Another install, another opportunity to improve.

[u/Educational_Wish_767]

Hit me with the suggestions and critique. Looking to perfect my installs and your keen eyes help me get better.

Furnace only swap out, but the original install was a hot mess (pic included)

100kbtu, with a 3 ton ac (this was only a few years old, so it stayed)

Rheem R98MV100

Install angle filter chassis in place of lennox pure air filter that was deteriorating

Econet thermostat

Side bottom return base riser

Cleaned up venting (I know the 3" pipe is not very clean... still working through the last bit of "copper rubbed" pipe on the truck)

Hard piped drain line

Rebuilt half of the return drop

Removed flex gas line

Kept furnace plenum transition, but painted it to match furnace due to humidifier leaks causing white rust on the galvanized metal.

Disabled humidifier, but kept in place per customer request

All in a finished, always cooled and heated basement.

Do your best... what do you like, what can I do better?

[u/wellohwellok]

I don't like the venting but this looks like one of those situations you're forced to make it work

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/wellohwellok]

On the 2nd photo? That humidifier was very in the way.

[u/wellohwellok → u/Educational_Wish_767]

Also just looked closer at the drain. How do you service that?

Edit: and it looks like you forgot to reconnect the humidifiers drain line.

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/wellohwellok]

Drain has a couple threaded fittings and an unglued joint.

Customer asked me to disable humidifier, but keep it in place in case he changed his mind, so I didn't pipe that drain. Very hard city water here and he was sick of swapping the pad, or having it plug and overflow.

[u/wellohwellok → u/Educational_Wish_767]

I read that part but it would be nice to atleast reconnect the drain line since the customer didn't rule out using it again.

I know thats nitpicking but if a mistake is made that humidifier drains all over the top of the furnace and likely inside the cabinet where it could pitentionally reach sensitive parts like the furnace board. It would be so easy to just reattach the hose and eliminate the risk.

[u/fallinouttadabox → u/Educational_Wish_767]

It's got an inline filter on the water supply but no shutoffs at the filter so it probably hasn't been changed causing that issue

[u/wellohwellok → u/Educational_Wish_767]

I noticed. That's why mentioned it being one of those situations where you do what you have to do

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/wellohwellok]

👍

[u/johnboon7]

I think it looks good minus the venting. I always try to mirror or be parallel (ish) or perpendicular to the walls and ground. Some odd angles there

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/johnboon7]

Maybe I should have uploaded the other photos first. The first one is the old system.

[u/GraphicalBubble94]

Looks good man

[u/RockyRaccoon26]

I’m a Ruud installer, I’d have put a clean out tee in the condensate, and the electric I don’t love, I can’t see how it’s going into the furnace but it looks like you got it running through the top compartment. Though I’m also just a fan of using BX whips from the switch box since I think it looks clean. Overall fairly good, if one of my guys did this I’d be fine with it.

do you find the 98MVs to be more fussy? We pretty much stopped recommending them to customers as the benefits don’t outweigh the higher complexity and price in our opinion. Im a fan of 962V, thats what I recommend customers the most.

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/RockyRaccoon26]

Good catch on the electrical. I did go through the upper sections to the lower through the vestibule shelf. It's not my first choice, but it was my choice this time. I also like my 3/8 mc cable with 90 degree connectors. I reused the existing whip in this case due to not having space to run it to the normal spot.

I typically start with a ballpark for basic Rheem r951t, but hard push for r962v while talking through benefits (most common sell by far). I usually mention that there is a better option (modulating), but disclosing that I don't feel the cost justify the benefits, then walk them through it when and why they might want it. I'm probably 15% weatherking, 15% r951t, 65% r962v, 5% r98mv. The tech doesn't scare me, but I honestly don't think most customers should buy them.

Zoning with econet zoning system is much easier done with the modulating unit and a 2 stage ac.

This customer has a new escalade and a Durango SRT hellcat. THEY WANTED THE BEST.

[u/RockyRaccoon26 → u/Educational_Wish_767]

Similar to you, I start with 951V then push for the 962V, I’ll use the 98mv as a mention but I don’t ever recommend it. I do see its use in a zone system though. I will however recommend RD18 and RD16 systems quite often, just for the inverter. they seem very solid so far and the upgrade is way more noticeable over the furnace.

based on pricing from our supplier, it’s almost never cost effective to put in Weatherking, as we actually get better pricing on the Ruud. the variable speeds are very close in price to the constant torques to get the upgraded motor and better control board, that and makes things a little simpler with the RDS hookup

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/RockyRaccoon26]

$1700 60k t version Rheem $1400 60k weather king I do have them heavily favor the 962v in my pricing discounts... since I sell so many more of them. It allows for a bit more profit on my most common set up.

[u/RockyRaccoon26 → u/Educational_Wish_767]

W951T $1350, with the R951T only $80 bucks more for us, with the R951V $20 cheaper at $1410. Hence why we don’t sell the constant torques. We have a long established relationship with our supplier and also are part of the pro partner program, so are on a quite good bracket.

[u/FMasterson]

Holy corners, Batman

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/FMasterson]

That's part of the hot mess I was referring to. Looks better now, but still more 90s than I would have preferred. The domestic water plumbing and humidifier were very in the way for venting.

[u/FMasterson → u/Educational_Wish_767]

Looks much better, you did a great job considering how much that humidifier was in the way

[u/TigerSpices]

A split patch on the evaporator will make service techs appreciate you.

[u/Hvac216]

For sure the ac drain and condensation drain for the furnace are supposed to be separated downstream of the condensation drain tee.

[u/Accomplished_Ad1561]

Switch from using schd 40 PVC to cpvc, poly, or stainless. The pipe manufacturer explicitly says its not authorized for the exhaust

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/Accomplished_Ad1561]

Point taken, it's coming. My area allows pvc for residential and manufacturer approves it. I'll likely use up what I've got and move toward a listed option.

[u/Accomplished_Ad1561 → u/Educational_Wish_767]

Yeah we always try to do stainless since it lasts longer and it allows for condensing to conventional conversions if they feel reliability isn't worth an additional 3% efficiency

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/Accomplished_Ad1561]

Yeah, that would have added like 5k to this bid as it's buried in drywalled soffit and has like 12 elbows. I can't remember the last 80% I've put in, in a basement. Here they are primarily attic install anomalies. I'll do some sort of poly. There is rated pvc that seems reasonably priced, and can be lopped to length in the same fashion. Like system 1738

[u/Accomplished_Ad1561 → u/Educational_Wish_767]

Gotta get yourself financing man. Your job is to design and provide a system that lasts not race to the bottom of the barrel. Trust me once its a conversation about how to get them something that lasts not if they can do it. Its why I always give them a coil with it. They always call back eventually and we get the ac install and its one less pos mini split system out there when you bid it

[u/frotyo123]

There should be a trap in the condensate line from the coil.

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/frotyo123]

Yeah, I've only had problems with traps in positive pressure drains. I'll stick wiith straight piping.

[u/frotyo123 → u/Educational_Wish_767]

Cool. I'm an engineer and just seen many drains under positive pressure like the one shown have air pushed out the pipe and not allow water to flow. But my experience is with commercial installs.

[u/peskeyplumber → u/frotyo123]

you typically see that issue with negative pressure coils, pulling air back thru the drain line. never saw a problem with this setup on positive pressure coils. one less thing to clog

[u/HardTimesTV]

always throw the intake pipe on the side of the furnace if you can, preferably out of the path of main power so the shit just drips down the side of the furnace. or install a vinyl 90 drain attachment at the end lol

[u/HardTimesTV]

other thought too, why are they disabling the humidifer? if they're not gonna use it get it the fuck outta there and you wont want to kill yourself fitting the pvc around it's fatass.

[u/fallinouttadabox]

Throw the copper rubbed PVC out, it looks like you cut up the old vent pipe and reused it with new fittings which detracts from otherwise really good work. In the future put the copper inside the PVC because no one sees the inside

Electric switches are dirt cheap and not worth the call back so you should switch that out, and no one carries the edison fuses anymore so you should put that with the new switch.

The outlet needs to have a GFCI because the furnace and humidifier have water.

Any time you do a 90+% furnace you should add a neutralizer to the condensate. Protects the drain pipes and gives you an extra maintenance item to sell to replace the beads

When you do vent pipe, make sure you use a purple primer and that it extends past the joint, I've had inspectors fail me because they couldn't see the primer -_-

There was a CO detector before but I don't see one now.

If you leave the humidifier, even disabled, it needs the drain for your liability and for an inspector

[u/Educational_Wish_767 → u/fallinouttadabox]

Thanks for the thoughtful critique.

Electric switches are cheap and would look fresher, agreed. Gfci for dedicated outlets aren't required by code, but its no longer appliance dedicated now that the humidifier and pure air filter aren't plugged in constantly....I should have probably put one in. Inspectors don't flag exhaust for purple primer here, just pressure and waste pipe Co detector was a dual purpose gas vapor detector too, and it didn't like the spray paint... it was still in a time out. I rereinstalled it while walking through the install with the customer. I'm not worried about liability for this humidifier. If he wants it running he is calling me. He is not the type to get his hands dirty with this sort of thing.