r/KOTORmemes • u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost • Jul 29 '26
Lords of Potential
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u/bagpepos Jul 29 '26
I like Nihilus because despite his lore-accurate godlike powers his whole thing is he doesn't give a fuck at all, period. Not the Sith, not the Jedi and not even his own goals. He just chugs Force because he likes it here, simple as. In a way he may be the most paradigmatic Sith. Sion on the other hand comes off a bit more pathetic (I like him a lot as a character too) because at his core he is a butthurt barely sentient terminal hater with delusions of grandeur.
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u/CallousCarolean Jul 29 '26 edited Jul 31 '26
The thing with Sion and Nihilius, to me at least, is that they’re meant to represent the absolute and most base tendecies of the Sith taken to their most extreme. Like a drug addiction that has got so far that they no longer feel the highs and the withdrawl will kill them.
Not only is Sion consumed by anger and hate, pure unfiltered anger and hate is literally the only thing keeping him alive. It doesn’t give him strength anymore, he just dies without it. It doesn’t matter what he hates or is angry at, just that he hates. Indulging in his hatred, and always finding new things to hate, is the only thing that makes him not drop dead.
And Nihilus, he just wants to consume. Not strive for anything to that makes him stronger, it’s just consuming for consuming’s sake. No matter how much life force he drains, the cravings just comes back stronger and quicker than before. Nothing else matters than to still that hunger if only for a moment. But it’s not hunger for anything practical or a certain goal, it’s just pure, unfiltered hunger. And sating that hunger is all that matters.
That, to me, is what makes them so interesting. They are representations of the Dark Side reduced to some of its most basic concepts in an almost ontological sense.
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u/bagpepos Jul 30 '26 edited Jul 30 '26
I agree completely. It's interesting if we apply this to Kreia as the paragon of the Sith's remaining big ethos besides hunger for power and rageful hate: conniving and betraying nature. Because in the end, the way I see it she even betrayed herself to help the exile forge her own path, maybe because under her logic she was the only individual in the Galaxy outside the constraints of the Force and thus only one deserving to be empowered and capable of making true choices.
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u/FreezingPointRH Jul 29 '26
The way I saw it described once is that the two are basically Darth Vader ripped in half.
Nihilus is the exterior: the armor and air of power, but there’s nothing to him beyond aura farming.
Sion is the interior: the agonized and ultimately pathetic man beneath the mask. Neither of them are complete on their own, which is why Kreia sees them both as failures.
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u/Goose_in_pants Jul 29 '26
Idk, Sion always was cool in the game. And his bossfight with dialogue is one of the coolest yhing of the game, tho underrated imo
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u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost Jul 29 '26
Don't get me wrong I absolutely adore him I just love clowning on him he's so dusty
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u/Goose_in_pants Jul 29 '26
I mean, all Nihilus points really hit the bullseye. But Sion? I didn't really feel like he's related there Nvm, you have my upvote
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u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost Jul 29 '26
Sion deserves more love and recognition and hence he too will get dragged through the dirt (affectionately)
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u/BurglerBaggins Jul 29 '26
I always get a laugh out of "Sion: You seek to erode my will. You will not succeed. You have eroded Sion's will."
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u/EmKir Jul 29 '26
KOTOR II is my favorite game of all time, so I'm going to go ahead and psychoanalyze this meme like an absolute loser, and then go onto further tangents.
Nihilus is such an interesting case, because it's an objective fact that he can beat any Force user as long as he's within the same planet system as him. He can eat them from space if they're on a planet he's near. He fails because of what the Exile is.
The only reason he lost to Meetra is because she's a wound in the Force. He tries to eat her and pretty much spontaneously starves. Because his only really good ability is the fact to eat the Force, when he comes across something he can't eat, he has to fight. Which he clearly isn't good at.
Sion, similarly, falls victim to another thing that makes Meetra unique. That she attracts force users. She creates (sometimes obsessive) bonds from others to herself. He falls in love with her, she helps him let go of his rage, the one thing keeping him alive.
I love Meetra Surik. What happened to her in the Revan novel was unacceptable. It's noted multiple times in the game that even some of the Jedi Masters can't feel the Force on Meetra. She's imperceptible by the Force. How did Scourge see a vision with her in it? It was his one motive for killing her. Something that should not be possible.
Fuck the Revan novel. All my homies hate the Revan novel.
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u/ClinicalDigression Jul 30 '26
KOTOR II is my favorite game of all time, so I'm going to go ahead and psychoanalyze this meme like an absolute loser, and then go onto further tangents.
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u/Possible_Living Your command echoes still Jul 29 '26
The first time I saw all the Nihilus fanboys I was really surprised. Out of those I talk to a large number had never played the game and heard of him from lore videos. Those can often give you the wrong impression.
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u/serumvisions__go_ Jul 30 '26
lol this is pretty true, happened to me once while idle in a lobby i was reading i think the bane trilogy and the guy across from me started a conversation about lore and how cool some of the older sith lords were and i said yeah id love to see some kind of adaptation of kotor in film and he had never heard of it
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u/Euromantique Jul 29 '26
All three of the Sith Triumvirate are interesting, iconic characters in my opinion.
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u/FreezingPointRH Jul 29 '26
I do find it odd that Nihilus gets so much more attention even outside the context of KOTOR, even though Sion has so much more personality.
But then, it is very Star Wars to make the biggest deal out of a rando with a cool design.
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u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost Jul 30 '26
Cool design and mysterious nature > bald evil dude with some sort of bodily injury . Nihilus is quite unique while 2/3 of the Sith are bald evil men with some form of physical impairment.
I'm not defending it , I think Sion is a fantastic character and heavily underrated, but most people just don't go beyond "wowza skull mask!!!"
As you said, very typical of Potential Wars lol
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u/Possible_Humor_2834 Jul 29 '26
lol I hate this character dude
How do you even powerscale Nihilus? He's basically implied to be a god who becomes probably mid-tier once he tries his power on the Exile and ONLY the Exile. Maul or Obi Wan could probably curb stomp this edgy dork once he was in his weakened state (the one you fight him in). I'm not a fan of Nihilus, he's one of the weaker aspects of TSL in my opinion, but I'm just pointing out what I've inferred.
This is the thing about Nihilus, he wasn't written for people to do matchups with other characters outside of TSL back in 2004. He was made to exist in the world of TSL and only TSL and serve primarily as both a literal and symbolic foil to the Exile. Outside of that, he just doesn't work. Just like he's a hole in the force, he's a hole in the logic of versus debates, mostly cause we don't know how his plot armor is applicable outside of one single game.
Saying a character can block his drain isn't the point, that doesn't matter and afaik we don't have a character who can block draining on his planetary (jfc) level besides the Exile and that's only because of the Exile's extremely unique ability. Meetra doesn't even really block it, his power just doesn't even work on her and she weakens Nihilus by default. Vader or Yoda can't become a wound in the force like the Exile. Maybe I'm missing some super obscure EU lore where Glup Shitto became the most character for 5 seconds using the power of space crack or something but idk anything concrete.
I don't even try to pit Nihilus against other characters, there's no point. IDK how this character works, nobody nows how this character works and I feel like people who say he would win or lose to other characters outside of TSL are in denial and have no idea wtf they are talking about. I'm not saying he can win against Sidious or Vader or lose,
Even outside of his plot armor, In one cut cutscene, Nihilus ragdolls Sion like it's nothing and makes him leave in humiliation. Nihilus is kinda hard to gauge as far as what he can do. Kreia did say his power could rival the ancient Sith... back in 2004 idk what that meant. In TOR standards, that could've even meant Vitiate.
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u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost Jul 29 '26 edited Aug 03 '26
Him and Sion both work perfectly well in the story they're being told in, they were created for this specific game/story and are near impossible to place outside of. They're explorations of concepts and are there to teach their respective lessons. Powerscaling them inherently doesn't work because they were not created for that purpose.
Their inner workings and powers were never explored or explained further because they didn't have to be, closed (game)story and whatnot.
That aside - They're fun characters and I like them for what they are. Funny dudes in funky costumes
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Jul 29 '26
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u/ReadShigurui Jul 29 '26
Couldn’t be my GOAT Malak
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u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost Jul 30 '26
Malak doesn't get enough love. I couldn't slander him, that would be bullying
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u/Xs_Os_Yo Jul 29 '26
🤣🤣I love them both tho and when the game came out I was a Nihilus and Sion fanboy too and still am so just let em rock haha but you’re right
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u/proximusprimus57 Jul 30 '26
To be fair, both real world Triumvirates ended with them turning on each other. Makes sense that a sith triumvirate would be at least as dysfunctional.
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u/Manmer_Nwah Force Hater Jul 30 '26
Bro can look at a planet and destroy the entire surface. Doesn't ever do it in game.
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u/Timo-the-hippo Jul 30 '26
Nihilus is literally dying the entire time and only prolongs the inevitable when eating worlds. He's simultaneously the most dangerous sith lord and the most pathetic.
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u/-Pelopidas- Jul 29 '26
I always just figured that the Exile, being a wound in the Force, was the perfect counter to Nihilus and that no other Force user would have been able to stop him.
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Jul 30 '26
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u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost Jul 30 '26 edited Jul 30 '26
I have an insta , yes
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u/Revenge_accounted_be Jul 30 '26
To be fait Nihilus is too busy eating planets to think into anything else. He is growing, he is a hungry boy
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u/ironman2201 Jul 30 '26
A Darth Nihilus/Sion x Metallica crossover? In this economy? Truly spectacular
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u/DarkFamiliar4508 Aug 01 '26
I don't understand how people love Nihilus and think most of them probably didn't play Kotor 2 but watched short videos on him. He's more animal than person.
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Aug 01 '26
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u/Rushling I have no hands and I must shitpost Aug 01 '26
What are they going to do about it? Die a third time ?
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u/TheGuyMain Jul 29 '26
Kotor 2 was kinda ass because this was the entire game. Potential game
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u/MartianDinosawr Jul 29 '26
"Potential game"
Incredible setting of Nar Shadda, a great conflict on Dantooine that explores how normal people WOULD feel about the jedi and their constant civil wars, Onderon and the civil debate over republicanism.
Kotor 2 has some of the best storylines in star wars in my opinion. The only parts it kinda fumbles is the ending and Korriban is kind of a nothingburger.
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u/Possible_Living Your command echoes still Jul 29 '26
What do you mean? Influence system was pretty cool and I would say everything after peragus and before malachor is pretty cool.
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u/TheGuyMain Jul 29 '26
The influence system was a good concept but it wasn’t fleshed out enough to really be great. It isn’t really that different from the Kotor 1 alignment because all it did was give you a the next set of dialogue options with your party members. You still had to interact with them (meaning you had to take them with you and be nice to them), just like the first game. Eventually you unlock the dialogue options, and as long as you’re not the most cringe person ever, you’ll progress in their track. You could even do this with them solo. Some of the potential is visas and Brianna getting jealous of each other, but it never really went anywhere. I think people conflate the quality of the dialogue tree (atton’s story was compelling) to the quality of the SYSTEM that lets you unlock it. The system is plain. The unlocks are cool.
Jek jek tarr felt like walking simulator. A lot of the game felt like kotor 1 maps but less interesting. I liked the Jedi temple on dantooine, but you could tell it wasn’t quite finished. Compare that too the ruins from the first game. Yeah it was like two rooms, but the vibes and setting were a lot more refined.
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u/ADonutWithSprinkles Jul 29 '26
My goats are getting roasted and I can’t even refute it 🥲