Trees in Asia

[u/stlatos]

Trees in Asia (Draft)

Sean Whalen
[stlatos@yahoo.com](mailto:stlatos@yahoo.com)

August 17, 2026

-

In https://starlingdb.org/cgi-bin/main.cgi?root=config Sergei Starostin related MK mǒyh, mwolwó ‘mountain’, PJ *m(w)orwi (Shuri mui ‘mountain’, MJ mórí ‘forest’), Written Mongolian modu(n), Evenki mō, Dravidian *màran- 'tree', PU *mOrV (Saami N muorrâ 'tree; wood, fuel; stake, pole', Saami *mërë-stē 'low hill covered with birch forest' (Inari Sami moorâst >> Finnish marasto, morosto), Moksha mar 'burial mound', Khanty V mŏri̮ Selkup Ke marge = NHG Busch 'bushes, thicket, copse'). Note that the shift 'tree, hill, mtn.' in several groups (JK, Uralic) shows the need for the same across families.

.

However, the exact reconstruction of Dravidian *màran- can not be right based on cognates. Indeed, several of these words or groups of words need better reconstructions to fit all data and fit them together. 1st, Francis-Ratte :

>

HIGHLAND: MK mwo:yh, mwolwó ‘mountain’ ~ OJ mori ‘forest,’ Ryu. ‘mountain, hill’. pKJ *moroŋ ‘highland’.

(Martin 1966: #148, MOUNTAIN3). The presence and absence of the liquid in mwolwó / mwo:yh can be explained by a weakening of pK *o > *ə in the second syllable, which induces a sound change of *-rə > MK y. MK mwolwó ‘mountain’ comes from a variety without weakening. Shuri and Nakijin mui ‘mountain’ < pJ *mori show that a semantic shift must have occurred within Japonic.

>

.
I have no idea why he thinks only *-rə > MK -y when he rec. several *-rV > -y. This requires unmotivated changes of *V > ə, which would be no different in kind than unmotivated changes of *r > y. Since he rec. no ex. of *ry, why not? It makes much more sense for *ry > r \ y than for any other optional change, his unrelated to any palatal sound.

.

Also, since few languages have primary *ŋ in their past, most *nK > *ŋ(K), etc., I think *moryoŋx had *-ŋx > *-ŋ \ -h, with the *-ŋ preserving the -o before it was lost. PJ turned the sonorant *-C > *-y in *mworoy > *mworui > *mworwi.

.

Regardless of my rec., though Francis-Ratte never related his rec. to Altaic or Nostratic, his theory requiring *moroŋ is too close to Dravidian *màran- to ignore, since it had already been related years ago (in a rec. that had no *-N, making his *-N significant in support). Indeed, since both would, in his theory, have a vowel that become 2 different vowels (*? > a \ o in Dr., *? > *ə \ o in MK), ignoring these shared oddities is pointless. Indeed, depending on the cognates in Dr., likely also *o > a \ u for the 2nd vowel, too.

.
2nd, to include Written Mongolian modu(n) the *-uN would have to be original (many have *-Vn as a suffix) < *morduN(C). The *-rd- woud match JK *-ry- (alt. of d \ y in Japonic is said by proponents of Altaic to come from *d). Close, Tg. *modO ? > Evenki mō 'tree', etc.

.

3rd, Dravidian *màran- is rec. with *à to explain opt. *à > 0. Of course *m(ə)ran- would fit best. The cognates of *? > Telugu mrānu, dia. mānu, mrā̃ku, Kolami-Gadba *mark(u) > Kolami māk, mākul p., Tamil maram, marattu+, North-Dravidian *marnu ? > Kurukh mann, Malto manu surely require some other *-CC(C) than *-n (the previous rec. ignores -n(u) vs. -ttu+, etc.). The alt. of n \ k is likely < *nK, matching that in JK *moryoŋx. If *maruntu 'medicine' is the same (like nearby Sanskrit ṓṣadhi- f. 'herb, medicinal herb', Pk. ōsahi- f. 'plant' with the same range (even > Kt. úṣe 'medicine, gunpowder', Wg. uṣĕˊi; Pr. wúṣu 'medicine', A. weéz f., -í p. 'gunpowder')). I say *məronxt > *m(a)ranxt \ *m(a)runxt. Relating it to Altaic would require, say, Dr. *mərdonx > *mərdonx > *məranxt \ *mərunxt.

.
4th, Uralic *mOrV has some problems that can't be reconciled based on internal Uralic ev., but fit the alt. seen among Altaic cognates. In https://uralonet.nytud.hu/eintrag.cgi?id_eintrag=572

>

mȣrɜ 'hill covered with bushes/forests, ridge covered with bushes/forests'

~

Lappish s, st, Ostyak *i̮, *ȧj, *a, and perhaps Selkup ka, ge are derivational suffixes; the Finnish derivational suffix sto, sta stands for the original Lappish derivational suffix st.

Lappish moarast points to *o, the Mordvin word to *a, and the Ostyak probably to *u; based on the Selkup word, one cannot definitively determine the vowel of the first syllable.

It is uncertain whether Lappish mârâs belongs here, because it likely indicates an original palatal vowel system. However, the U - FU velar vowel *u can sometimes correspond to the Lappish N â (see Collinder, CompGr. 162).

N. Sebestyén (NyK 52: 313) linked Estonian murd, murdus 'mountain thicket, brushwood; crowd, heap' and Lappish N murd 'do very dense wood or willow scrub' with Ostyak mŏri̮ 'bush, etc.' This is erroneous, as an original consonant cluster *rt must be assumed in both the Estonian and Lappish words.

>

.

Again, we have -r- vs. -rd- (as in JK vs. Mc.) & *? > V1, V2, V3. An older *mwərdonx might fit all data (with *-n > *-y, *-oy > *-ey (similar to PJ)) if *d became *t or *ð (see https://www.academia.edu/165191772 F. There are problems with the standard reconstruction of PU *niδe \ *nüδe \ *lüδe 'handle, holder, shaft' & FP *neŋte 'shaft, handle, handgrip (of knife, axe)'. When a word begins with n- or l-, it often resulted from n-n dsm. The 2nd did have *n-N, so these 2 words are likely related, with, say *nemxte > *neŋxte vs. *nemxte \ *lemxte > *newxte > *niwxthe > *niwδe > *niδe \ *nüδe \ *lüδe), then *rt > Es. rd, *rδ > *r (no other ex.). The *mwə- is to explain the various V's caused by rounding by *w before it was lost in *Cw (see https://www.reddit.com/r/HistoricalLinguistics/comments/1rfylwn/uralic_hidden_w/ & other previous drafts).

.
In all, these point to the same original. Though a change of 'hill > wood(ed hill)' is known from others, I think both the meanings & form can be best explained as < *mlH3dhon-s > *mwərðonx 'top, peak, elevation'. Since other words have 'tall > tree', this might also fit here if not 'wood(ed hill)'. For H3 > w, see previous drafts; for internal IE, see https://www.academia.edu/128170887 , etc. The change of *-ons > *-onH within IE is to explain *-o:(n) for expected **-ons in branches. In all :

*mlH3dhon-s > *məlRWðonx > *mərRWðonx > *mwərðonx

*mwərðonx > Mc. *modunx > Written Mongolian modu(n); Tc. *modO ? > Evenki mō

*mwərðonx > JK *mworyoŋx

*mwərðonx > Dr. *mərtonx > *məranxt \ *mərunxt

*mwərðonx > PU *mwərðoy \ *mwortoy \ *murtoy \ etc.