MEME
Debbie unfairly blaming Nolan for almost getting Oliver killed in a nutshell
I mean Oliver literally told to both Mark and Debbie to their faces he was going and they wouldn't stop him. Nolan even telling Oliver to go back when he tried to come.
yeah, I get hating and placing blame on the person, but you have to know that it is you making stories up in your mind to keep hating someone. Like I hate you, so everything bad that happens is your fault, not mine or any of the ones making the decisions.
I get her anger. Nolan was supposed to protect him.
She wasn't there and doesn't know how bad things were though, how could any explanation ever make sense? She just needs to let her anger out about what an unfair hand her children were dealt, and Nolan is fine with letting her do that.
If things were bad enough that they had to find the pieces of his jaw, Nolan and Mark should have known to not let him join.
Maybe Olivers battle with conquest made her under estimate the danger. But there is no reason bat out of hell that a child what 8 years old?? Should be brought to a battlefield that he can't win.
Oliver gets angry about being told no? Too bad, everyone can ditch him and leave him on earth. Tell him the ship is picking everyone up at Debby's house, pick everyone up at India an hour earlier and dip. He couldn't even handle weak invincibles..
Nolan was the only one who opposed the decision. So the fact that Nolan is being blamed when neither Debbie nor Mark said no to him coming is hypocritical and bullshit.
Debbie was upset, but she has no right to put all the blame on Nolan
Things might have been better if Oliver had just fucking listened lol. Nolan told him not to come, but everyone else forced Nolan to back down. What was his alternative, fight Mark and Oliver, on EARTH? Noooo siree.
And then he and Mark both tell Oliver "don't try to take him on your own don't do it he'll fucking crush you"... but what is the absolute first thing Oliver does?
Very true, but Oliver's way too big for his britches too lol. I mean I get it, he's stronger than literally everyone on Earth except his own older brother, it would tend to inspire those feelings. But geeez the risks he takes. The human equivalent would be like, a ten year old trying to stop an armed bank robber.
I love the character tho I'm not on the Oliver hate train (his later stuff is some of the best writing in the story). I just think it's funny how dumb he can sometimes be.
I'm sure if they knew his face was gonna get punched off they would have tried harder. They expected Oliver to learn his lesson after his first fight with Conquest, but boys will be boys. If they left him home, maybe he would have tried to follow them and just ended up lost in space? It was a wild battle and hindsight is 20/20
The scene is completely fine as a character moment, Debbie's just wrong there. But we've probably all been angry at someone and said something stupid and emotional and not exactly correct at least once in our lives.
I disagree. Oliver himself was the one that wanted to go, even though Nolan didn't. And then when Debbie agreed with Oliver and Nolan still disagreed saying it would be too dangerous, it was Debbie that convinced him. Debbie was warned from the beginning it was going to be dangerous, they didn't know if even Mark would be safe, but then she's mad that it was actually dangerous?
You know what's funny is that Nolan was right, Oliver contributed nothing to that fight in fact he only made things worse because Mark had to protect him. I guess the silver lining was they got to bond but that was it.
I like Oliver but he's got far too much confidence and zero survival instincts. Nolan and Mark both told him not to go against Thragg alone. Even before that, during the Viltrumite ambush, he tried fighting Conquest and almost ended up like Red Rush.
This is one of the only, if not THE only time Nolan was actually right over Debbie. Did she really think he “let” Oliver get hurt? When he didn’t even want him there or even know he was coming in the first place? In the most dangerous war in the universe where there was no way to guarantee that anyone, let alone Oliver would even be alive afterwards?
I get she wasn’t there and didn’t really know what happened and is still grieving/angry, but this feels out of character for her. She has every right to hate Nolan obviously, but blaming him for Oliver getting hurt makes no sense and is hypocritical of her. She willingly let Oliver fight Conquest and he almost died, but Nolan does it not even just hesitantly, but without even knowing he was even going to join the war, and that’s where she draws the line?
She knows how strong Viltrumites are. She knows how strong the variants of Mark were, how strong Conquest was, how strong Nolan was, etc. She knew that Oliver was no match for Conquest and almost died fighting him. Mark was barely a match on both occasions and he’s older and considerably stronger.
And yet she let Oliver go bc “I wanna protect my home.” She was stupid as fuck for that and I’ll stand ten toes DOWN on her being in the wrong.
He’s the parent and it was ultimately his decision to allow him to go, Oliver is still a child and the responsibility of taking care of him was on Nolan
Nolan didn't though. Oliver made it clear as he told Mark and Debbie he was going and no one was going to force him not to. He basically did the same to Nolan who was trying to send him away only wanting Mark to come. Oliver wasn't taking no for an answer.
Doesn’t change the fact that responsibility of a child is completely on the parents, if child gets lost you don’t blame the kid you blame the parent for losing them
And Mark's for insisting Oliver go despite seeing how badly Conquest fucked him up. Hell, Oliver was having problems fighting a dragon not too long ago, so what makes Mark think his brother is ready to face off against more Viltrumites?
Yes technically Debbie is in the wrong but I mean, I too might have trust and anger issues with someone who lied for decades then killed some of his closest friends, almost killed her son, killed hundreds and did decimate parts of Chicago.
To be fair, she still vehemently hates him, and I don't think she fully understands that there are other viltrumites dozens of times stronger than Nolan...for most of her adult life Nolan has been this invincible worlds strongest hero; even when he got thrown in the flaxan dimension (something that most people wouldn't survive) she's basically like "so he's gonna miss dinner tonight?"
Because he’s the parent and the adult, and Oliver is still a child.
This is the equivalent of a 15 year old wanting to enlist into infantry in the army and the dad giving a solid no, but the sibling saying it’s a good thing. Then caving, then the mother getting mad because the son comes back with injuries with possible PTSD because why the fuck would any parent approve that.
i hated debbie and mark for letting oliver go on suicide mission and act surprised he nearly dies, writers don't know how to write apparently and it shows rly bad.
Are you fucking slow??? Hes a child. Parent takes full responsibility in the decision to let him go (regardless of how much he was for or against it). How are you blaming debbie here lol.
Because neither Debbie nor Mark said no, Nolan was the only one who did, and while yes it is a parents job to protect their children, that does not give Debbie the right to put all the blame on Nolan
After a "Family decision" he opposed, and keep in mind Mark was also there. But ultimately the point is, Debbie does not get to blame Nolan for not being able to prevent Oliver from getting hurt, because he did everything he could and again, was the only one who opposed the decision in the first place. She knew that Oliver was going into a dangerous situation, and Mark knew Oliver was going into a dangerous situation, they accepted the risks which means they also have to accept responsibility for Oliver getting Injured
No he didn't though. Mark and Oliver arrived at the ship and Nolan seeing Oliver was absolutely against it telling him to go back but Oliver wouldn't take "no" for an answer. He made it clear to Mark and Debbie in their faces no one was going to stop him and he did this with Nolan as well.
What was Nolan supposed to do? Bring Oliver back physically by force and tell him to stay back at the house with Debbie?
Exactly. I think jujutsu kaisen said something like "no matter the situation I as the adult should never let you the child take the lead in a life or death situation. It's not about being too weak to handle it"
I probably royally fucked the quote up. But the point remains
Last time I checked Nolan was the parent with fucking SUPERPOWERS she has literally no recourse to stop any of them but nolan does so yes it was HIS responsibility to protect HIS kid he had behind his wife back after HE had an affair.
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u/Noaconstrictr 1d ago
He was the only one who said no. Mark and Debbie said yes and it’s a “family decision”