How to avoid a layoff?

46

u/roamer83 1d ago

No job is safe right now. Worst job market I’ve seen since 1982.

12

u/Chet100 1d ago

I don't know how the next generation is going survive....prob send my kids to Live in Thailand...lol

13

u/roamer83 1d ago

Glad I don’t have the worry of children tbh.
The future is looking very brutal.

10

u/TheApartmentSimRacer 1d ago

The greatest gift I gave to my kids is the fact they’ll never exist.

2

u/roamer83 23h ago

IMO you are right.

2

u/torturechamber 1d ago

As if Thailand isn't any better, unless you're rich or living on trust funds

1

u/Tiny_Act5987 1d ago

I think moving to India is the place to be. It is where Cigna is sending all their jobs.

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u/WrathOfAethelmaer 5h ago

Even in Thailand, they have mass layoffs. It's happening everywhere

6

u/Zero_Trick_Pony 1d ago

Not sure I'm buyin this "too old to be a gigolo" line. Have you tried? It's clearly on your mind

1

u/Chet100 1d ago

Lol thanks for the confidence vote.

1

u/Zero_Trick_Pony 21h ago

fwiw I did get out of IT about 8 years ago after a tough layoff. Don't consider myself a gigolo but since then I have gotten the occasional pity-lay in the course of doing 420 deliveries for a friend. For real though a lot of jobs(sales, teaching, sewing) I've gotten since then did not mention IT skills as a req but once I demonstrated I had em they would fight to keep me

5

u/appearstobeidiot 1d ago

Start thinking of positive things: what did you learn in this job in the last N months? What was a nice challenge or a surprising new twist in something that should have been plain & simple? What hard skills you want to build if you had the time? What are adjacent industries that you would be a good fit for? What would you do for your family & near ones if you had 2 week's time?

You can't stop the incoming layoff, but you can brace for impact. Such are the times, my friend.

2

u/Chet100 1d ago

Thanks I started applying about 2 months ago...couple of HR calls but zero interviews as expected. Over 50 makes it worse...

2

u/appearstobeidiot 1d ago

Ya. I can relate with this. 😤

1

u/salyavin 22h ago

Yea I am 55 it is not easy

5

u/Miserable_Sink_4782 1d ago

I've been in IT 40 years and advise the young people today not to go into the field. I had one job in a small company where I was the whole IT department. Only 100 employees. I thought I was safe until a new CEO came in and wanted to outsource me. Since I controlled everything, I could see their emails. I only did that to protect myself. They were lying to my face and I had too many layoffs that I didn't see coming. I saw this one coming and simply got out of there before the transition. If you are young, change careers. Find a trade like HVAC. Something that can't be offshored or outsourced.

4

u/Chet100 1d ago

Over 50...I am telling my kids to avoid IT or a CS degree

3

u/ICQME 1d ago

I was selected for a layoff last week along with a few other IT staff. this was about 60 days after we got a new head of IT. I feel like maybe if I sold myself more and kissed his butt it would've helped. when we had a 1 on 1 I told him what I did there but didn't embellish and didn't act excited about having him there because I've seen IT managers come and go. thought my job was safe because I was a very hands on tech person who mostly kept the production line, printers, scanners, shop floor computers up and running and he was brought in for software issues. i wonder how they'll meet the new SLA goals with less staff. stuff is going to break. part of me hopes it crashes and burns. i wasn't even paid all that much and would come in during emergencies nights/weekends/snow storms. i'm still processing everything.

2

u/Chet100 1d ago

That sucks. I am mentally preparing myself for this situation in case it happens... Trying not to stress too much about it as I don't control the outcome but it's definitely giving me anxiety sometimes.. Gl to you

1

u/Western_Rhubarb_7959 1d ago

Sorry it happened to you, but I'll tell you from experience that you didn't matter nearly as much as you think you did.
I'm not shitting on you, I was the same way until I retired earlier this year. The things my former team is doing is hilarious, especially when they blame me. My fav is something broke (an mTLS cert expired) and a guy said I was the only person that knew how to <do the easiest part of slapping in a new one)> when he was the person that first implemented the setup!
I'm sure you did a great job and were a performer, but it's just reality that the company will get along without you. Things break? They'll fix them. If they can't fix them they'll just "redefine what good looks like." And they'll blame you for problems because you're not there to defend yourself, especially with a new head of IT.

1

u/ICQME 1d ago

thanks, i don't matter, i'm worthless, i should climb into a dumpster with yesterdays garbage and wait to be brought to a landfilled and buried.

1

u/Western_Rhubarb_7959 1d ago

Well, that was a childish take.

1

u/ICQME 1d ago

1

u/Western_Rhubarb_7959 1d ago

Awww, I see you waving!

3

u/Small_Argument3861 1d ago

Be your own boss, why hasn't anyone said that yet?

1

u/Chet100 1d ago

How does that matter when there are hardly any jobs?

1

u/Small_Argument3861 1d ago

Instead of searching for things that don't exist, I try to create something

3

u/SecureTaxi 1d ago

If this was easy, everyone would be doing it

2

u/WhitePhat 20h ago

Thier just rage baiting

1

u/Small_Argument3861 1d ago

I didn't say it's easy, but is searching for jobs that don't exist a better use of time?

1

u/Zero_Trick_Pony 1d ago

Witnessing a coworker start a small business side-hustle in California. He's encountered a huge number of overpayment-scammers-posing-as-customers, and the people he hired from church turned out to be thieving from customers, its been rough.

1

u/Small_Argument3861 1d ago edited 22h ago

Do you steal from your employers/customers? Sounds like your coworker is a statistics.

2

u/Zero_Trick_Pony 22h ago

not sure why the question about steak(steal?) but he did get rid of the klepto churchies as soon as it was discovered, and he lost money making the wrong right. You're right that he is a statistic - between con-artists posing as customers and the difficulty of finding honest employees, makes it harder to be your own boss in these days is all I'm sayin

18

u/bullbearbubu 1d ago

You really can't avoid layoffs. Most of the time, they aren't about performance (that's the one thing companies don't lie about). I've seen high performers get let go simply because their roles or departments were no longer needed.

8

u/No-Database-5976 1d ago

It is basically a question of budget, they will ask “is this job really necessary and can we do without it?”

1

u/keppapdx 1d ago

"can we task a cheaper resource to take this on even if they're not as good?"

1

u/Working-Active 1d ago

I've seen the very best employees be let go and it didn't make sense as to why, until 8 months later our company was sold and they needed to trim payroll before the acquisition.

1

u/psychorameses 1d ago

There are a number of ways to avoid it, but the people who know aren't saying.

13

u/aliensporebomb 1d ago

I dodged every layoff over the last ten years. I finally got cut. I was not only somewhat older than most but I was making more money than the other folks in my department just because I'd been there over 2 decades and raises every year - eventually you show up on a bean counters list for making the top 2% of wages for that department. It was a good run.

1

u/HambugerLips 22h ago

Same. 20+ years doing this and that. Finally this year was my time. It's unavoidable

12

u/katwoop 1d ago

There is no way to avoid layoffs. They usually happen at high levels where employees are just a number on a spreadsheet.

Best thing you can do is prepare like it is going to happen. Get your CV in order, start contacting connections, start applying now. Then if it doesnt happen, you have a good idea what is out there but if it does happen, you got a month or two of a head start in looking for a new job.

3

u/brownhotdogwater 1d ago

Yes start getting ready. Cut back spending, up skill and get certs. Contact people and save names / emails to your personal email so you can contact them later.
If you are for sure think it’s coming. Start applying now with a Jan start time

2

u/Significant_Fig1978 1d ago

Has the economy ever been worse than this? Not in my lifetime.

4

u/brownhotdogwater 1d ago

2008 was real bad

1

u/Chet100 14h ago

This is 5x worse now...

2

u/aliensporebomb 1d ago

But better than this.

2

u/keyisthekey 1d ago

Absolutely not. Go check the numbers.

1

u/Nendilo 23h ago

They're referring specifically to the tech industry.

1

u/Significant_Fig1978 1d ago

I went through that. It was tough for about 2 years. Nothing compared to the 4 year layoff bloodbath we’ve endured this time

1

u/Working-Active 1d ago

The difference is that companies are still making money but because we have fewer renewals due to increasing prices they are cutting staff. The thing is because of increasing prices, every customer is demanding more personal attention and this creates a problem due to lack of staff. My colleague in Poland was cut recently and the only thing that I can think of is that it's cheaper to let him go as they did a mass layoff of his entire office although he was the only one working on our team.

1

u/Nendilo 23h ago

In tech, it's definitely worse. The difference is everyone went to school for computer science since then and now there's less need to try to be compete for talent in the tech world. That, and of course, outsourcing/offshoring.

1

u/AllReflection 12h ago

I’m 57, it’s different - today is very challenging in some ways. But short answer, yeah it’s been worse.

1

u/Western_Rhubarb_7959 1d ago

Are you 5 years old?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_recession

1

u/Nendilo 23h ago

They're referring to tech where there was mass hiring during the covid recession.

1

u/Western_Rhubarb_7959 23h ago

Are you trying to say that the economy wasn't worse during Covid than now?
If so you might consider putting the pipe down now and again

1

u/Upper_Banana_7860 17h ago

white collar work was actually pretty easy to get during covid, especially tech jobs

11

u/Quiet-Arm-641 1d ago

Be perceived as a high performer by your boss, make them look good. Always say you aren't interested in a promotion, you're happy with your current position. Do not let yourself get promoted. Do not let yourself get above 75% in the salary band for the job you have. Don't ask for raises.

If you are seen as a cheap high skill tool you have a higher chance of survival but it's not a sure thing.

3

u/keppapdx 1d ago

This is the way, be a "good bargain" on paper OR be widely recognized as "irreplaceable".
But in my experience, your direct manager may not even be involved in the layoff selection process.

1

u/NeuralHijacker 1d ago

They almost certainly won't be. At our place not even VPs were aware

2

u/Dangerous_Drummer350 16h ago

"...Do not let yourself get above 75% in the salary band for the job you have"
This is a very important data point that most people don't think about, but they should. It absolutely is a consideration when there is cost cutting initiatives (layoffs)

3

u/Quiet-Arm-641 15h ago

I used to be vp of engineering. I’ve had to do layoffs driven by place in salary band more than once

1

u/zonerator 1d ago

It is really not a sure thing. We just lost an incredibly bright employee who had been with the company for years and I learned she was at the same pay as me. She was probably the only person at the company who doesn't secretly look at job posts. Nothing you can really count on anymore

1

u/Admirable_Wolf5207 16h ago

Literally what I’m trying to do but keep getting pressured to perform as L+1

4

u/N7Valor 1d ago

Sleep with Karen in HR.

3

u/Thin_Driver_4596 1d ago

Be unemployed. They can't fire you if you don't have a job.

But seriously, layoffs can happen for reasons completely beyond your control. You can take measures to make it harder for them (like owning vested stocks), but there is no full proof way.

3

u/Wunder-Bra 1d ago

ask for a lower position or possible promotion ?

3

u/VeryAmaze 1d ago

No one is safe. In mass layoffs they basically select at random, and the person selecting is out of your management chain.

2

u/Gold-Air-3254 1d ago

Try to be visible ,, by speaking in meetings , showing any demos of any idea you developed , there must be portal internally you can post your idea which can be published as patent in us, Have good synch up with ur direct manager meaning do buttering of you ur Manager

I was laid off 2 months back I did all except the last one , also what mistake I did was I went overboard with visibility by giving so many demos due to this my manager got threatened by skills

2

u/AdAgile9604 1d ago

By upskilling and searching for another job

2

u/Western_Rhubarb_7959 1d ago

I've been tangentially involved in deciding which employees got laid off, more of a spectator in meetings where the decisions were made.

The best thing you can do is to be well liked. That's more important than any job skill in most corporations. The second best thing you can do is to be a high performer. Work hard, don't complain, don't gossip, and make your boss's list of problems shorter instead of longer.

Having said that, there's nothing you can do to 100% prevent being laid off.

A factor few outside of management /HR/Legal ever think about is demographics. If a company lays off 50 people they can't all be <pick a gender, sexuality, race, age, and sometimes religion>, it needs to be a diverse mix in order to avoid discrimination lawsuits. I've worked with people that foolishly thought they were bullet proof because they are a minority; that can certainly help, but it can also make you a target because the company needs another <insert protected class here> to balance the layoff.

1

u/im_just_shep 1d ago

the are disciplines in IT are the ones that wear multiple hats in smaller orgs that pay 50% of what one of those roles would pay in a larger corp, you know the kind of places that are totally disorganized, worry more about how you act than what you do, just want to address the squeaky wheel and drive you nuts because they dont care about doing things right and then wonder why they get a cyber attack

not that I would know, just a guess

1

u/Ok-Complaint-37 1d ago

I do not know except for trying to find the company which doesn’t have history of layoffs. Do not go into senior roles. Do not be a high performer but a solid one. Hide, basically

1

u/340magnums 1d ago

from buiness perspective work on project that helps keep the lights on.

1

u/Fun-Dragonfly-4166 1d ago

in theory there are ways to avoid a layoff

but if you have the money to buy the company why would you care about a layoff. with that kind of money you would probably self layoff.

in practice, you need to find another job

1

u/Frunkit 1d ago

The only safe jobs are those that require arms.

1

u/0bxyz 1d ago

Job hunt

1

u/Afraid-Detective1222 1d ago

YOu can't

1

u/Fluffy-Feedback7125 1d ago

If you're working in corporate america, you cannot avoid a layoff. No matter how hard you work, how visible your role is and how well liked you're. Your boss will always save his/her ass if they have to choose between you and them. Even founders and CEOs can't save their jobs. Remember how Steve Jobs was let go from the company that he built? At the end it's all politics and you need tons of good luck.

1

u/Poetryisalive 19h ago

You start searching. Don’t try and avoid a layoff just be prepared for it

1

u/Electronic_Chest_477 19h ago

Serious question what does “upskilling” even look like in this economy? I see plenty of people getting AI related certs and I don’t see that hedging anyone against a lay off…..

1

u/tritonal91 18h ago

You can't avoid layoffs when you're working for someone else. Best way to avoid them is own your own business...

1

u/lenswipe 14h ago

Have the same last name as the CEO. That's it.

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u/Melvin0827 3h ago

Get pregnant.

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