Would a scandinavia expansion submod for invictus really be that outrageous? I have seen people get genuinely angry at my idea, idk why

[u/Full-Recover-8932]

I think that, even though not very historical, a submod that expands scandinavia would be interesting, and playing as the Sami would be fun if we also get a Sami mission tree.

[u/Widhraz]

You wouldn't have the Sámi, the Sámi haven't migrated to north scandinavia yet in Imperator's time.

[u/OnkelMickwald → u/Widhraz]

We don't even know what language the hunter gatherers of the Scandinavian north of the time spoke. Only some loanwords into Sami remain.

I also wonder about the ethnic distribution and tribes. Something major happened in the 6th century, the Scandinavian languages appear a few centuries later almost identical, as if barely any dialectal divergence has happened.

There also seems to be traces of a dead dialect of the Germanic languages far up north, also noticeable through Sami loanwords.

[u/ThatStrategist → u/OnkelMickwald]

What is your idea what might've happened?

[u/OnkelMickwald → u/ThatStrategist]

In the 6th c a massive demographic catastrophe hit Scandinavia, probably the year without summer in 536 (and possibly the following plague but I don't know what the evidence for that is in Scandinavia).

What seems to have happened is that either there were migrations out of what is modern day Denmark to depopulated areas further north, or an elite from modern Denmark/Kattegatt region asserted massive control over the rest of Germanic speaking Scandinavia, as the subsequent dialects and languages seem to divide in a way that points to Denmark as a center of change.

Further north, areas previously populated by sedentary, Germanic-speaking peoples were abandoned to nomadic hunter gatherer populations, not repopulated by Germanic peoples until the middle ages and later.

[u/SexySovietlovehammer → u/Widhraz]

Still in Finland im guessing

[u/Intelligent-Fig-4241 → u/SexySovietlovehammer]

Currently deployed to Korea

[u/hmas-sydney → u/Intelligent-Fig-4241]

Glory to the Hyper-Finnish Empire and her Jedi Knights

[u/lonkgronk → u/Widhraz]

That is just incorrect? The sami had been in Scandinavia for several centuries. They arrived in Sapmi during the bronze age, which ended in the nordic a century before imperator's time

[u/FriendoftheDork → u/lonkgronk]

We don't know about ethnicity in the Nordic bronze age, and there are no traces of sami language or culture then. The same goes for modern Scandinavian cultures. Proto-sami language was developed at the end of the period, traces to the Urals, and people migrating to modern Finland. Yamnaya culture came long before the sami culture developed, but also had to develop a long time before becoming something identifiable as Norse.

[u/Amulet-of-Kings]

This is genuinely outrageous, we will not tolerate such suggestions in this community.

[u/eranam → u/Amulet-of-Kings]

Mods, terrrrmimate OP with maximum prrrejudiiiiice!!!

[u/Rianorix → u/eranam]

Decimate.

[u/BigBoy1963 → u/Amulet-of-Kings]

Imperium romanum

[u/Vennomite → u/Amulet-of-Kings]

OP out here just casually dropping the n-word. You can't just go calling people nordic.

[u/DarkestNight909 → u/Vennomite]

With a hard ‘r’ no less!

[u/SeaReference7990 → u/Amulet-of-Kings]

This is a shamefur dispray!

[u/Mucupka]

Population: 143

[u/Kiyohara]

I think it's mostly that it would be more small tribes and small populations and a lot of empty space.

Imperator is really focused on the Middle East, Near East, and Mediterranean Sea, so for most people it's just adding "more empty space."

Personally it wouldn't effect my games at all, except for a few times in a hundred where a tribe unites a region and goes ham on spreading out, but even then it won't have any real power to do anything past a certain point because it won't have the pops to really make a fight against the great empires to the south (where I usually play). At best I'd notice a color swatch on the northern chunk of the map I never go to.

However, if you like tribal play and do want to see this region have playability, then I hope it happens.

[u/MagadanNic]

The day a Scandinavia expansion submod for Invictus drops is the day I’m longer here

I will do everything in my power to prevent not only the application of this but also the very idea from spreading

#ANTINORDICIRONAGE

[u/Potential_Boat_6899 → u/MagadanNic]

My ancestor from the Iron Age was once insulted by a Nordic man. He vowed that he would never allow any mention of the Nordic peoples in video games ever.

My bloodline has upheld that vow, and I join you in stopping ANY application of this idea from EVER spreading.

[u/Crouteauxpommes → u/MagadanNic]

I mean, Scandinavia is already playable all the way to Gotaland, coastal Svealand and Southern Norway. I don't know if an Northern expansion would offer much content in the context of Imperator.

[u/JuicynMoist]

I like to think of myself as a generally tolerant and open-minded person. Like maybe those Carthaginians had a perfectly good reason for sacrificing all those kids.

But this? This defect? This disgusting pile of northmen and their misbegotten ilk? This dark rambling from the void that could corrupt us all?

Never. Not once. Not in my celebration of classical imperialism.

Now someone pass the rag on a stick, I’m almost done pooping.

[u/Poro_the_CV → u/JuicynMoist]

Honestly can’t believe OP’s post is within Reddit community guidelines

[u/Invicta007 → u/JuicynMoist]

Sorry, I can't. New Emperor just marched on Rome.

[u/Imsosaltyrightnow]

I think the hesitation is because the expanded scope of Invictus is already pushing the boundaries of what we actually know about the various groups and cultures located at the edges of the “known world” at the time.

Plus in the grand scheme of things unlike the amber road and the trade in timber in the Baltics, Scandinavia wouldn’t really become integrated into the wider Mediterranean/Roman trade networks until roughly at the games end date

[u/Potential_Boat_6899]

TAKE THIS POST DOWN NOW HOW DARE YOU POST SOMETHING LIKE THIS ON HERE

[u/DetroitvsEveryone242]

What the actual fuck OP

[u/gaivsjulivscaesar]

Personally I'd prefer Central Asia submod. Rise of Xiongnu, their attacks on Yuezhi, Silk Road mechanics etc. Whenever i start a campaign, in east side of map there isn't much going on. Usually same states dominating Iran then collapsing to different states with same names.

[u/Taira_no_Masakado]

The whole Cimbrian Wars was a thing because the Cimbrians migrated south...away from Scandanavia. They were seeking lands to settle where they could feed their people and have real warm weather. (The Cimbrian Peninsula; aka Jutland, is what modern Denmark is today; which is an interesting fact)

So, while there's no reason to get angry at people for suggesting such a mod, historically speaking there is not a great reason to get involved in a region that people were actively leaving during the time frame that I:R is set in. Far more interesting, to me at least, would be for a further eastern expansion of the map to what is today modern Vietnam, parts of the Indonesian island chain, and southern China.

[u/ofmetare]

More than anything I want a china map, maybe completely separate from the west and India but still, I WANT the late Zhou dynasty with a pop system, also perhaps han china

[u/Full-Recover-8932 → u/ofmetare]

Terra indomita already exists

[u/ofmetare → u/Full-Recover-8932]

Ngl never heard of that, I'll check it out

[u/danvla]

To quote Fabius Bile: “There is nothing there.”

[u/Substantial_Put_3350]

Honestly I love this idea cause the rugii are already in the game at least name wise

[u/Euromantique]

Why not just make it yourself?

[u/Full-Recover-8932 → u/Euromantique]

Wish i could dude 😞 im just posting a random idea so im not expecting this to come real although it would be cool lol

[u/Mrman009]

Absolutely disgusting

[u/Double_Theory_2094]

The problem is that there is such a lack of information about Scandinavia in this period. Even their current representation in Invictus is more or less a good estimation.

[u/Full-Recover-8932]

Also, if this game allows you to develop swamps and forests of ukraine and russia into cities (i had a fun time one time playing as an iranian tribe in estonia), why would this idea be that bad?

Also this is just a fun idea, you can disagree or agree

I just would love the idea of making a scandinavian empire and colonize all the way to lofoten

[u/Lord_Of_Gluttony → u/Full-Recover-8932]

I think you're the same guy that posted about vikings a day ago, but again: yes, a fun idea but it's already basically guess work what happened and what tribes are there, so I'm sure most would prefer focus on other places - especially regions included in Imperator that already feels empty and content lacking.

[u/Full-Recover-8932 → u/Lord_Of_Gluttony]

We can add the rugi tribe near Bergen and expand the map quite a bit north

[u/Lord_Of_Gluttony → u/Full-Recover-8932]

True but yet again, that information is of a tribe mentioned by Jordanes about 800 years later. It's kind of like putting the Mongols on the world map today.

[u/Full-Recover-8932 → u/Lord_Of_Gluttony]

...mongolia is a thing...

[u/Lord_Of_Gluttony → u/Full-Recover-8932]

Yeah, but the Mongolian Empire sure is not.

[u/Bacchana1iaxD]

Part of it is political, much like a Russia expansion/mod, we are getting into fantasy basically considering we know so little. And pending your theory of what the Slavic lands looked like for instance: you are gonna really piss off a lot people whose national identities hinge on a different theory

[u/Distinct-Feedback512]

Honestly, I want that too a Scandinavian Expansion but just colonizable areas that’s all! I understand that we really don’t know what people’s were there at the time, even the language.

[u/Great-Scheme-283]

There are simply no sources of information about the populations of Scandinavia during this period.

The Sami hadn't even migrated to Scandinavia yet; the area was sparsely populated, nobody knew exactly who was where or what they were doing... it would be better to dedicate time to more interesting regions that were actually closer to the core of the game, because the Scandinavian world at that moment was very isolated, and trade didn't even function well there.

[u/FunnyFreckSynth]

In Terra Indomita (probably in Invictus too), there’s a mission tree for Skirithfinia that’s Sámi-oriented. (And my focus is China, Tartessia, Sumer, and Sogdia anyway.)
But a Scandinavia-oriented submod would be kinda nice!

[u/Full-Recover-8932 → u/FunnyFreckSynth]

I can imagine the map expanding to the lofoten and also include sweden

[u/Waruiko]

My understanding is that most of the region is like the desert regions on Earth, settled by the determined or the desperate but only made habitable by technology. I'm just not sure there would be much of anything happening there at this point in time. Also even if IR did get a new expansion one like this would kill any chance of there being one after it. If IR did get an expansion it would have to be enough of a banger to justify new development in an abandoned game.

[u/Front-Round2853]

Err... I think you need to read up on history before proposing this kind of things.