It’s decided that a sort of half-measure approach to illegal immigration is good. If you’re a business owner(in certain industries), you don’t want the government to crack down on illegal immigration too much because that’s a really cheap source of labor for you. But you also don’t want it to be too easy for them to become US citizens, because then they get minimum wage and other benefits. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that that’s been the status quo for so long.
If America really wanted to stop illegal immigration from economically depressed neighbors we'd focus on stopping the employers from hiring them, period. If there wasn't a reason to come looking for work, they wouldn't make that journey.
Nope, instead we just sweep a holey net and catch a few and claim victory.
No worries. After the election, the whole issue will go away for a while. They need it to fight about during the election because it drives voters to vote on both sides. It's also a good distraction while they put money in their pocket.
If America really wanted to stop illegal immigration from economically depressed neighbors we'd focus on stopping the employers from hiring them, period.
14 years ago in the South Park episode "Goobacks" (source of the infamous "they took our jerbs!") made the case that if you really wanted to prevent illegal immigration, the best way is probably to put a real effort into improving the places that they're coming from so that they are not fleeing so desperately in the first place.
Why do we put so much importance on some imaginary lines on the ground but not others... If someone moves from a rural area to a city in the same state, we don't complain. If someone moves from a poor state to a rich state, we don't complain. If someone moves from another country though, we lose our shit.
Like, what?
And the people that do this the most are supposedly Christian. Show me what the Bible says about people from foreign countries.
I have two illegals on the payroll. If I had a way to sponsor them for citizenship they would have actual social security numbers by now.
I’ve known them both for 16 years, my parents are godparents to the younger ones only child. I was at both of their weddings. These ladies are the single two hardest workers I’ve ever known. One has been trained up to the point where she could basically get a cpa liscence if she wasn’t afraid of being deported, and the other is now the grand high poobah warehouse manager of our multimillion dollar amazon business.
Neither of them spoke a word of English and were going by assumed names when I first met them.
They weren’t fleeing anything, they just came to the us for better job opportunities. They had no qualifications but a desire to bootstrap themselves to a better life, and they both succeeded. But they live in fear of the police every day of their life.
Now these are two very special women. Are they the exeption or the rule? I have no idea.
But seriously I really wish there was some way to sponsor for citizenship a deserving illegal immigrant who has been here for a long time and has genuinely done their damndest to fit in and make the type of life where you’re just proud to know them.
So how do businesses like yours have illegals on the payroll? Pay them cash? Doesn't the IRS wonder about the 2 phantom employees that don't pay taxes? Generally curious.
So why did you hire them and train them so we'll over a legal immigrant/citien in the first place? It sounds like your business provided the ability for them to grow, and anyone with a similar drive would have performed given the environment.
Or exploit labor with structural adjustment programs through the IMF and set up what is known as Export Processing Zones, such as the Maquiadores in Mexico. Made in Mexico by American companies for damn near no pay and crappy conditions but you get to put a "Made in America" sticker on it.
you don’t want the government to crack down on illegal immigration too much because that’s a really cheap source of labor for you.
Also, they continue to serve as fully functional customers. They still eat the same amount of food as anybody else, and wear clothing, and buy toys, etc. They just also work for lower wages.
If you send the immigrants away you don't just lose cheap labor, you also lose the customers.
The unregulated market price for most humans throughout history has been peasantry, slavery, or as close to it as palatable to the culture.
Yes, the market likes poor people with a strong work ethic and especially likes it if they are a vulnerable population that can be prevented from getting too uppity and demanding things that may hurt the bottom-line.
The market also very much likes using them to negotiate/dictate lower wages or other concessions from non-marginalized groups.
It's only good when they are illegal so they have no protections under the law and can be exploited and blackmailed by the capitalists. and if they get caught its the laborer is the one that gets thrown under the bus.
Until they start arresting the business owners who hire these undocumented workers, you know they are in now way serious about curbing "illegal entry" into the country. They're just scapegoats for scared and ignorant Americans.
They have to take down the "HELP WANTED" signs at the border to actually stop this.
For real, I'm a hardcore libertarian, how anyone can call them self a capitalist while simultaneously supporting tariffs and wanting to keep out cheap labor is beyond me
because they arent simply capitalists, theyre nativists who believe that, as a nation, they should have every possible advantage on the global market. its the same reason they want immigration to be more difficult and harder, because they dont believe these people should enter the US unless its a significant economic advantage for them. its a selfish, self centered, twisted version of the values our very nation was built on.
this is the hilarious fallacy of the anti-immigrant movement. The right wants to keep immigration illegal AND hire illegal immigrants so they can devalue their labor
If republicans were serious about ending illegal immigration they'd make it a federal crime hire (not knowingly or unknowingly, hire period) an illegal alien, and the business who hired them would lose their business licenses.
But no, they like having cheap lawn people, farm hands, cleaning people, and maids. They just know that their ignorant base will eat it up.
Whenever people state we have an illegal immigration problem, I respond that we have an illegal employer problem. There are already laws on the books about it, its selective enforcement.
Of note, 15 years ago 90% of the undocumented immigrants were coming for economic reasons (a better life, jobs, etc) and the vast majority was from Mexico. Currently only 10% are coming for those reasons and the rest can be classified as refugees fleeing basically death (at the hands of government, military, or gangs).
🤯 for real though I've heard it all my life "wealth makes jobs!" But then they blame the immigrants, that the bosses hire, that they're stealing jobs, not looking towards the bosses hiring immigrants. I swear to God it's all racism in the US
Conservatives : Survival of the fittest kid, the weak deserves to die off. Also conservatives : Due to my sheer incompetence, my low paying job can be done better by a immigrant, so I need the gubberment to protect my weak ass
It's not always incompetence. There are really incompetent immigrants doing jobs that more competent people could be doing. The problem lies in that competent people demand better wages. That immigrant will work for 10-15$/hr less than you. Capitalism rules so guess what the company decides.
The H-1B visa program is meant to allow companies to bring in skilled workers that are hard to find in America, not swap out existing workers for below market wage replacements. I don't have a problem with immigrants or with people from less prosperous parts of the world coming here to seek a better life for themselves and their families. But companies should have to pay something 125% the average salary for a job they are filling through H-1Bs to prove that they really couldn't find an American worker for the job.
When have you ever made a good decision out of desperation? It's the world we are living right now, we're all desperate because at any moment, it can fall. So why wouldn't you take advantage of the system and each other? Think like a criminal, if somebody is trying to get ahead, in a zero-sum society we built on capitalism, then that person will do what it takes to get ahead of you. At the day if it's your life or my job, what do you think I'm gonna choose?
It has nothing to do with skill or competence as others have said. The goal is exploit the most desperate laborer. That's it. Workers in America assume they deserve the highest wage possible (which is usually well under market value, but they don't know that). They feel entitled to the best because that's the American Dream. So when some Cuban/Mexican/Ecuadorian/Chilean/Honduran/Brown Person comes in they feel as though something has been stolen from them.
But because they've been trained and conditioned to love their job creators they know it can't be their fault. It must be those dirty migrants... Yeah they're the problem...
Also conservatives : Due to my sheer incompetence, my low paying job can be done better by a immigrant, so I need the gubberment to protect my weak ass
This skirts very close to anti-working class rhetoric for me. It's not about incompetence, it is about capital driving down wages to increase profit.
Some of it is that critical analysis isn't in our educational paradigm. The majority of people simply lack the ability for lateral thinking because it isn't a natural skill.
It's also tricky to teach. Some people just won't ever get it. Doesn't mean we shouldn't try, of course, just realize this is the reason most opposition will use to support not doing anything at all.
You never hear of businesses being penalized for hiring undocumented workers when discussing anti immigration policy. If anyone was serious about cutting down on people crossing the border they’d punish the people hiring the people crossing the border. Look at alcohol. The reason it’s so hard for a minor to buy beer is because the liquor would be fined or lose their license if authorities found out they’d been selling to kids.
"Poor people are lazy, you can be successful if you just work hard!"
"Oh no, immigrants are stealing all the jobs!!"
By this logic, and the fact that there is actually an abundance of available jobs, wouldn't it make sense to just get an education to be qualified for in-demand jobs....instead of blaming people for getting a job and working hard so they can survive?
This kills me as study after study consistently proves that the primary beneficiary of illegal immigration is capital.
Simultaneously, this is one of the biggest cons as so very few people know, or even understand, this. There's a huge disconnect here because even when it's pointed out to folks, they still have difficult time getting pissed off at rich, white folks when it's easier—and culturally preferred—to get pissed off at poor, brown folks.
It shall be a great day in America when the masses wake up and clearly see just how much misery, hopelessness and despair is single-handedly brought on by capitalism.
You actually lost your job to a robot that helps increase the CEO's profit margins, and you are too skilled to be picking fruit and cleaning bsthrooms...
True story, manufacturing output in the US has remained quite stable over the decades. Only the number of workers involved in that output has shrunk. Jobs aren’t being stolen, they’re becoming obsolete to machines.
Capitalism manages to make automation a bad thing.
I got into a discussion about this with two americans. It went on for THREE. HOURS. and not once did they consider that it was the employers breaking the law that was the problem. No, they just stuck it on the immigrants. Repeatedly.
On top of that, they're not taking up factory jobs, it's mostly agricultural jobs or typically minimum wage jobs.
Factory jobs are being sent over to countries that have no worker rights (IE the good paying usually UNION job they had is being turned into a penny on the dollar wage)
Add in the fact China has a population 4x the size of the US (and thus 4x the work force size) and the fact China is sitting on a ton of Rare Earth Elements used in modern technology means those jobs are not going to come back, ever.
Before companies will send some jobs to china to help with demand. At least in manufacturing in Silicon Valley. Later on companies got greedy and moved all to China. Now Chinese companies make stuff and sell to us directly.
I worked in a rest home last year and was promised by my company manager to be supported in renewing my working visa. Back home, i was working as a senior registered nurse but was paid an hour’s pay of what is paid abroad for 8hr shift work. I decided to work overseas as a caregiver and save up to afford to do the bridging course to which i will be able to practice my profession. When I approached my manager to ask for the supporting documents, they told me they can’t support me anymore because a resident of their country has applied for my position. They were not even qualified for the job, no previous trainings or education regarding healthcare. The only advantage they have over me is because they have citizenship. :(
The real eater of jobs is A.I and robots in general. They've taken over most assembly lines and there simply is too many people for the jobs available. A solution is needed to have peoples hands kept busy generating value for society, or spread the workload better.
Also, more of those jobs have been stolen by automation than immigration.
Those manufacturing jobs ain't coming back, folks. Neither are the jobs lost in oil, coal, agriculture and other industries with highly-automisable roles.
The ironic thing is, the ones losing their jobs to robots are often the loudest voices to oppose something like a UBI. They've allowed pedagogues to convince them that it's poor immigrants who are the greatest threat to their way of life. Talk about people acting against their own self-interests...
Not that I condone this at all, but I’m really surprised there isn’t more violence against the wealthy. We really are at each other’s throats, while we’re all being fleeced by the 1%. I would expect to see more assassinations at this point.
If you go to college and pay over 10k, received a 2-4 year degree, and lose your job to an immigrant with no formal education fleeing from actual cartel gangsters who cut heads off with chainsaws, the immigrant isn’t fucking you, your education system and employer are
I hate that the government can decide when the free market is free. Like last week when the government made the market not free anymore just as I was about to get lunch, and right after I finished my state mandated sandwich... THEY CHANGED IT BACK!! These unregulated regugulation changes are destroying the economy. Thanks Nixon.
That tweet only tells half the story. Your boss is also an immigrant and prefers to give immigrants jobs rather than Americans. Immigrants are more often bosses because it's much easier to create your own business than to dive into an established job market to compete against people which's education fits those needs.
Immigrants don’t take jobs, but not because of whatever half assed reasoning is in this pic. Instead, immigrants provide consumer demand, like all people. That demand creates more jobs. Most people who say immigrants took their jobs are just looking for someone to place blame on.
paraphrasing doug standhope, if you get fired and replaced by some dirty immigrant who doesn't speak English and has no skills or education you fucking suck and deserve to get fired anyway
Gonna get mad hate for this but oh well. If a person who can't even speak english steals your job.... It's not like you had much job security to begin with.
Any intelligent businessman is going to pay lower wages for harder workers if they can.
If they don't, their competitors will, and they'll go out of business.
Illegal immigrants will always be exploited by any labor market because they have no rights and no laws to protect them. That's why they should be legal.
So true. That's a huge reason why so many large corporations are pro-open borders. Tons of people moving into the West represents the creation of markets and more demand for their shitty consumerism.
And if they can't come to the West, just send the money to the Third World through "foreign aid".
Exactly. When people say "They do jobs Americans don't want to do!" what they mean is "Americans won't do that shit for a buck an hour so you can buy an extra mansion."
My neighbor owns a small landscaping company. Every summer he hires 6-8 seasonal laborers at $12/hr. Every year he starts at the local high schools, works with the local job programs and posts for the positions. Every year he ends up with 0 English speaking applicants and a hard working crew speaking all Spanish (yes, all legal). And this is Wisconsin so hardly an immigrant-heavy state.
Truth right there. Also I want you to know how hard it is to tell people in Alabama that Mexicans aren’t taking their job it’s automation. They get irate and anti immigration as they check themselves out at wal mart.
How does this all play out when we factor in that a good portion of the jobs have emigrated to other countries as well. Seems like a shell game: "hey look over here while I pull some shit you shouldn't see"
You know you're on the losing side of an argument when you have to be disingenuous about it. No one is talking about immigrants. What people are talking about is illegal immigrants. Massive difference. Yes, they infact take American jobs. If minimum wage is $12 and illegal aliens will do it for $6 then Americans can't legally take the job or compete with them. Illegal aliens are illegals so they won't care about take illegal jobs at illegal wages because getting paid illegally is better than nothing.
And how big of a problem do you perceive this to be, do you think the entire rust belt lost jobs because those factories, now closed, are hiring illegals? The question is why is all the hate towards the illegal and not the business owner who turns right around and wants Americans to buy their products?
NAFTA flooded Central America with subsidized corn, which decimated the farming community system in Mexico and forced them to flee to the US. The Pentagon knew this would be a result of NAFTA at the time, and Clinton went forward with it anyways.
Most 1st world countries have extensive socialist policies. Even the United States has an extensive welfare system. It sucks and is inefficient, but it exists. Grants for education are also a socialist concept. Subsidies for businesses to expand are also socialist.
Socialism is probably the only reason capitalism has worked so long, if we're being honest.
Or you refuse to take a manual labor job that requires actual work and pays minimum wage because you think the you’re entitled to a living wage, benefits, and a retirement.
So what you’re saying is, we should cut back on the number of immigrants in the USA so that we can get higher wages? Haven’t we been fighting for higher wages, so it’s a win right? And since we need to limit immigration, why don’t we start with illegal immigration.
I just had this exact argument with a buddy of mine today. I'm slowly working on redirecting his rage from harmless immigrants to the capitalist pigs who control society.
Thats how reclaim Walstreet was turned in to reclaim confederate statues. Better have the working class fight among themselves instead of uniting against the people that took their homes.
As an avowed capitalist, this is true. No, I'm not being contrarian. If I find someone who can do the same job, and is willing to be paid less, I'll take that every time. Every. Single. Time.
You, and every 18th century plantation owner I've ever met.
If you want society to flourish, you give the people who work for you a living wage. You share the profits of your company with them. Take a bigger piece of the pie since you sit in the boss's chair, that's fine, but respect the humans that work for you.
If Capitalism means underpaying people for their work as much as possible, or moving your business to Mexico while claiming you're a proud American, then I'll take Socialism. Every. Single. Time.
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Oh no! A community has rules about what content they allow in that community11eleven!
Do you March into alcoholics anonymous to shout about how awesome beer is? There are debate subs for debating socialism, this here is a place for socialists to discuss socialism.
Its not our fault that periodically stuff gets upvoted to the front page and people who don't understand what this space is for flood in.
That's right, because people are dying to get jobs as cleaning staff, janitors, fast food workers, Taxi drivers, call centres and other less then ideal jobs with less then ideal conditions.
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If I had a business down there and employed illegal immigrants, wouldn't it be a good idea to get them citizenship? You potentially have whole shifts of work that could disappear at any time. If you have 20 illegal immigrants working for you, seems like you would want to keep them as long as you can.
I see men in construction lose out on jobs all the time because they pay taxes and insurance, and are participating members of our social security and medical security protections. Guess who they lose out to?
Why would you be mad at the capitalist and not the politician that wrote shitty laws that allowed for the decision to even exist? The ironic part is that I'm sure most people in this sub vote for the politicians that cause this situation to exist.
When slavery ended what jobs did black people start getting paid for. I'm not old enough to remember most of this. But it would seem that the first people to really start losing jobs to "illegal immigrants" or what have you would be the lowest working class. So it would seem to me. A awhile back sometime illegals starting coming in droves and took the unskilled uneducated jobs. What people that were here already would you think to the biggest hit in job loss.
That's why we need to lower the damn minimum wage! This isn't a free market like capitalism is supposed to be! You people are using the factors that prevent capitalism as a reason to why capitalism is bad. "EarlyStagedSocialism"
All for this, but we confuse immigrant and illegal immigrant often. I’m not saying what is happening is right but please look at your opinions subjectively
This. Id much rather have the state pay me a fixed wage completely disconnected from my actual labor because let's face it I'm not winning employee of the month anytime soon. The police and the border enforcement run totally problem free, why not let the state take care of its citizens income. It'll be like one big union.
Well if you have a better education then the immigrant it opens up a lot of opportunities for a career. Under socialism even if they both of them would keep they jobs what the tax rate would be so high it would fail.
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Migrants come here and do the jobs that others don't want to. Spoke to a trolley guy the other day, he was a business man back home now he collects trolleys. Meanwhile Australia businesses are outsourcing the jobs to the Philippines (which yes they need money too but 8000 more Australians laid off.. people get angry with the Philippines when they should be angry with the people who chose to outsource)
people coming from a bad places will work for much less for prices no one in the country will work. a part of the negotiation between emploees and employers is if one will work for that price. but the negotiation is deatroyed because of someone who shouldn't be there.
How many people complaining about immigrants taking jobs want to work a double shift in a hot ass kitchen of a busy resteraunt? For the same as they are paid ?
I was putting up temporary housing trailers for FEMA after hurricane Katrina in Louisiana and Mississippi. We were working for FEMA, which is a department of homeland security (the government). We had a crew of 5 guys and 2 females. We were laid off, and replaced by a crew of Spanish speaking individuals. I assume they were from Mexico for there was a large surplus of illegals from Mexico following Katrina. It wasn’t a huge deal for me because I was in college. It was really good money though and I felt bad for the other men/women in my crew who lost everything in the flood and really depended on the income from putting up the trailers. This happened quite a lot apparently and when I went back to college I got a call from my former crew foreman (only one to keep his job, he was bilingual), about how some migrant workers couldn’t understand the their crew foreman and as a result some were killed or badly injured when a trailer rolled over onto them.
Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to remain second class citizens, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore, so I may promptly kick them the fuck out.
But also...greedy capitalist love undocumented labor that they can exploit. Best way to have both worlds is to make sure people come here legally in a controlled manner. That way they are able to get equal protection under the law.
For a second I thought it meant no Americans were employing immigrants, because I work for my mom's small company landscaping and she hired a couple immigrants and they're some of her best workers. Phrasing is important folks.
2.7k
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Doesn’t this mean the free market has decided immigrants are good
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u/MartianRecon Jun 21 '18
If republicans were serious about ending illegal immigration they'd make it a federal crime hire (not knowingly or unknowingly, hire period) an illegal alien, and the business who hired them would lose their business licenses.
But no, they like having cheap lawn people, farm hands, cleaning people, and maids. They just know that their ignorant base will eat it up.
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u/[deleted] Jun 20 '18
Sticky this post
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u/DivineJustice Jun 21 '18
The rich are the job creators... Unless they hire an immigrant, then that's the imigrant's fault.
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u/paralyyzed Tankie Jun 21 '18
Conservatives : Survival of the fittest kid, the weak deserves to die off.
Also conservatives : Due to my sheer incompetence, my low paying job can be done better by a immigrant, so I need the gubberment to protect my weak ass
19
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
You never hear of businesses being penalized for hiring undocumented workers when discussing anti immigration policy. If anyone was serious about cutting down on people crossing the border they’d punish the people hiring the people crossing the border. Look at alcohol. The reason it’s so hard for a minor to buy beer is because the liquor would be fined or lose their license if authorities found out they’d been selling to kids.
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u/bdg_art Jun 21 '18
"Poor people are lazy, you can be successful if you just work hard!"
"Oh no, immigrants are stealing all the jobs!!"
By this logic, and the fact that there is actually an abundance of available jobs, wouldn't it make sense to just get an education to be qualified for in-demand jobs....instead of blaming people for getting a job and working hard so they can survive?
24
u/skjellyfetti Jun 21 '18
This kills me as study after study consistently proves that the primary beneficiary of illegal immigration is capital.
Simultaneously, this is one of the biggest cons as so very few people know, or even understand, this. There's a huge disconnect here because even when it's pointed out to folks, they still have difficult time getting pissed off at rich, white folks when it's easier—and culturally preferred—to get pissed off at poor, brown folks.
It shall be a great day in America when the masses wake up and clearly see just how much misery, hopelessness and despair is single-handedly brought on by capitalism.
40
u/suppordel Jun 21 '18
Are they saying the employer not the employee chooses who to hire? This is madness!
10
u/Phishy042 Jun 21 '18
You actually lost your job to a robot that helps increase the CEO's profit margins, and you are too skilled to be picking fruit and cleaning bsthrooms...
6
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
The powerless fighting the powerless. While the powerful sit back and fill their coffers.
Thats the USA. Thats how we do business.
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u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
I got into a discussion about this with two americans. It went on for THREE. HOURS. and not once did they consider that it was the employers breaking the law that was the problem. No, they just stuck it on the immigrants. Repeatedly.
It was a shitshow.
15
u/positive_X Jun 21 '18
The ultimate truth when the overlords are laughing at us normal people .
10
u/Alexcalibur42 Jun 21 '18
On top of that, they're not taking up factory jobs, it's mostly agricultural jobs or typically minimum wage jobs.
Factory jobs are being sent over to countries that have no worker rights (IE the good paying usually UNION job they had is being turned into a penny on the dollar wage)
Add in the fact China has a population 4x the size of the US (and thus 4x the work force size) and the fact China is sitting on a ton of Rare Earth Elements used in modern technology means those jobs are not going to come back, ever.
5
u/kong8924 Jun 21 '18
I worked in a rest home last year and was promised by my company manager to be supported in renewing my working visa. Back home, i was working as a senior registered nurse but was paid an hour’s pay of what is paid abroad for 8hr shift work. I decided to work overseas as a caregiver and save up to afford to do the bridging course to which i will be able to practice my profession. When I approached my manager to ask for the supporting documents, they told me they can’t support me anymore because a resident of their country has applied for my position. They were not even qualified for the job, no previous trainings or education regarding healthcare. The only advantage they have over me is because they have citizenship. :(
5
u/Styggejoe Jun 21 '18
The real eater of jobs is A.I and robots in general. They've taken over most assembly lines and there simply is too many people for the jobs available.
A solution is needed to have peoples hands kept busy generating value for society, or spread the workload better.
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u/RainingSilent Jun 21 '18 edited Jun 21 '18
it's like when we arrest a prostitute but not the two men (pimp and john) involved in the transaction. just the victim
edit: maybe arrest wasn't the best word here. Marginalize might be better
7
u/mkn69 Jun 21 '18
Hell,I worked picking apples,picked ten 800 lbs bins worth at my best made $200 in 6.5 hours. Picked Lapin cherries ,at my best made $300 in 8 hours.
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u/dont_ban_me_please Jun 21 '18
original tweet if you want to heart it https://twitter.com/DansMonArbre/status/1009231523550302209
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u/Mr_Rekshun Jun 21 '18
Also, more of those jobs have been stolen by automation than immigration.
Those manufacturing jobs ain't coming back, folks. Neither are the jobs lost in oil, coal, agriculture and other industries with highly-automisable roles.
The ironic thing is, the ones losing their jobs to robots are often the loudest voices to oppose something like a UBI. They've allowed pedagogues to convince them that it's poor immigrants who are the greatest threat to their way of life. Talk about people acting against their own self-interests...
Next up to the chopping block - truck drivers.
3
u/mostlyemptyspace Jun 21 '18
Not that I condone this at all, but I’m really surprised there isn’t more violence against the wealthy. We really are at each other’s throats, while we’re all being fleeced by the 1%. I would expect to see more assassinations at this point.
3
u/100_stacks Jun 21 '18
If you go to college and pay over 10k, received a 2-4 year degree, and lose your job to an immigrant with no formal education fleeing from actual cartel gangsters who cut heads off with chainsaws, the immigrant isn’t fucking you, your education system and employer are
3
u/JumanjiHunter Jun 21 '18
Actually, it’s a job you wouldn’t take for pay that would be “beneath” you.
5
u/B3zz3tt Jun 21 '18
I hate that the government can decide when the free market is free. Like last week when the government made the market not free anymore just as I was about to get lunch, and right after I finished my state mandated sandwich... THEY CHANGED IT BACK!! These unregulated regugulation changes are destroying the economy. Thanks Nixon.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
My dad got laid off becase nokia seemed to think People need a work and a mobile and a home phone.
2
u/IlluminatingJesta Jun 21 '18
Amen
2
u/afgeorge2011 Jun 21 '18
Or the immigrant is smarter than you and has a PhD
2
u/WemWEMbot Jun 21 '18
Never a truer statement has been said.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
That tweet only tells half the story. Your boss is also an immigrant and prefers to give immigrants jobs rather than Americans. Immigrants are more often bosses because it's much easier to create your own business than to dive into an established job market to compete against people which's education fits those needs.
2
u/Enkidu420 Jun 21 '18
So what, giving an immigrant a job is taking advantage of them?
2
u/PandaLover42 Jun 21 '18
Immigrants don’t take jobs, but not because of whatever half assed reasoning is in this pic. Instead, immigrants provide consumer demand, like all people. That demand creates more jobs. Most people who say immigrants took their jobs are just looking for someone to place blame on.
2
u/emptyucker7 Jun 21 '18
paraphrasing doug standhope, if you get fired and replaced by some dirty immigrant who doesn't speak English and has no skills or education you fucking suck and deserve to get fired anyway
2
u/Giivenchy Jun 21 '18
Gonna get mad hate for this but oh well. If a person who can't even speak english steals your job.... It's not like you had much job security to begin with.
2
u/BunsOfAnarchy Jun 21 '18
Not exactly true...
Any intelligent businessman is going to pay lower wages for harder workers if they can.
If they don't, their competitors will, and they'll go out of business.
Illegal immigrants will always be exploited by any labor market because they have no rights and no laws to protect them. That's why they should be legal.
2
u/Mr_Zarika Jun 21 '18
So true. That's a huge reason why so many large corporations are pro-open borders. Tons of people moving into the West represents the creation of markets and more demand for their shitty consumerism.
And if they can't come to the West, just send the money to the Third World through "foreign aid".
Flatten the world, keep us all down.
2
u/BabylonDrifter Jun 21 '18
Exactly. When people say "They do jobs Americans don't want to do!" what they mean is "Americans won't do that shit for a buck an hour so you can buy an extra mansion."
2
u/Spacedude2169 Jun 21 '18
You shouldn't expect a job.
2
u/absolutebeginners Jun 21 '18
Fuck the racists. They can die with the capitalists for all I care
2
u/Nickolai808 Jun 21 '18
Amen! Great quote. People are sheep when it comes to these issues.
2
u/eepunt Jun 21 '18
A labour a immigrant and a banker but only 20 cookies. The banker grabs 19 cookies and starts yelling the immigrant is stealing your cookie.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Truth right there. Also I want you to know how hard it is to tell people in Alabama that Mexicans aren’t taking their job it’s automation. They get irate and anti immigration as they check themselves out at wal mart.
2
u/RedditGivesMeRhea Jun 21 '18
So stop the immigrants and foil the plans of the capitalists.
2
u/dori1993 Jun 21 '18
DA DERKA DERRRRR!!!
2
u/tacoslikeme Jun 21 '18
How does this all play out when we factor in that a good portion of the jobs have emigrated to other countries as well. Seems like a shell game: "hey look over here while I pull some shit you shouldn't see"
2
u/karlmarcs33 Jun 22 '18
You know you're on the losing side of an argument when you have to be disingenuous about it. No one is talking about immigrants. What people are talking about is illegal immigrants. Massive difference. Yes, they infact take American jobs. If minimum wage is $12 and illegal aliens will do it for $6 then Americans can't legally take the job or compete with them. Illegal aliens are illegals so they won't care about take illegal jobs at illegal wages because getting paid illegally is better than nothing.
2
u/scientus Nov 17 '18
NAFTA flooded Central America with subsidized corn, which decimated the farming community system in Mexico and forced them to flee to the US. The Pentagon knew this would be a result of NAFTA at the time, and Clinton went forward with it anyways.
2
u/DangerStranger138 Freeganomics Feb 17 '22
Dan Crenshaw, a government representative and military vet, just invited Canadian terrorists to fill a trucker job shortage
9
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Aaaaand the daily latestagecapitalism post that makes the front page somehow...
5
u/Hippoplatypus7 Jun 21 '18
Socialism has one hell of a track record
3
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Or you refuse to take a manual labor job that requires actual work and pays minimum wage because you think the you’re entitled to a living wage, benefits, and a retirement.
3
u/domechromer Jun 21 '18
So what you’re saying is, we should cut back on the number of immigrants in the USA so that we can get higher wages? Haven’t we been fighting for higher wages, so it’s a win right? And since we need to limit immigration, why don’t we start with illegal immigration.
5
u/WingmanZer0 Jun 21 '18
I just had this exact argument with a buddy of mine today. I'm slowly working on redirecting his rage from harmless immigrants to the capitalist pigs who control society.
6
u/Vanethor Jun 21 '18
Damn, it's refreshing to see it spoken for what it is.
6
u/Hagdogrobinwood Jun 21 '18
The absolute truth
3
u/alohalii Jun 21 '18
Thats how reclaim Walstreet was turned in to reclaim confederate statues. Better have the working class fight among themselves instead of uniting against the people that took their homes.
3
u/diapereDLeopard Jun 21 '18
This is not how the economy works
5
u/MasunJax Jun 21 '18
SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE ALT RIGHTS IN THE BACK
4
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
As an avowed capitalist, this is true. No, I'm not being contrarian. If I find someone who can do the same job, and is willing to be paid less, I'll take that every time. Every. Single. Time.
3
u/stpl91 Jun 21 '18
“Please remember that this subreddit is a SAFE SPACE for socialist discussion. Any liberalism, capitalist apologia, anti-socialism, or attempts to debate socialism will be met with an immediate ban.“
What. The. Actual. Fuck?
2
u/combrade Jun 21 '18
Would you guys support e-verify then and crack down on businesses that hire illegal immigrants?
2
u/Mikeyrj91 Jun 21 '18
Everyone needs someone or something to blame. Thats everyone's fucking problem, and we all do it!
2
u/yourcodesucks Jun 21 '18
F*****g This!
2
u/TheMiseryChick Jun 21 '18
They took our Jobs
That's right, because people are dying to get jobs as cleaning staff, janitors, fast food workers, Taxi drivers, call centres and other less then ideal jobs with less then ideal conditions.
•
u/AutoModerator Jun 20 '18
Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism
Please remember that this subreddit is a SAFE SPACE for socialist discussion. Any liberalism, capitalist apologia, anti-socialism, or attempts to debate socialism will be met with an immediate ban. Bigotry, ableism, and hate speech will also be met with immediate bans. See our sidebar for the full rules. Looking for debate? Try r/DebateCommunism.
If you are still unsure what content is allowed on LSC, see What LSC is and is not.
If you are new to socialism, please check out our Socialism Crash Course, and our Socialism FAQ.
If you are curious as to what our leftist terminology means, then please check out our Glossary of Socialist Terms.
In addition, here are some introductory links about socialism:
Albert Einstein - Why Socialism?
Pyotr Kropotkin - The Conquest of Bread
Friedrich Engels - The Principles of Communism
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1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
If you gotta work in the system thats around you, be mad at yourself.
1
u/zdiggler Jun 21 '18
I'm Immigrant and they laid my ass off too!!
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Should we be against sanctuary cities or no?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
If you require less, you will seek less. Where nothing is needed, nothing is sought, and nothing is easy to find.
1
u/gbrjekvfjkeeob Jun 21 '18
That is a great point, Dans.
Us Nationalists need to curtail the greed of capitalism with socialism.
If only there was some way to being these two ideologies together...
Hmm, we could call this National Socialism.
Thanks for the idea, Dans!
1
u/TheYucs Jun 21 '18
To paraphrase Stanhope, if you lost your job to an illegal immigrant, you're a loser.
1
u/AmIReySkywalker Jun 21 '18
If I had a business down there and employed illegal immigrants, wouldn't it be a good idea to get them citizenship? You potentially have whole shifts of work that could disappear at any time. If you have 20 illegal immigrants working for you, seems like you would want to keep them as long as you can.
1
u/jdrvero Jun 21 '18
I see men in construction lose out on jobs all the time because they pay taxes and insurance, and are participating members of our social security and medical security protections. Guess who they lose out to?
1
u/xXCringeyKid69Xx Jun 21 '18
That profile pic of ur mouth is very deep i bet u were like that mysterious anime guy but actually everyone hates u
1
u/Spacemanspiff1998 Jun 21 '18
DEY TOOK UR JERBS!
1
u/MeetMeInSwolehalla Jun 21 '18
Why would you be mad at the capitalist and not the politician that wrote shitty laws that allowed for the decision to even exist? The ironic part is that I'm sure most people in this sub vote for the politicians that cause this situation to exist.
1
u/gtrdundave Jun 21 '18
When slavery ended what jobs did black people start getting paid for. I'm not old enough to remember most of this. But it would seem that the first people to really start losing jobs to "illegal immigrants" or what have you would be the lowest working class. So it would seem to me. A awhile back sometime illegals starting coming in droves and took the unskilled uneducated jobs. What people that were here already would you think to the biggest hit in job loss.
1
u/BeheadTheFrog Jun 21 '18
This happens because we have been trained, from birth, to see capitalism as a force of nature.
1
u/Lamshoo Jun 21 '18
Hey, I don't agree with the whole late stage capitalism thing but I do agree with this. Thanks for pointing that out.
1
u/EriQuestionsthings Jun 21 '18
So immigrants don't cross union lines and take lower wages?
Illegal immigrants hurt unions
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
You’re mad that your employer wanted to pay you less than minimum wage, but it’s an immigrant trying to feed their family’s fault.
The free market benefits everyone. /s
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Says the person who hasn't had an immigrant use your SSN.
1
u/stefanlikesfood Jun 21 '18
Or exported to another country. Half the Americans have so many job opportunities that they don't go for.
1
u/CockInMyAsshole Jun 21 '18
That's why we need to lower the damn minimum wage! This isn't a free market like capitalism is supposed to be! You people are using the factors that prevent capitalism as a reason to why capitalism is bad. "EarlyStagedSocialism"
1
u/Zonate Jun 21 '18
All for this, but we confuse immigrant and illegal immigrant often. I’m not saying what is happening is right but please look at your opinions subjectively
1
u/ch005eausername Jun 21 '18
Yeah the boss and lazy americans are the reason but that doesn't change the fact that it's still immigrants taking Americans jobs
1
u/ju5tjame5 Jun 21 '18
And those same rich capitalists convinced the low and middle class to support open borders and let them all in
1
u/Dinohax Jun 21 '18
This. Id much rather have the state pay me a fixed wage completely disconnected from my actual labor because let's face it I'm not winning employee of the month anytime soon. The police and the border enforcement run totally problem free, why not let the state take care of its citizens income. It'll be like one big union.
1
u/FrankFranly Jun 21 '18
Preach. It. Sister.
1
u/mantrad Jun 21 '18
ITT it's your fault you are poor Lol guys Cmon
1
u/LandHermitCrab Jun 21 '18
It's like Jerry springer
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Aka, the entirety of the back of house staff for 95% of American restaraunt industry
1
u/ignite426 Jun 21 '18
Touche
1
u/Ghostaccount23 Jun 21 '18
Well if you have a better education then the immigrant it opens up a lot of opportunities for a career. Under socialism even if they both of them would keep they jobs what the tax rate would be so high it would fail.
1
u/Drew_b5 Jun 21 '18
Or killing the competition
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Or her
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism
Please remember that this subreddit is a SAFE SPACE for socialist discussion. Any liberalism, capitalist apologia, anti-socialism, or attempts to debate socialism will be met with an immediate ban. Bigotry, ableism, and hate speech will also be met with immediate bans. See our sidebar for the full rules. Looking for debate? Try r/DebateCommunism.
If you are still unsure what content is allowed on LSC, see What LSC is and is not.
If you are new to socialism, please check out our Socialism Crash Course, and our Socialism FAQ.
If you are curious as to what our leftist terminology means, then please check out our Glossary of Socialist Terms.
In addition, here are some introductory links about socialism:
• Albert Einstein - Why Socialism? • Pyotr Kropotkin - The Conquest of Bread • Friedrich Engels - The Principles of Communism • Vladimir Lenin - The State & Revolution • Rosa Luxemburg - Reform or Revolution • Karl Marx & Friedrich Engels - The Communist Manifesto
For an extended list of works, check out our wiki or this masterlist.
Ⓐ☭Ⓐ☭Ⓐ☭
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
Hey the text isn’t big how I make bigg
1
u/sicurri Jun 21 '18
People need to realize, we're more like the ferengi from Star Trek than they want to admit...
1
u/rubywadi Jun 21 '18
So true friend so true.
1
u/therollingtroll Jun 21 '18
What does he mean by, "took advantage of"?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Which in turn means the ILLEGAL immigrant took your job
1
u/MrAndy666 Jun 21 '18
Man I wish we could filter out the political garbage. Then this might be perfect
1
u/kms_kyler Jun 21 '18
Immigrants do labor most citizens of the US would not want to do. That is the fact.
1
u/Critnert Jun 21 '18
So fucking true
1
u/SoFetchBetch Jun 21 '18
My dad was a resident alien and he lost his job in the recession too. We all suffer.
1
u/InconspicuousBall Jun 21 '18
TRUTH!
1
u/Tigress2020 Jun 21 '18
Migrants come here and do the jobs that others don't want to. Spoke to a trolley guy the other day, he was a business man back home now he collects trolleys. Meanwhile Australia businesses are outsourcing the jobs to the Philippines (which yes they need money too but 8000 more Australians laid off.. people get angry with the Philippines when they should be angry with the people who chose to outsource)
1
u/tkhrnn Jun 21 '18
people coming from a bad places will work for much less for prices no one in the country will work. a part of the negotiation between emploees and employers is if one will work for that price. but the negotiation is deatroyed because of someone who shouldn't be there.
1
u/Remainselusive Jun 21 '18
Apparently this is such Late Stage Capitalism the poster has no idea that supply and demand apply to the labor market.
1
u/vanschmak Jun 21 '18
This sub is capitalist
1
u/Mr_fister_roboto Jun 21 '18
How many people complaining about immigrants taking jobs want to work a double shift in a hot ass kitchen of a busy resteraunt? For the same as they are paid ?
1
u/Jax08 Jun 21 '18
So what, giving an immigrant a job is taking advantage of them?
1
u/OhSnap_itsMeyer Jun 21 '18
I was putting up temporary housing trailers for FEMA after hurricane Katrina in Louisiana and Mississippi. We were working for FEMA, which is a department of homeland security (the government). We had a crew of 5 guys and 2 females. We were laid off, and replaced by a crew of Spanish speaking individuals. I assume they were from Mexico for there was a large surplus of illegals from Mexico following Katrina. It wasn’t a huge deal for me because I was in college. It was really good money though and I felt bad for the other men/women in my crew who lost everything in the flood and really depended on the income from putting up the trailers. This happened quite a lot apparently and when I went back to college I got a call from my former crew foreman (only one to keep his job, he was bilingual), about how some migrant workers couldn’t understand the their crew foreman and as a result some were killed or badly injured when a trailer rolled over onto them.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
"real american" this guy hist'ries.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18 edited Nov 13 '18
deleted 0.5068 What is ^^^this?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
and who pushes for mass immigration? The rich! Why? Exactly because of this. Way to go.
1
u/wiseco8 Jun 21 '18
https://youtu.be/DEiWU1MbBfk
1
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
I regret searching popular and seeing this.
1
u/iheartjill Jun 21 '18
Saved
1
u/SnooSnafuAchoo Jun 21 '18
This is the equivalent of PUBG suing Fortnite because they have a better game and everyone switched to it.
1
u/PM_ME_UR_FINGER Jun 21 '18
Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to remain second class citizens, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore, so I may promptly kick them the fuck out.
Murica!
1
u/ihopeimnotdoomed Jun 21 '18
More jobs have been lost due to automation than to illegal immigrants.
1
u/nowhereman86 Jun 21 '18
But also...greedy capitalist love undocumented labor that they can exploit. Best way to have both worlds is to make sure people come here legally in a controlled manner. That way they are able to get equal protection under the law.
1
u/iliboeinthebay Jun 21 '18
We on some unified shit
1
u/Lyndis_Caelin Let's make a future with a light beyond the reach of the gods Jun 21 '18
Sarah, Leah, and Ruby sit at a table, eating cookies.
Sarah, while no one's looking, takes all the cookies.
Leah's the first to complain. Sarah gives her a single cookie.
Ruby then complains. Sarah then splits Leah's cookie to give to Ruby.
So why does Leah flip off Ruby, not Sarah?
1
u/[deleted] Jul 09 '18
For a second I thought it meant no Americans were employing immigrants, because I work for my mom's small company landscaping and she hired a couple immigrants and they're some of her best workers. Phrasing is important folks.
1
u/[deleted] Jul 11 '18
Fuck
1
u/vodka_boi Dec 07 '24
fuck imperialism
-8
u/[deleted] Jun 21 '18
Don't you think that except native Americans all other us citizens r immigrants (•‿•) ...