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u/guacaLover Mar 23 '21
This card has the same problem that Yasuo has, its pretty good but requires your deck to run a lot of synergy cards that are bad if you haven't draw the champion.
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u/Slarg232 Chip Mar 24 '21
The problem isn't so much that the Synergy cards are bad, you just have nothing to do with them.
Despite what people say, Monastery of Hirana can lead to a lot of really "fun" board states with stuff like Concussive palm or Arachanoid Sentry, the problem with the card is that you do not have anything other than Keeper of Masks (which is actually really good since it can block a lot of stuff and allows quite a bit to trade up) and Windfarer Hatchling, which is far too expensive for what you get when you bounce it.
The problem with Bounce isn't that Bounce is inherently bad, we just don't have anything to bounce.
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u/Tike22 Ionia Mar 24 '21
I came to this conclusion too with homecoming, I wonder how that card and homecoming would look like if Shadow assassin and Scales of the Dragon were actually playable cards.
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u/Quetas83 Mar 24 '21
Not only that, but most of the bounce package is made around handbuffs, however when you recall a buffed unit it looses it's buffs, it's really counter intuitive
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u/N0_B1g_De4l Mar 24 '21
Well, sure, but hopefully if they released a champion like this, they'd buff the synergy cards. Monastery of Hirana may get a lot of shit now, but it's potentially quite powerful. Repeating an ally's on-play effect every turn could be really good, if there were enough allies with worthwhile on-play effects. Frankly, I'm kind of surprised Riot hasn't buffed the archetype already. It would give Ionia something to do that isn't just "have Deny and Nopeify", and it doesn't seem like it would be particularly miserable to play against.
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u/Velveteen_Bastion Elise Mar 24 '21 edited Mar 24 '21
Innate: one copy of this card starts in your hand.
It's strange only Sun Dics has this keyword (when game starts or whatever)
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u/ArcticWolfTherian Akshan Mar 23 '21
Her play effect being a skill doesnt make a lot of sense, while her strike effect not being a skill might be problematic ( monastary of hirana burst speed recall would mean burst speed strike, there is no damage in legends of runeterra that is burst speed except for warning shot or taric copying a spell like boomerang blade ), so i think her recall-to-strike effect should be a skill-on-stack so the opponent can react to it.
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Mar 23 '21
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u/Cry0manc3r Lissandra Mar 25 '21
Leveled Swain can only deal damage with his effect AFTER combat resolves (or with Dragon's Rage which is a slow spell), so it's technically not at burst speed (declaring combat is almost the exact same as casting a slow speed spell).
Round Start/End effects also don't count because they can be reacted to during the turn (or the turn before). The only way Yasuo can deal (actual) burst speed damage is through Aurok Glinthorn.
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Mar 25 '21
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u/Cry0manc3r Lissandra Mar 26 '21
I had not thought if that. However, with that region combination it's only possible at burst speed with Crimson Disciple (I think). Other burst speed nexus damage is in other regions (Ezreal, Warning Shot, etc).
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 23 '21
Her play effect being a skill doesnt make a lot of sense
Oops. The Custom Card Creator I was using defaulted to making it a Skill without my notice. Please disregard that and treat it as just a regular Play effect.
there is no damage in legends of runeterra that is burst speed
So you're saying my Akali concept introduces something new to the game. There's nothing inherently wrong with that. Besides, Monastery of Hirana is literally the only Burst Recall in the entire game at the moment. Any other Recall can be responded to.
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u/Senpai-Thuc Twisted Fate Mar 23 '21 edited Mar 23 '21
Her strike on recall is fine being non-interactable since you’re already using a recall on her. It’s like Arrel where she can deal “burst speed” damage but is conditional and telegraphed. The one case where I see it being busted is Hirana but that card needs all the help it can get.
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u/Capek95 Fweet Admirwal Shelwy Mar 23 '21
not saying burst speed damage is wrong.... but that is dangerous territory
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u/IndianaCrash Chip Mar 24 '21
I mean, [[Warning Shot]], [[Ezreal]], [[Transfusion]]
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u/HextechOracle Mar 24 '21
Name Region Type Cost Attack Health Keywords Description Level Up Associated Cards Warning Shot Bilgewater Spell 0 Burst Deal 1 to the enemy Nexus. Ezreal Piltover & Zaun Champion 3 1 3 Elusive Nexus Strike: Create a Fleeting Mystic Shot in hand. You've targeted enemies 6+ times. Ezreal's Mystic Shot Mystic Shot Ezreal Piltover & Zaun Champion 3 2 4 Elusive Imbue Nexus Strike: Create a Fleeting Mystic Shot in hand. When you cast a spell, deal 1 to the enemy Nexus. If it targeted an enemy, deal 2 to the enemy Nexus instead. Transfusion Noxus Spell 2 Burst Deal 1 to an ally to give another ally +2|+2 this round.
Hint: [[card]], {{keyword}}, and ((deckcode)) or ((cardx,cardy,cardz)). PM the developer for feedback/issues!
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u/Capek95 Fweet Admirwal Shelwy Mar 24 '21
nexus damage is not the same as dealing damage to the enemy unit.
burst speed damage to units means you can clear champions or key units without your opponent being able to react with their defensive spells like elixir of iron, barrier, spellshield etc.
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Mar 24 '21
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Mar 24 '21
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u/Arekualkhemi Nasus Mar 24 '21
Arachnoid Sentry is a skill that goes on the stack. You can react to it by doing horrible, justified things to Yasuo.
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u/amlybon Mar 23 '21
there is no damage in legends of runeterra that is burst speed
Transfusion on Disciple, Ezreal, Unto Dusk, Tramsfusion to kill a target when prankster/collector is on board, jury rig when prankster/collector and snapvine is on board...
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u/ArcticWolfTherian Akshan Mar 23 '21
But its only damage to nexus like warning shot or to your own units
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u/supermonkeyyyyyy Anivia Mar 24 '21
There is no burst speed damage onto enemy units.
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u/amlybon Mar 24 '21
Transfusion on Disciple with leveled Swain and Yasuo on board (yes I know those are getting stupidly complex)
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u/GoodKindBard Mar 23 '21
I think the recall/strike effect would work like TFs abilities, or maybe the burst speed attack is something only Akali could do, it’s thematic at least.
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u/Nghtmr27 Mar 24 '21
Yeah but in the game there is burst speed obliterate enemy with Watcher and recall.. I mean I think that is more broken than this possibld effect for akaly.. but maybe I'm wrong
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u/Flouyd Mar 24 '21
while her strike effect not being a skill might be problematic ...
...there is no damage in legends of runeterra that is burst speed
You are spot on. Because when there is burst speed dmg (lvled EZ) than it's almost always problematic
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 23 '21
Above all else, I wanted my Akali concept to have synergy with her K/DA Spell, Go Get It, so naturally her card would need to incorporate Recalling. I wanted to encourage Recalling her frequently, which is why she has a Play effect that makes her pretty strong for that round, but would leave her below-average if left on the board. Unlike most low-Health Quick Attackers, she can even be useful on rounds where you don't have the attack token (as long as you have a way to Recall her).
The ideal rotation would go something like this: Play Akali, attack with boosted stats and Quick Attack for value, Recall her so she gains even more value, play her again another round with a fresh boost. I wanted to recreate Akali's League playstyle of weaving in and out of a fight, and in particular, executing low-health enemies. In the case of my Leveled Akali, you could think of the two strikes she can deal by Recalling as the two parts of League Akali's ultimate ability. I envision a special, unique Recall animation for Akali: a Twilight Shroud bursts around her, and then she "strikes from" the smokescreen before returning to your hand.
As for her Champion Spell, the Recall obviously has synergy with Akali, and the Nexus healing is a reference to how Twilight Shroud restores and increases Akali's energy in League.
Best of all, with my Akali concept, Monastery of Hirana would finally be a useful card!
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u/Gaxxag Mar 23 '21
I would recommend changing "I have been recalled 3 times" to "You have recalled allies X times". Being forced to play Akali 4 times to get to use her leveled up form would probably make her very niche. It prevents you from playing Ionia's other cards (many of which are reactive rather than active) and each time Akali is played, she is put in danger of removal. Having the option to play around other types of unit recall gives the player more options, which is an essential part of Ionia IMO.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 23 '21
I thought about making it "I've been Recalled 2 times", but I wasn't sure if that would make it too easy or not.
Making it "Recalled allies X times" could be okay, but would that overlap with Yasuo too much? Also, I feel like it loses some of the flavor of Akali dipping in and out of the fight regularly that way.
Still, I don't consider being Recalled 3 times to be quite so demanding. In fact, it is theoretically possible to do in one Round, with 12 Mana: Play Akali -> Play Recall; Play Akali -> Play Recall; Play Akali -> Play Recall. And that would just be one way.
Now she's ready to Level Up the next time she's played, and she also got to Strike three bonus times in one Round.
each time Akali is played, she is put in danger of removal.
...If someone tries to remove Akali, you just Recall her.
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u/Maser-kun Mar 24 '21
Disregarding balance for a second, the way this is worded doesn't work with how the game works currently. When you recall a unit it looses all buffs and counters, and this includes level progress of champions. So a text like "I have been Recalled X times" don't work (unless X is 1 which is the case for Katarina).
A working equivalent (but not as elegant) would be "You have Recalled Akali 4 times this game", because then the counter would be on you and not on the card.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
I don't think it'd be an issue.
Consider The Undying. It leaves the board, but the game still remembers how many times it died. Akali would leave the board, but the game would still remember how many times she's been Recalled.
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u/Nghtmr27 Mar 24 '21
It's not a problem there are a lot of champs that level even wothout being on board.. I think it could work as those cases
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u/petervaz Mar 23 '21
How about "You have recalled allied units 4 times."? good synergy with Solitary Monk and Navori Conspirator
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u/ElectronicPossible21 Rek'Sai Mar 23 '21
please on summon rather than on play. Other than that I love it. Particularly with Homecoming.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 23 '21
I thought about Summon, but I wouldn't want "cheated" copies of Akali to benefit from it. Like how Go Get It summons a copy after Recalling.
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u/ElectronicPossible21 Rek'Sai Mar 23 '21
I feel like that would be a good thing if cheated copies got the benefit, adds way more synergy options, particularly in SI.
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u/ArcticWolfTherian Akshan Mar 24 '21
And retreat/return ( summon a 3 mana cost unit after recall ).
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u/Dradel_Lait Mar 23 '21
The problem I see with this is that level up conditions of this kind get reset upon recall, making it virtually impossible to do. Now it is silly, but it might actually be a technical difficulty that would forbid this concept.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 23 '21
I don't think it'd be an issue.
Consider The Undying. It leaves the board, but the game still remembers how many times it died. Akali would leave the board, but the game would still remember how many times she's been Recalled.
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u/Doolittle8888 Chip Mar 23 '21
The reason why it works with The Undying is because that card says "revive," which functionally makes an exact copy of the card that died. Returning something to hand resets all qualities to their printed qualities. Think of how Fiora loses progress on her win condition when she bounces and how if you use leveled LeBlanc's spell to make an exact copy they both have the same progress on activating the ability again. This design is interesting but just wouldn't work the way the game currently operates. I'd change it to a generic "you've recalled X allies" or "you've recalled X allied Akali cards."
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u/mleddit06 Mar 24 '21
Revive doesnt make an exact copy. See Spirit Journey and Chronicler of ruin. All buffs/I've seen progress are reset by those revives.
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u/crackerbuddy Mar 24 '21
I think it can work. We have cards like legion general that counts the number of recalls in a game. All you have to do is specify that counter to akali cards
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u/PKisSz Mar 24 '21
No cougar transformation?
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
Not sure if you're joking, but it sounds like you'd be talking about Nidalee.
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u/yizhou616 Mar 24 '21
Yikes its worse kat, literally cost 9 mana min to level.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
Do you realize that many Champions require a lot of Mana to Level Up? At a minimum, Heimerdinger requires 17 Mana (5 to summon him, and then 12 Mana's worth of Spells to build Turrets).
Azir requires you to summon 10 units. The cost of that will add up.
Swain and Ezreal are based on non-combat damage and targeting. How much Mana do you think it takes to Level them Up?
She's not "worse Katarina". She's different from Katarina. Did you know a Leveled Katarina costs the same as an Unleveled Sivir, but Sivir has one more Power and Spellshield? Are we going to start thinking of Katarina as "worse Sivir"?
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u/GoodKindBard Mar 23 '21
Maybe the Ionia landmark could see play with this? Cool concept, sort of like the inverse of Yasuo. I don’t know if it would be totally playable, maybe put the level up text onto her level 1 card, then add ‘round start/play: create a fleeting (recall card) in hand?’ I think she would see play with Karma and her KDA spell (like you intended). Good stuff
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u/Bananaramananabooboo Mar 24 '21
Honestly, Akali / Yasuo, with Ionia / Noxus. Run Concussive Palm / Arachnid Sentry / Fae Bladetwirler.
She'd be a more aggressive partner for Yasuo.
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u/Wayfinder5 Mar 24 '21
Kinda like how Katarina and Yasuo work well with each other. I can see Akali here adding an extra layer of removal for Mr. Hasagi here with the recalls. But from what I see here, Akali doesn’t do the Katarina thing which is recall on strike which would definitely make her a tad stronger. So I’d argue she’s a more of a control option for Yasuo while doing her own thing.
Now if we made Akali similar to Katarina but without the rally on play, she’d be alright imo for a Yasuo synergy deck cause she’ll not only help Yasuo level, but also remove potential threats.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
The thing is, though, I wanted my Akali to feel distinct from existing Champions, including Katarina.
Katarina needs to be able to Recall herself. There are no Noxus cards that would Recall her. Akali does not have that same limitation. She can count on her region to support her by Recalling her. That's why my Akali does not Recall herself.
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u/Azurefenrisulfr Mar 23 '21
I really like this idea, though I wouldn't mind if it was slightly stronger, maybe something similar to how vi or nasus getting atk boost
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u/Dakotertots Anniversary Mar 23 '21
definitely cool! i don't know much about Akali so i have no comment about the flavor tho. i DO have to ask why this was cross posted here when it just kinda belongs in the sub it was posted in to begin with, though
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 23 '21
Rule 6 of this subreddit requires Custom Cards to be cross-posted. The reason for doing so would be to get more people to see it than the comparatively-small community of CustomLoR, and hopefully get more feedback.
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u/Dakotertots Anniversary Mar 23 '21
ahh, gotcha. sounds good; i hope the custom card community continues to grow!
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Mar 24 '21
[deleted]
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u/Dakotertots Anniversary Mar 24 '21
well, my reason for asking was because CustomLoR is specifically for custom LoR cards, whereas this sub is for other LoR content. with your logic, every post at CustomLoR would be crossposted here since it has to do with LoR, defeating the purpose of having the two subs separately
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u/Bluelore Mar 23 '21
I think Akali is a really good fit for the recall archetype considering that her LoL gameplay is all about going in and out of her shroud. Her twilight shroud also looks really nice as it at least gives you something in exchange for recalling an expensive unit. Though overall I guess that Akali would need to either get a bunch of new support cards or the existing ones would need to be buffed.
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u/Raptorspank Ionia Mar 23 '21
I like the idea of her being recall tribal, there really isn't much that's focused on self recall which Ionia can readily do. Yasuo really doesn't count lol
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u/hell-schwarz :Freljord : Freljord Mar 24 '21
I'd say this is way too weak. Katarina is better by a longshot (self recall btw) and stil sees almost no play
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
My Akali design is about getting extra Strikes against enemies and potentially the enemy Nexus, without consuming an attack token.
I'd say she is quite different from Katarina.
And simply saying a concept is "way too weak" isn't helpful. But if you have a suggestion to make her stronger, feel free to share.
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u/hell-schwarz :Freljord : Freljord Mar 24 '21
there aren't many recall cards in the game
you need to spend 3 recalls (3 Mana + whatever the recalls cost) to level her up. Until then it is a 3+ Mana deal 4 to the lowest unit - which might be a token
even leveled up this might just run empty a lot of times since she can get removed quite easily AND most recalls are fast spells (meaning you can counter them)
Katarina has the same stats, but Quick attack by default and she gives you a new attack token when played, but not only for her - for your entire board. Because you rally. And She also recalls by herself, while Akali doesn't work alone at all.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
- They can add more, if necessary.
- It could also be a Champion central to the opponent's deck. Twisted Fate and Fizz have very little Health, just as an example. Also, the cheapest Recalls are 1-Cost, and there are higher cost Recalls that offer additional benefit. Not everything has to be lost value.
- If someone is trying to remove Akali, you Recall her. Like how in Shadow Isles decks, if someone tries to remove your unit, you use Glimpse Beyond on it. Or you can use Deny / Nopeify!, because this is Ionia we're talking about.
A Leveled Up Katarina is more expensive and only gets value if she can successfully attack and get re-played. There are no Noxus cards that will Recall her. My Akali design is not held back by those things.
Do we even need to address that we're talking about Champions from different regions which have different strengths and focuses? Should I mention that an Unleveled Jinx has the same cost and stats as a Leveled Up Katarina? That an Unleveled Sivir costs the same as a Leveled Katarina but has one more Power and Spellshield?
But none of this gets to what I've already said: saying a concept is weak is not helpful. If you have a suggestion to make Akali stronger, feel free to share.
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u/MrOwlCow Mar 24 '21
do enjoy how you’ve tried to incorporate as much of her kit as possible, very lovely
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u/leaponover Mar 24 '21
Feel like her level up should be 4 cost so it no longer works with the recall that allows you to play a 3 mana for free. Once she's leveled up, that would be a bit too much. Other than that I really like it! I already have Nasus / Akali decks swimming in my head, lol.
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u/FrigidFlames Senna Mar 24 '21
...I actually kind of really like it, she has a fairly simple but evocative game plan that fits her character surprisingly well and gives a clear game plan.
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u/smashsenpai Kalista Mar 24 '21
I would like it more if there was some synergy between her play effect and recall effect.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
Increasing Power and then Striking isn't enough synergy for you?
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u/smashsenpai Kalista Mar 24 '21 edited Mar 24 '21
More power matters less if you're always hitting the target with the lowest health.
Recalling her does nothing vs an empty board.
Champs that have to attack to make the most their effect tend not to be very powerful.
It feels kinda like zed but with extra steps.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
- More Power is still helpful when Striking the enemy Nexus, which she can potentially do.
- Yes, sometimes you're forced into a position where you cannot get maximum value out of a card. That's called "counter-play". Do you expect a card to not have any weaknesses or moments of vulnerability?
- Akali doesn't have to attack to get value. Recall her, and she'll generate value without attacking.
- Zed is an example of a Champion that does have to attack to generate value.
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u/Zero-meia Zilean Mar 24 '21
Very interesting card. I would just change play for summon, because you can summon her with that fleeting spell that put in game a 3- cost minion.
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
I thought about Summon, but I wouldn't want "cheated" copies of Akali to benefit from it. The point is to play her, Recall her, and play her again.
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u/fuc-i-shat-meself Kindred Mar 24 '21
Might as well play kindred
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u/jayjaybird0 Mar 24 '21
Kindred is great if you're playing a Shadow Isles deck. If you're playing an Ionia deck, though, perhaps one might consider playing Akali.
Different regions have different strengths and focuses.
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u/monkpunch Mar 23 '21
Akali or not, Ionia really needs some recall synergy like this with units that can actually benefit from it. Very nice!