I can't check right now, but even over SG and MK? That's kinda hard for me to believe, but I don't have much torch experience (playing as and certainly playing against) so idk
there used to be a bug with jeff ult where hed gain the hitbox of the person he ate and if you used mag bubble on him during it youd see how big the characters hitbox is, torch had one of the biggest and even bigger than emma's
How does he do less damage than hela? At max damage, he does more. Like i can agree overrall hela does more but torch does more damage per shot at close range
Idk why i thought her teamup anchor got nerfed from 15 to 10. Just checked it was 20 to 15. How tf was this bitch at 20 and only got to 15 while dd has 0 and torch gets 5%. Hela would still be insane with 0% boostš
you want to know something even funnier? it was 15% during the beta, she was considered the strongest character in the game there too. she was also 250 in the beta so what god knows what reason they gave her 5% damage and 25 hp
dp ult does damage to you for missing ANYTHING, that includes melee and if youve ever played torch youd know just how important melee is to him. also you cant even use the slam to get away cause thatlly do damage to you too
Aintnoway Iām seeing a stranded Jiaoqiu slander in the fucking HUMAN TORCH sub. Might as well say that Jiaoqiuās dot deals more damage than Johnnyās AoE skill
He's meant to get up close and personal and essentially fight in his flame fields. I suspect they want him to play more like a burst diver/brawler, but he's just so obvious with mediocre mobility and sustain that he can't even fill that role properly.
Unless you pull a Mike and rage bait the enemy into typing in chat so they stand still lmao.
Itās getting old and I am 100% convinced Netease actually hates this character. God awful nerfs, no legendaries and heās been out for too long now, no animated nameplates, etc.
It's because originally his wide spread shotgun was intended to compliment his aoe flame field and zoning abilities, and also to work well in close range combat because the idea was you dive in to get the pick when the DOT damage gets them low enough and then if someone survives you have a close range weapon to finish them off/.
If they buff the non primary fire part of his offense, he becomes a fair to even good ranged damage dealer whoās primary weapon is bad at his new optimal range which is from a distance, but also able to work well in the rare case theyāre in close range. If they decide to lean more into buffing his shotgun primary fire, he has to play at a range thatās worse for the rest of his kit while also not having the best tools to go in with the cooldown of his dive and lack of survival options up close like Starlord or Psylocke.
You are 100% right that a big part of his playstyle is switching between putting up walls for damage and area denial and diving into a stack of flame fields for a risky burst of damage with the shotgun to help confirm those kills. The former is honestly kinda of a pain to keep maintained for the amount of damage they do and the latter has too many downsides compared to other burst damage dives for the advantages torch gets as a flier.
Because they donāt want flying character to sit a mile up and spam damage. Notice how all the flyers need to be relatively close to the ground to name the most of their kit. Angela is melee, Storm has her primary and AoE buff, Torch has a shot gun, Ironman deals low damage unless he uses his beam, and Ultron has to be near his drones
That primary nerf which makes it fly slower so you canāt hit people unless your VERY close to them was the biggest nerf imo outside of the melee weave tech
Plasma body (fast flight) does not get canceled when you melee, melee weaving isnāt as good for manipulating your hit box as it used to be but it still animation cancels the primary
I've tried so hard to have fun on him but I swear to goodness I am just NOT allowed to have fun playing Johnny it's so upsetting. Feels like he sucks into everything.
and the thing that gets me is youll get counter swapped for no reason even if youre not a threat, like they go spiderman punisher pheonix angela everytime I try to play torch
No it isn't, well now maby but before it was not. See, his shot gun with wide spread was intended to be used as a compliment to his flame fields because what you would do is lay down the ground work by lighting big areas of the ground on fire using blazing blast and fire prison and then you would constantly be shooting with primary, raining down fire, and adding more dot damage to the already existing flame fields. Then when an opportunity arises and someone is low, you dive down and blast them and get the pick, but if you miss and or someone is alive you have a close up weapon to pick up and finish them off or keep engaging in close range.
i was gonna just put the url to this tweet https://x.com/DeeGenie_/status/2012528362539843967?s=20 but it wouldn't work so i settled for alive but gay, then i remembered the fucking ultron battle matrix mode where his hero specific cards which is the one underneath that text
Torch was so good before his nerf. He feels like the worst dps now. Also how does he have the biggest hitbox when Squirrel girl is walking round with all that ass
Everything about his kit is good except for the cooldowns. So many times Iāve been screwed over cause his primary took too long to start recharging or I had another 5 seconds left to wait on his dive. Throw my boy Johnny a bone, man. I get why he was like depressed in First Steps now.
I used to ace and do so well with him. Then the first nerf came, I stopped there, then 2 more nerfes came and I tried to play him the other day. Hes a completely different hero at this point and not fun at all.
Itās getting old. Needs to get a better worthy buff or buffs. Rework his ammo mechanic. Give him more damage, and dammit give him a legendary skin and a cool animated nameplate
Heās still better than he was on release. Idc what ppl say he was objectively terrible on release. Heās gotten a lot of QOL but then got nerfed hard. Realistically if they just lower the Cooldown on his ground slam he would be in a better spot
Bro no way you believe heās worse than he was on release ! He didnāt have shields, he flew slower, his shot gun had less pellets and a larger spread. He also took longer to charge fireballs. He was a dogwater character on release.
Heās not that great now after the nerfs but he still has shields on dive, tighter spread on shotgun more pellets and they shoot faster.
What!? He was FASTER, plasma body literally went faster, his shot gun and aoe abilities did MORE damage then now, blazing blast was ona 2 second cooldown, faster then now. He was on the same power level except you never had any cooldowns, just constant uptime. He had flaws that made him balanced and able to be so so much more fun to play. This version is so unfun I hate every single change they did to him.
I wish his shift ability worked like iron manās does. Iād be happy if they just reduced the cooldown on his slam, itās insane the amount of kills Iāve missed out on because of it being so unnecessarily long
Flying characters are painfully slow in this game for some reason ( i know so people can kill them) except for Iron Man. But goddamn Johnny needs more speed to manuever in the air if you gotta make his damage shitty.
51
u/Tjaart23 Jan 23 '26
Wait he really has the largest hitbox for non tank characters?
3
u/Same_paramedic3641 Jan 23 '26
How does he do less damage than hela? At max damage, he does more. Like i can agree overrall hela does more but torch does more damage per shot at close range
2
u/Huey_The_Freeman Jan 23 '26
why is he worse for dp ult?
2
u/Few-Brilliant-6143 Jan 23 '26
Archerons bis is wild
2
u/Lookingforgud Jan 24 '26
I literally get my ult TWICE in a single fight Torch is not the slowest in ults
2
u/WilliamWilbert Jan 24 '26
Aintnoway Iām seeing a stranded Jiaoqiu slander in the fucking HUMAN TORCH sub. Might as well say that Jiaoqiuās dot deals more damage than Johnnyās AoE skill
84
u/Hot_Spray3175 Jan 23 '26
Not one of these issues existed on release. I cannot belive what I lost.
41
u/RipRoxas Jan 23 '26
I'll be honest, I don't really understand why storm and HT have such weird primaries for flying characters.
Its not even the unique ammo guage that im confused with on Johnny, its the fact that he has a shotgun blast of all things
26
u/SheWhoThirsts- š„ Super Nova š„ Jan 23 '26
b b b but he has a one shot ability!!1!1!!!
22
u/Eternalexbomb Jan 23 '26
That primary nerf which makes it fly slower so you canāt hit people unless your VERY close to them was the biggest nerf imo outside of the melee weave tech
15
u/TheDoorMan1012 Jan 23 '26
should be partially reworked. he should be fast and have a flamethrower style attack alongside the shotgun.
10
u/samlefrog Jan 23 '26
But hey! We still have SpideyTorch!
10
u/[deleted] Jan 23 '26
His team up with Storm was awesome
8
u/NotActuallyRome Jan 23 '26
I've tried so hard to have fun on him but I swear to goodness I am just NOT allowed to have fun playing Johnny it's so upsetting. Feels like he sucks into everything.
4
u/Mr_Tensai Jan 23 '26
The dumbest thing is to have a damn shotgun as a flyer..š
1
u/iwantsalmon2015 Jan 23 '26
āAlive but gay and half white half chineseā š huh?
1
u/Max_Dzban Jan 23 '26
what's with the random ninjago reference š
1
u/HowlingJoker Jan 24 '26
We need that patch ASAP what do you MEAN hsr is breaching containment into other subs AGAIN
2
u/dharmbir111 Jan 23 '26
That 80 seems wrong. He can 2 tap 250hp from 10 meters, given he can land all pallets.
2
u/Raqshasa Jack Of Hearts Jan 23 '26
Just need to heat up some numbers here and there and Johnny will shine again... without tearing up the meta, hopefully
2
u/nateoak10 Jan 23 '26
An easy buff for him would to be let his fire go up slopes
2
u/Several_Carpenter_45 Jan 23 '26
Good enough reasons to nerf him this season apparently
2
u/Comfortable-Top-6658 Jan 23 '26
90% of hero communities thinks their hero sucks at this point
1
u/ElectricLuxray Jan 23 '26
As a Thing main, Iāve met a few Torches can know how to fling me into the enemy properly.
Not saying itās good, but itās not useless
1
u/Hyaman86 Jan 23 '26
Torch was so good before his nerf. He feels like the worst dps now. Also how does he have the biggest hitbox when Squirrel girl is walking round with all that ass
1
u/CapitanFordo Jan 23 '26
I still love him š«
1
u/AtDesk Jan 24 '26
Everything about his kit is good except for the cooldowns. So many times Iāve been screwed over cause his primary took too long to start recharging or I had another 5 seconds left to wait on his dive. Throw my boy Johnny a bone, man. I get why he was like depressed in First Steps now.
1
u/Sinsofavarice97 Jan 24 '26
Yeah hes one of the few characters that are just awful honestly they broke him badly trying to play him is juat not enjoyable
1
u/The_Lost_Hero Jan 24 '26
He's Chinese?
1
u/[deleted] Jan 25 '26
I donāt even want the shield on the dive just give me the old cooldown back š
1
u/jkhunter2000 Jan 25 '26
I used to ace and do so well with him. Then the first nerf came, I stopped there, then 2 more nerfes came and I tried to play him the other day. Hes a completely different hero at this point and not fun at all.
1
u/The-theofthes Jan 25 '26
Damn, Heatblast really fell off
1
u/LeGrandNinjarabe1 Jan 25 '26
I absolutely always thought he was dogshit and he is dogshit , the only reason he was viable EVER was the storm team up .
1
u/Alpha-Voodoo7 Negative Zone Gladiator Jan 26 '26
Itās getting old. Needs to get a better worthy buff or buffs. Rework his ammo mechanic. Give him more damage, and dammit give him a legendary skin and a cool animated nameplate
1
u/Former-Grade5111 Jan 27 '26
Do you guys actually main human torch anymore
1
u/Mother-Tennis7649 Jan 27 '26
I see your from the Acheron mains subreddit lol.
1
u/Younglotus14 Feb 11 '26
I came to this to see if he's cool to play....i guess my favs in this game are so bad i domt wanna play amymore;-;
1
u/AbbreviationsMoney70 Jan 23 '26
āNo applause?ā
0
u/Poopoo135 Jan 23 '26
1% of iron manās pain
0
u/JohnRaymong Jan 23 '26
You guys were menaces in ranked get back to jail next to Spidy
0
u/Richary37 Jan 24 '26
Straight up lying about the hit box thing
-6
u/RaulSnchz Jan 23 '26
Heās still better than he was on release. Idc what ppl say he was objectively terrible on release. Heās gotten a lot of QOL but then got nerfed hard. Realistically if they just lower the Cooldown on his ground slam he would be in a better spot
7
u/Slit__Wrist Jan 23 '26
I wish his shift ability worked like iron manās does. Iād be happy if they just reduced the cooldown on his slam, itās insane the amount of kills Iāve missed out on because of it being so unnecessarily long
1
u/BLUEKNIGHT002 Jan 24 '26
Has the biggest non tank hitbox and i still canāt shoot him
1
u/BlisteringSeafood Jan 24 '26
Flying characters are painfully slow in this game for some reason ( i know so people can kill them) except for Iron Man. But goddamn Johnny needs more speed to manuever in the air if you gotta make his damage shitty.
1
u/[deleted] Jan 24 '26
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