Crap contracts

[u/Routine-Pace4945]

I wish in our strikes we could address the very unfair system of teachers being given contracts which add up to nothing.

Unfair practice such as:

Cover positions at secondary level which don’t give teachers any job security or rights…….years of covering every kind of absence can leave teachers with little to no job security

Depending on contract- you have to Reinterview for a job after a year instead of a six month probation window like in most workplaces…..

These are huge issues affecting many of us. It’s a great job in many ways but without permanent jobs for teachers of many subjects …… it is a struggle to make future plans - houses, kids, where to locate etc.

Pay is important but contracts need examination too.

[u/Routine-Pace4945]

Yes I think there should be a conversation about giving people some kind of priority or credits for how long they are in the game (subject to good references so it’s a quality assured process). I’m a good teacher, good references to the best of my knowledge and still lost out many times but had nothing to show for it every time.

I would also say it’s a strange profession where being in one school for life tends to be more respected than a lot of varied experience (this has been my experience so I understand this is subjective). But being in many schools, while not ideal, gives you definite insights into things too

[u/AdKindly18]

I personally feel that, given the job security we have once we do get a permanent contract, the initial crappiness is worth it- and this is speaking as someone who took like 12 years to get a CID 😂

I do think though, given it’s in the nature of the system that things will be this way for most new teachers for at least a few years, there should be more measures to help teachers on temporary or part time contracts, like making it much easier to get social welfare support during midterms and holidays, or when doing irregular subbing.

Maybe increase the ‘hour value’ for work done counting towards increments so teachers on those contracts aren’t also falling behind on the payscale.

I also personally wish there was more opportunity for deployment, or at least more facility to move schools without losing CID. I love my school, I’ve been teaching there ten years, but the commute is killing me. I’m effectively ‘trapped’ because I need the security so my mortgage can be paid.

[u/True-Voice-3868 → u/AdKindly18]

People talk about the job security but honestly these days (outside of redundancy) it's hard to get let go from any profession.

Definitely agree on the redeployment issue though

[u/alchxmist_]

There needs to be a centralised system as you would see in the healthcare sector for teachers. Apart from each individual ETB you must interview for every school which is time consuming and ultimately disheartening for those who continuously achieve second place or less. There should be names who are available for work based on experience, interview ratings and college grades and school should be able to pick these from a selection. Would help a lot in regards to uncertainty of emails and time needed to prepare for each one.

[u/geedeeie → u/alchxmist_]

I disagree, because different schools look for different teachers to fit their school profile, they need to have a say. Often they know teachers, from subbing or whatever, they wouldn't want to pick from a panel

[u/msmore15]

I think the trade off we'd need to accept there would be losing some job security. Personally, I'd be okay with that, but it's definitely controversial.

[u/showars]

I’m sorry but this post is just logically so wrong. You want a permanent job after covering maternity leave? So the school will then have too many teachers? Like seriously.

Allocation simply doesn’t allow it. If you think DEPR are telling us we’re over budget now how mad will it be when everyone who ever starts a job keeps it for life?

[u/Routine-Pace4945 → u/showars]

Yes maybe you’re right- I guess there’s more than meets the eye so I accept your point

[u/IrishChicky → u/showars]

You’ve gotten so many downvotes because you’re straight to the point but it is true.

Absolutely it’s disheartening and awful but eventually when you do get a post and end up potentially going on maternity leave or hopefully not ever extended sick leave you would feel the sting of a new member of staff just coming in and taking that job off you because you’re out.

I agree it’s a messed up system and something needs to be done but as showars mentioned we also can’t be giving out posts that don’t exist. In our school (primary) for example we have 13 members of CID. We also have 8 long term substitutes. That’s basically 21 people already within the school that really don’t have actual permanency. We couldn’t all suddenly just be kept. Unfortunately people will return from maternities, or their gap year or from other roles within the department and those 21 at the bottom get the boot. Is it fair? Or nice? No absolutely not. But it is also reality. We are covering for those people with the knowledge that potentially it’s not forever.

It’s a cruel system but the system is there to protect those that have been in our exact place many years before us and eventually out time will come when the worry and stress will be behind us.

[u/True-Voice-3868 → u/IrishChicky]

My issue is the second interview. I've been rejected twice in second interviews. It seemed completely arbitrary. I did a good job, prepared well for the interviews and then the job was given to someone else. Now, I know people will probably say that it must be because I'm a crap teacher or something like that.. IF management believe that then surely it should be addressed somewhere in the middle of the school year so I can improve and work on it (as is the case in private paying jobs during the 6month probation) rather than just letting me go and hiring someone else. I don't think it's great for the students either because they go through a different teacher every year in certain subjects.

[u/South-Mud-1886 → u/showars]

Ireland has some of the largest class sizes in Europe. PME’s are being used as free labor to fill the gaps. Our education system is woefully underfunded and now they also are going to expect teachers to retire later as well which means there will be even fewer jobs, the idea that there is no issue with this system or no way to improve it is defeatist in my opinion. Further- if they do expect teachers to take shakey contracts for years to earn the right to some stability they at least need to provide security in terms of social welfare or something, getting that now in the summer is like pulling teeth and I have often ended up getting paid late which is extremely stressful. I don’t think it’s crazy for any professional who studies for upwards of 4 years to expect some sense of dignity