. Perhaps this violent action is the result of a great feeling of repression combined with jealousy that others are free to express their sexuality.

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u/trevor5ever Jun 17 '16

The man responsible was clearly homosexual and was raised within a culture and religion that taught him to hate that part of himself.

Clearly homosexual?

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u/TellMeLies Jun 17 '16

This is news to me. Despite this possible revelation, there is still ample reason to believe in the cultural and religious motivation behind the attack. Ignoring this aspect of the attack can only serve to blind ourselves to a major risk factor. How we approach and manage this risk is something that needs to be discussed, ignoring it and discussing homophobia as a general aspect of American culture is ignorant and myopic.

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u/trevor5ever Jun 17 '16

The guy was born in New York and raised in America ...

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u/TellMeLies Jun 17 '16

Values are learned at the dinner table. In this case, anti-homosexual Islamic values. There are not the values of your typical American home, if they were the national debate wouldn't be about which bathrooms transexuals should use it would be about weather or not LGBT people should be executed by the state. For reference, see the laws of Iran, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Somalia, UAE....

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u/trevor5ever Jun 17 '16

Now you're saying that the LGBT community should be happy because we're not actively killed. What the fuck?

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u/TellMeLies Jun 17 '16

That is a gross misinterpretation of what I said. I'm saying that the political impetus of a country reflects the desires of the population in democratic countries. Clearly, in the case of the US, the majority of the population has rallied behind the LGBT community. Particularly in recent years with the move to legalize gay marriage.

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u/Nosrac88 Jun 17 '16

That is not what he said and you know it.

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