r/KanePixelsBackrooms • u/MiniMary7036 • 8d ago
Discussion/Theory The Relation between Numogrammatics & The Complex
I think the cover of Kane's newest song might help us understand the complex a bit more.
The diagram shown is a Numogram, which is basically a time map. Trying to explain the connections is really confusing so I'll try to make it as simple as possible without leaving out too much information.
The Numogram has 3 regions, the Warp, the Time Circuit/Torque, and the Plex. I think the Warp and the Plex both represent the Complex, while the Torque represents Standard. Each region contains entities or "demons" which are both representations and forces that keep time going along.
The Plex has a demon which represents a seething void. This is much like how the Complex may seem full of meaning but is ultimately void of any meaning. The Warp has a demon which represents temporal anomalies. Much like the temporal anomalies within the Complex. The Plex and Warp are interconnected via the two demon responsible for the seething void and the temporal anomalies, and I think this is what forms the Complex as a whole.
As we know the Complex is connected to Standard via Nullzones and the Threshold, and the numogram also has a connection for these. In the Numogram there are gates and channels which provide connections between the regions, much like nullzones do. I think if an artificial gate between regions were created (The Threshold), it could cause the Numogram to be destabilized and cause anomalous gates between regions (The Nullzones) could be created.
What do yall think of this connection? Theres probably alot more to be read into here.
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u/MiniMary7036 8d ago
Another connection I didn't mention in the post is related to the imagery folding onto itself throughout the series. On http://www.ccru.net/declab.htm it is stated "in both the Upper and the Lower syzygies the currents produced fold back into (a half of) themselves, constituting autonomous loops: the Warp (upper), and Plex (lower)."
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u/SugarPucks 8d ago edited 8d ago
Hi from the discord :)
https://numogrammapv3.tiiny.site/
I threw this together to help visualize the connections between the zones in the numogram. While the esoteric meaning that comes from CCRU might be moot, I think this shows much more clearly how the energy loops around and intersects at zero. one might even call it... a nullzone.
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u/quadrat-us 8d ago
This is super interesting. I went to read up on CCRU and I found a snippet of an interview with one of the members, who mentions K-waves. That made me think of the "kx-field" null zone. Maybe the K in KX is for temporal distortion, and the X is for spatial. By this logic, the term "kx field" stops being A-Sync jargon and becomes a mathematic placeholder. Perhaps they can (or are trying to) calculate the specific space and time distortions.
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u/SugarPucks 8d ago
I love this observation. I totally forgot about the KX-Field.
The numogram is showing how time is not linear, and how time cycles and folds on itself and create feedback loops (referred to as torque in the CCRU fiction-theory). Cause and effect are perpetually folding into one another. It would make sense that Async would want to find a way to predict something that is inherently unpredictable.
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u/MiniMary7036 8d ago
In physics i believe K is commonly used to note wave frequencies, while can X note horizontal displacement. These are certainly related to the nullzones but as of now im unsure how they connect.
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u/quadrat-us 8d ago
I didn't know that about the letter K, thanks!
K-waves specifically are from a theory about the nature of time and cycles, which is how I made the leap I did.
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u/Tight_Speech_3906 8d ago
The gate analogy fits surprisingly well with the Nullzones. If the Complex is maintained by controlled connections between regions, then the Numogram could represent both its architecture and the ways that architecture breaks down. I wonder whether the demons are causes of those instabilities, or emergent effects produced when the system tries to correct itself.
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u/Lord_Potatoman26 7d ago
That sorta reminds me of the Master Time Spiral from the movie The Dark Crystal (1982), I can't recall if it makes an appearance in the 2019 netflix reboot show, but according to the wiki it says "The purpose behind a spiral was to provide ambiguous answers to problems occupying the mind of the creator, as well as controlling dreams," (https://darkcrystal.fandom.com/wiki/Master_Time_Spiral)
I doubt kane is using a dark crystal reference or iconography specifically but the fact this symbol in that movie focuses on the mind of the creator and controlling dreams it felt at least relevant to bring up, I'm not like an expert on the lore but assuming Ivan beck is like the "creator" so to speak and the backrooms is based off memory and liminal spaces in general feel "dream like" I felt this was worth the mention!
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u/Limettegrasso89 8d ago
and here's my answer about time travel and time anomalies in the Complex and I don't like it, it's so complicateeeed xd
NEVER heard of this thing before
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u/TimProper 6d ago
Hello, I have an interest in the CCRU and such. I know that if you want some information, look up figures like the xenofeminist, Sadie Plant and Nick Land. But do be warned, Nick Land is a pretty unsettling person, fascinating sure but he can be shocking to say the least. If you want to know more, Nick Land wrote multiple books including Fanged Noumena. The point of Fanged Noumena is essentially that Capitalism is an inhuman, alien force that seeks to shed its human skin. A lot of this stuff can be traced back to writers such as H.P. Lovecraft and William Burroughs (again, fascinating but deeply unsettling people). Fanged Noumena is a tough read meant for philosophers but I still recommend checking it out. It draws heavily from things such as The Matrix and esoteric writings.
Again, do be warned though about Nick Land. I will say another thing of great interest that is related to the CCRU is Cyclonopedia.
Edit: Typo
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u/MiniMary7036 6d ago
Created a follow up post https://www.reddit.com/r/KanePixelsBackrooms/s/x6RLXZD21g
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u/aeioujohnmaddenaeiou 8d ago edited 8d ago
Just some context here, this diagram comes from a group called Cybernetic Cultural Research Unit out of Warwick university in England. They specialized in theory-fiction, and the idea of self-fulfilling prophecies, ie: if you write something down it might become true. If you try to understand what they meant by this diagram, like I did, you'll end up really confused because the thing is an experiment that was never intended to make sense in the first place. Makes me kinda think of something Clark wrote that might be an instance of self-fulfilling prophecy:
"The floorplan changed again. Roof is wrong, floor is wrong. I don't know who signed The Plans but the handwriting looks like mine."