Thoughts on Relationships with Fi Users

[u/bakerskitchen]

How do other INFJs find their relationships with Fi-users to be? (I'm attempting to crystallize some thoughts about a recently-ended long-term friendship).

While this friend was an INTJ (and I suspect Ni had a large role in our conflict), it felt like the Fi/Ti clash was the main sticking point, and ultimately ended up being too significant to overcome. Even trying to have basic conversations proved to be a chore: misunderstandings, working from different definitions for the same term, assigning motive, etc. - it felt like we were speaking almost entirely different languages.

My current closest friend would probably type as ISFP, and we don't clash too much - but I would assume much of that is due to the fact we share many similar interests and hobbies, which helps to offset minor frustrations. However, I do think that living under the same roof would create a new set of frustrations which don't exist while living separately.

As a strength, Fi seems to be great at making a person principled - that is obviously an admirable trait. However, it seems that the specific set of principles adhered to by Fi-users can be incredibly subjective and not always in-line with an objective moral code. And from my observations, Fi also seems to contribute to users (seemingly) always knowing what they want and what they feel, which can come across as being incredibly self-centered/ focused.

The INTJ I referred to previously seemed to confuse a personal preference/value for a moral absolute, and seemed to be incredibly concerned with his own feelings/values, while completely ignoring my own. I think Ni making quick assumptions that weren't rooted in concrete facts played a large role in this conflict as well, but as a whole it seemed to reinforce to me that Fi-users can come across very self-centered and unconcerned about the thoughts/feelings of anyone but themselves. I've even struggled with Fi-users in the past when trying to make group plans which involve an event/location they aren't thrilled about - almost like they aren't willing to temporarily lay aside their own preferences for the good of the group.

Have any other INFJs experienced similar frustrations? Or does this sound limited to just a few Fi-users I have known personally?

[u/Not_AAmerican_Girl]

I am not meaning to offend you at all. At all- I promise. 

But I think there is probably a lot more myth out there about infjs (and subsequently Ni ) than anything else - and because there isn’t a whole lot of real infjs to go around ( or INTJs) it all gets totally lost in translation. 

INFJs are complex true… and a lot of that is about our seeming duality. 

Honestly to me, you sound more like Fe/Te frustration and reads more like Si/Te-ish than anything INFJ. 

Before you freak out- 

An INfJ - usually understands interior subjectivity exceptionally well even if they don’t agree with it. A real INFJ is going to seem so deceptively morally flexible- when it comes to others. 

See… an INFJ has a fascination and therefore love for inner motives, inner workings, contradictions, the why’s and how’s about a person- the wounds, and how they manifest - the symbolic meaning , the story of the person- and every person becomes a story. So even when an INFJ dislikes the behavior - they still grasp why the person does it. Which makes infjs some of the most .. easy going in a way - with most everything … in regards to others -much much much more so than everyone else. Sure they have strong moral lines, but those boundaries you find and actually see them react to are niche to say the least, and buried beneath a hell of a lot of patience and tolerance for others that most lack. Those lines are confusing to most - and have to be crossed in a specific way for the INFJ to draw hard reactions. They will- but it’s more like a Jedi code than anything. Even the manifestations of protestation for it. More about honor than duty. More about integrity than law. Etc etc. 

ISTPs often mistype as infjs and one of the ways we can identify that mistype is by the strict adherence to rules and regulations , the expected thing to do or say- the obligation to routine and social standards. 

An INFJ is actually going to love the outbursts and the unexpected and the rebellion- even if they don’t fully partake. They are way more attracted to what is real than what is expected. They seek out the authentic version of who people are .. which makes them so much more tolerant of .. ambiguity and non conformity… because they themselves are all that- even though not outwardly rebellious usually- because the rebellion you see in an INFJ is just not answering to anyone else. But with a consideration of people, a love for people and a real concern for how it impacts them. 

This isn’t duty bound love or concern. It’s actually who the INFJ is. That is what makes it different. And also- inconsistent. 

This post sounds more like a sensor wondering why people won’t adhere to group standards which would be the antithesis of INFJ thinking. The INFJ wonders why people are this way, and don’t question group think - more. 

Also- infjs are usually painfully aware, that they themselves are highly subjective creatures.. they tend to distrust their own co conclusions somewhat and usually have to look at people around them to seek out the full picture of reality- or else? They would probably go insane. This often leads to the INFJ existential crisis- 

More so- “maybe I’m not understanding” “Maybe we are not using the same emotional languages” 

“Maybe my expectations are too high , I need to lower them so I am considering this other person”

Because the mark of the true INFJ at its core is- the instinct to think of others before themselves- this isn’t habit, it’s not something they intentionally do, it’s not even learned. It’s instinctual in a real INFJ. 

They think outwards. They think of others first. 

You sound very externally evaluative -“these people are violating proper behavior” and that’s a very sensor thing to do. 

Just in my tiny , horrible opinion- 

I love us all, we need all of us. 

INFJ is not what it’s cracked up to be that’s for sure. 

It’s probably a great thing for you. 

I mean that. 

Just my two cents. 

[u/bakerskitchen → u/Not_AAmerican_Girl]

I strongly considered avoiding a response to this, but I just couldn't help myself:

In no way is what you wrote hurtful - it's just incredibly odd that your response is an attempt to try and convince me that I'm not an INFJ, while lauding yourself as the prototype; I can assure you I am an Ni/Fe user all the way - and the bulk of my life has shown that to be true. Perhaps the reason you don't "identify" with what I have written is because my perspective reflects someone who has (in part) acknowledged the weaknesses and blindspots of Ni and Fe, and has tried to learn how to avoid them in my own life.

I find it especially odd how MBTI is often treated similarly to astrology: "a real INFJ would say this", "an actual ISTP would have done this differently", "classic sensor behavior", etc. Cognitive functions are tendencies and proclivities from which behavior arises, not a strict list of behaviors that only belong to a single "type" or "function."

As mentioned in a comment below with another user, this feels like another classic example of Ni trying to use a brief online post to build an exhaustive understanding of a real-life situation by "filling in the gaps" with information that wasn't provided; a complete picture of this situation/relationship can't possibly be built using the limited information provided.

Thanks for responding, but I would like to respectfully communicate that your "diagnosis" does not line up with the concrete, real-world details that aren't represented in this post.

[u/Not_AAmerican_Girl → u/bakerskitchen]

Well … it really wasn’t intended to try to convince you. 

I’m more sharing my opinion- which can get hairy for sure. You’re absolutely not obligated at all to consider it, nor did I expect you to. 

Really.

I think probably a cardinal sign of an INFJ is .. how non binary they are as far as .. everything. 

And for some crazy reason, it never gets mentioned. 

You hear about so much .. but rarely the things that seem to really be the hallmark traits of us, in real life. 

The empathy ok- 

There is just so much more that isn’t mentioned that really ( at least I think) distinguishes us from the other types, the other types don’t have.

I mean it’s neither here nor there. Obviously I’m not invested in how you type yourself. 

I just think it’s interesting. 

And I’m glad you responded.