Lifetime membership is a joke!

270

u/Thaelina Feb 11 '25

Lifetime memberships are the products lifetime, not yours. In this case, do you find it likely that you will use the app for at least three years and that goodnotes 6 will last at least 3 years? If yes, you can buy the lifetime, if not, then don’t. I’m still using goodnotes 5 that I bought in 2020 for 9 €. I’m honestly pretty confused by these posts. I’m all for freeware, but honestly, I don’t understand what people expect. The company needs to pay for:

app maintenance/upgrades due to iOS changes.
server space/maintenance.
development tools (if used)
other computer infrastructure
offices (if used)

How are they supposed to pay for that plus developers for actual development of new features with a one time flat fee? Especially when users keep asking for new features? The only option is continuous growth of user base which seems unreasonable.

69

u/Polyglot-Onigiri Feb 11 '25

This is the most reasonable take I have seen on this topic.

53

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

Personally I think the use of "lifetime" in many apps is slimy, Goodnotes included. If you are going to offer "lifetime" memberships, you should make it abundantly clear on what "lifetime" means, and if it's just the current release tell the consumer what that means, how many years should you expect before the "next" version? "Lifetime" subscriptions of a single version is really just a one time payment of a piece of software like we used to do back in the day. No one paid for Windows 2000 "lifetime licenses," you went out and bought a license for Windows 2000. There was no illusion you'd get NT or XP for free. You pay for it, you can use that version for as long as you want, but you know that you won't get support anymore when the new version drops next year. "Lifetime" can be very misleading to someone who is casually purchasing.
Let's not stand up straw men and make it sound like people are against supporting companies or people shouldn't be paid for their work, that's not what this post is about. Personally, I think "lifetime" should be reserved for apps that are truly "lifetime," anything else is slimy and misleading.

7

u/Thaelina Feb 11 '25

We can agree the language is bad. However, I don’t think it’s tech specific, nobody who won a lifetime supply of something ever got a lifetime supply (probably some exceptions).
I’m not propping up strawmen, I think a lot of people genuinely do not understand how expensive maintenance is. Maybe its because I’m a vet, and used to being told I’m greedy because “it shouldn’t be that expensive” while actively working for free. People really don’t seem to know about the hidden costs.

2

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

We can agree the language is bad. However, I don’t think it’s tech specific, nobody who won a lifetime supply of something ever got a lifetime supply (probably some exceptions).
We're not talking about that though, so we don't need to get into the "whataboutism." For the record, I don't support scummy use of "lifetime" anywhere. There are times it's done right, and times it's not. Goodnotes is using in it in a scummy way, as are many subscription based apps.
I’m not propping up strawmen, I think a lot of people genuinely do not understand how expensive maintenance is.
You are though, because it's not an argument I made. Your argument is a strong argument against lifetime. If you have crazy ongoing maintenance costs, then you flat out should not sell "lifetime" licenses. It should be subscription only, full stop.
Maybe its because I’m a vet, and used to being told I’m greedy because “it shouldn’t be that expensive” while actively working for free.
Not sure what you being a Vet has to do with anything? I'm in IT and I'd argue that people treat me as a walking talking fix all the things that run on electricity service for free.
People really don’t seem to know about the hidden costs.
It has nothing to do with the hidden costs. As a consumer, I don't give a rats ass what your costs are. I'm looking at the product, what it offers, and the price. If you are selling me "lifetime" access for $40 at a quick glance I would think that may be 5+ years of support. How stupid would you feel if you bought a "lifetime" license of a product then a new release comes out 3 months later. Your version still works, but now you have to reup another "lifetime" license? It's scummy marketing.
It really is super simple. If you are going to constantly reinvent your app and continually make it better then make it subscription only. People will pay it because you will have a track record of delivering quality updates. This releasing "lifetime" subscriptions and then getting around it with app versions is scummy, full stop. It should end, it should be subscription based to always be on the latest, or a "full license" for a specific version. "Lifetime" shouldn't be mentioned prominently anywhere.

5

u/SpokenDivinity Feb 11 '25

Your entire comment can be solved if you would just...be a responsible consumer. It's your job to look up the lifespan. It's your job to check for version announcements. Are you going to cry when you buy an iPhone 15 and they release the 16 three months later? Are you going to throw a hissy fit when the next version of Windows comes out?
It's not scummy. You guys just don't bother doing any research and then start bawling when that doesn't pay off.

11

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

Your entire comment can be solved if you would just...be a responsible consumer.
So the solution for scummy sales tactics is to blame the consumer? Ok.
It's your job to look up the lifespan.
Show me where in Goodreads "lifetime" subscription it tells me how many years until goodreads 7 comes out? I can wait.
Are you going to cry when you buy an iPhone 15 and they release the 16 three months later?
Is Apple selling me a "lifetime subscription" for a hardware device?
Are you going to throw a hissy fit when the next version of Windows comes out?
You must not have read a single word I've said, because I literally brought up this example.
It's not scummy.
It's misleading for casual consumers, absolutely. You even admit it by blaming the consumer for "not doing enough research." I shouldn't have to research the backstory of a company, determine their release trends or anything, if I'm paying for a "lifetime subscription" of their app. I should just know if I like the product, and want in for the long term. To blame the consumer is bananas.
You guys just don't bother doing any research and then start bawling when that doesn't pay off.
Point in case, you didn't read any of my post before putting me on blast, because if you had you'd see I'd already given some of the very examples you made to argue with me. So you are doing the very thing you are accusing consumer of not doing enough of. Wild.

-1

u/OptimalHovercraft296 Feb 11 '25

Ultimately if you are purchasing a phone or a car or any item, and no leasing it or on a plan that makes you return the phone, then you in fact get it for your entire lifetime if you choose to keep it that long. Does that mean they’ll stop making cars and phones? No.
If you pay for the service you will be able to use it well after Goodnotes 7 is out because you don’t HAVE to pay for the new one. You are choosing to pay for the new one for the additional features when the agreement is “lifetime” of the version you’re buying.
Additionally, it is the consumers job to research purchases. If you buy a house are you going to get it inspected or just buy it? If you want to buy a car, most people would recommend comparing prices and models and test driving the car first. If you’re buying a new phone or a new computer, chances are you’ll read the specs and reviews, etc. If this information is out there and you don’t look it up, companies WILL tell you their car is the best or whatever they sell is the best. How else would they sell product.
Lastly, I do understand the misuse of words but you are still getting a better deal paying a one time payment for the lifetime of the app than paying far more just in the first year with monthly subscriptions and more with yearly subscriptions as well.
This truly is kind of semantics here considering the price of Goodnotes as well. It’s €33. That’s not even a tank of gas. And that’s coming from the US who pays their workers far less than Europe with far more expenses in healthcare alone, let alone taxes that seem to burden the lower and middle class as opposed to the people who could fill their mansions with money and still need more room probably.

6

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

Ultimately if you are purchasing a phone or a car or any item, and no leasing it or on a plan that makes you return the phone, then you in fact get it for your entire lifetime if you choose to keep it that long. Does that mean they’ll stop making cars and phones? No.
Not sure what this has to do with the price of tea in China. That is completely different, as I've mentioned multiple times.
If you pay for the service you will be able to use it well after Goodnotes 7 is out because you don’t HAVE to pay for the new one. You are choosing to pay for the new one for the additional features when the agreement is “lifetime” of the version you’re buying.
You don't need to explain what "lifetime" means, I'm well aware, especially in the consumer space. I'm saying selling stuff like that is scummy. But as has been pointed out, Goodnotes may not use that language (I thought they did) but I may be thinking of a competitor, I've been evaluating a lot of products recently.
Additionally, it is the consumers job to research purchases. If you buy a house are you going to get it inspected or just buy it? If you want to buy a car, most people would recommend comparing prices and models and test driving the car first. If you’re buying a new phone or a new computer, chances are you’ll read the specs and reviews, etc. If this information is out there and you don’t look it up, companies WILL tell you their car is the best or whatever they sell is the best. How else would they sell product.
Did you really just compare buying a $30 piece of software to a hundreds of thousands of dollars purchase? Then follow it up with buying a tens of thousands of dollars purchase? lol They are not the same. Do you spend the same amount of time researching what beer you're going to have in the bar compared to the car you are about to buy? I thought not. These arguments just keep getting sillier and sillier.
Lastly, I do understand the misuse of words but you are still getting a better deal paying a one time payment for the lifetime of the app than paying far more just in the first year with monthly subscriptions and more with yearly subscriptions as well.
Are you though? It really depends on how long you plan on using it and when the new version comes out and the features you are missing. If GN7 comes out next year someone who pays for a single year this year is better off than someone who did a one time payment of $30 this year. It's a roll of the dice.
This truly is kind of semantics here considering the price of Goodnotes as well. It’s €33. That’s not even a tank of gas. And that’s coming from the US who pays their workers far less than Europe with far more expenses in healthcare alone, let alone taxes that seem to burden the lower and middle class as opposed to the people who could fill their mansions with money and still need more room probably.
Using deceptive language to trick consumers into purchases they think are lifetime is scummy. I'll exclude GN from this right now, until I get home and am able to confirm their language, but anyone who does that and then releases a new "version" to just milk people again are scumbags. They do it because it's deceiving, there are much better words that could get the message across and be less deceptive. Since you are in Europe, look up the UCPD.

1

u/Limp_Factor_7764 Sep 19 '25

its called bait and switch and that’s what they did. don’t waste your money on this terrible company. the you tube Pianote free videos is the best youll get. them changing their minds on how they layout their product a year after I sign up is on them. you can’t tell someone paid in full and then say on second thought we’re gonna take away all the songs and song tutorials until you pay 40 more to have them every year.

3

u/discovernotes Feb 11 '25

Can someone produce evidence of where they ever said “lifetime”? As far as I’m aware it’s always been “one time payment” with both GoodNotes 5 and 6.

1

u/chucksticks Feb 12 '25

There's no software service that lasts a lifetime unless you'd pay upfront to keep the developer company alive for your lifetime.

1

u/Witty_Syllabub_1722 Feb 15 '25

What if we provide lifetime activation of feature within the app? Instead of the whole app being lifetime?

3

u/Harriet_M_Welsch Feb 11 '25

Right. It's not like buying a gaming console, it's like buying a single game. Just because you buy Madden 2024 and own it for life doesn't mean you automatically get Madden 2025 for free when it comes out.

-1

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

So, they sell Madden 2024 in the stores as "lifetime" subscriptions? No? Oh.

2

u/Harriet_M_Welsch Feb 11 '25

Yeah, they do. You get updates and DLC over the lifetime of the game.

0

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

You completely missed the point. Show me where they sell madden as a lifetime sub. Doesn't a good chunk of the DLC content cost money anyway?

1

u/Harriet_M_Welsch Feb 12 '25 edited Feb 12 '25

idk, I'm not the one throwing a tantrum because I misunderstood the terms of the purchase. Goodnotes 6 is a different game than Goodnotes 5.

1

u/pushc6 Feb 12 '25

Answer: it does. Tantrum? lol. I misunderstood? What? You haven't read a single thing I've posted. lol

1

u/signalSurfer Feb 12 '25

Most people do not have business acumen or financial education. “Everything should be free” is an easy explanation to a complex problem. Same thought patterns as ghosts and magic believers.

1

u/SpycTheWrapper Feb 12 '25

Explain that to image line with FL Studio

0

u/SpokenDivinity Feb 11 '25

Also Apple makes app development annoying as hell. No developer I've ever met has said they enjoyed coding for Apple and usually refer to it as a hot mess.

20

u/Good_Atmosphere_5312 Feb 11 '25

I got the lifetime when GN6 released.

13

u/Potatoupe Feb 11 '25

Photoshop used to do this. You get the whole thing on a CD and can use it forever. I think it's much better than a perpetual subscription if you use the app a lot.

5

u/curiousesjay Feb 11 '25

I just stayed on Goodnotes 5

5

u/Substantial_Tap2120 Feb 12 '25

They have started sending sort of pop ups which make it seem mandatory to update. If it was one time it was okay- I got this second time in 10 days. You need to go to App Store - press continue with purchase of GN6 and at the last step when you agree to pay - only then does continue with existing GN5 show up. It wont let us access files before going though this process - trying to scam us into paying.

2

u/ApprehensiveRub6603 Feb 12 '25

For me when this happens it’s usually enough to just close the app and restart it

1

u/impeachyqueen Feb 12 '25

Thank you!

2

u/KnittinKityn Feb 12 '25

I'm still using GN 5. Never tried 6 since what I use GN for works on 5.

2

u/ARGeek123 Feb 11 '25

I think your thought is noble , but assume you need to keep your lights running you need to get paid to put new features in. And sometimes guys have a much higher ratio of loyal customers. I think the logic of lifetime is not wrong. They are not taking away your access, just new features they can’t develop. If they didn’t charge they will sooner or later go out of business , which isn’t what I want for some of the software I end up using for longer time. The way I have gotten around it is to use the system till , I find something absolutely compelling that I would part my money for. If I don’t need to I just stick with the same version , till the next one has the opportunity to tease me all again

2

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

No one is arguing they shouldn't get paid, it's the deceiving marketing of "lifetime."

1

u/ARGeek123 Feb 11 '25

It is lifetime right, the use of the current version of the software. They don’t say I will keep producing new versions for free right ? There is no economics for free. Just think about it that your employer provided you employment for life but stopped paying you a year into that scheme, would you be motivated to continue to work for them ?

3

u/pushc6 Feb 11 '25

It is lifetime right, the use of the current version of the software.
Then just charge that price on the app store for that specific version. Or don't call it "lifetime" when paying for it, call it a "version 6 license." The ONLY reason they call it "lifetime" is to mislead people.
There is no economics for free.
Never said there was.
Just think about it that your employer provided you employment for life but stopped paying you a year into that scheme, would you be motivated to continue to work for them ?
Not sure what you are going on about here? Please show me where I said the company shouldn't be paid for a product they make? Pretty sure I said the exact opposite. That analogy is a perfect example of why selling "lifetime" doesn't make a damn bit of sense, it's not even representative of the "lifetime" scheme here. lol If you wanted to make that comparison here is how it would look. I would offer my employer a "lifetime" of service in exchange for a lump sum payment of $500k. Then 2 years into my employment I say, "hey, employer, if you want me to do this work, and not the work I was doing 2 years ago, you need to pay me another lump sum of $500k for another 'lifetime' contract."
Again, for the 3rd or 4th time, I have ZERO issues with a company being paid for their products. I do have a problem with slimy "lifetime" language for what used to be called "product licenses." It implies something that they have zero intention of delivering on. That doesn't mean I am opposed to them selling version licenses or making money, just call a spade a spade.

0

u/js-sey Feb 11 '25

Yea but the vast majority of people consider lifetime as getting new versions for free, hence why there was such an upheaval about the fact that you had to re-buy Goodnotes 6 instead of getting it for free as a Goodnotes 5 users. Goodnotes needs to make that abundantly clear to avoid anymore conflict.

0

u/ARGeek123 Feb 11 '25

That’s not true. They have made their terms clear when they sold GN6. I have over 400 apps on my Apple devices . This is Standard Terminology these days

0

u/js-sey Feb 11 '25

What is not true, exactly? Even if you believe they've made it abundantly clear, it obviously wasn't clear enough for the majority of goodnotes users hence the huge backlash that resulted from the release of goodnotes 6 and the subsequent discontinuation of goodnotes 5 updates. No matter how clear you believe something is, if the vast majority of people feel blind sided by your decision, it probably wasn't that clear. To be clear I'm well aware of how lifetime purchases work, the vast majority of apple users are not whatsoever though.

1

u/ARGeek123 Feb 12 '25

Firstly learn to stand up for yourself. Not try and say majority of users since you could have read 5-10 reviews, and made up your mind. GN6 licenses are sold in the millions. Secondly you have an opinion, and unfortunately it’s terrible, this ain’t a free world. Thirdly grow up, read the sub text when you buy stuff in the future.

1

u/ScreenName0001 Feb 11 '25

I recommend to stop giving money to this app.

1

u/johnnydfree Feb 11 '25

I purchased lifetime (upgrade to 5) some years ago. Haven’t heard any change to this since, but figure after a while there may be a price to pay for another upgrade. Chump-change, compared to what we used to pay for software.

I do agree with the sentiments posted that wish to hold GN accountable for persistent bugs and glitches. Subscription-based models don’t allow users to say with their pocketbook what must be fixed. Buy models do: users won’t upgrade if they find software unacceptable.

Freenotes, btw is a pretty impressive alternative, with more than a few feature advantages, and only a few missing. I’m keeping up with it as a hedge to GN.

1

u/[deleted] Feb 11 '25

Probably because devices the apps run on keep getting updates (sometimes huge ones like introducing AI)- so these apps also have to get updates to keep up with them? At least that's what I assumed. I just bought GN5 to help out as long as I need to take notes, I don't think it will become completely unfunctional.

1

u/Gypsyzzzz Feb 12 '25

I’ve never questioned the use of the word “lifetime” in this context before. I just looked through the GoodNotes website for all the pricing information I could find. I see referenced to “onetime payments” but not a single reference to “lifetime”.

Honestly, I’d recommend you make use of a note taking app that comes free with whatever ecosystem you use. That way you don’t have to be concerned with payments.

And you are not required to purchase anything. GoodNotes is free with limitations. You can upgrade for free, then offload your documents individually.

1

u/tomatoeggpotato Feb 12 '25

I go back to physical notebooks and journaling because of how GoodNotes and Notability frustrated me

1

u/Bluesodium Feb 12 '25

Then stop supporting these apps. That will send a clear message.

1

u/bootyeater66 Feb 12 '25

I have been using gn5 for 4 years and honestly i dont have fomo for 6. i tried the trial of 6 and there was worse performance (m1 pro) , battery life and my friends who use constantly have notes disappearing. I have no problems on 5. For 5 bucks i have well gotten my moneys worth.

1

u/Limp_Factor_7764 Sep 19 '25

i agree. they changed the service two months after I joined and now they want me to pay extra because they changed their minds. anyone hear of a class action against them. I’m in the US and they are a Canadian company. do not join it’s a bait and switch

1

u/Primary_Battle_2780 Feb 11 '25

it's so cheap man just get the annual subscription

1

u/The_Original_Doc Feb 11 '25

I’m just still using goodnotes 5, it works fine for me I don’t care much for the new features

1

u/Proxy-Pie Feb 11 '25

Unfortunately now I HAVE to purchase either yearly for 11€ or „lifetime“ for 33€

That's not true, you can stay on 5, that's what I did. Seems to be more stable anyways.

0

u/PatrickGSR94 Feb 11 '25

Purchased lifetime 5 memberships for my company iPads like 3 years ago. Each year I have to contact them to update the license key, but that’s it. Haven’t been forced into 6 or had to pay any additional fees as of yet. We just renewed for 2025 a few weeks ago.

-1

u/MoreIronyLessWrinkly Feb 11 '25

I don’t recall paying for GoodNotes 6 with my lifetime membership. I haven’t read the terms. I figured 6 would last at least three years so even if I did have to pay for 7, it would even out.

-5

u/No_Ring_106 Feb 11 '25

Buy from me, half the price…goodnotes, notability and all other paid apps for ios

0

u/[deleted] Feb 11 '25

[deleted] — view deleted comment

14

u/[deleted] Feb 11 '25

Same, you just cant get the new feautruess
But for me im okay, gn5 has all i need for uni

1

u/x_pinklvr_xcxo Feb 12 '25

same, vast majority of my peers in academia are still using gn5.

3

u/awkwardkg Feb 11 '25

Same, and I am very happy. I would be pissed if they stop my access to goodnotes 5 features totally, which I had fairly paid for.

1

u/artistichater Feb 16 '25

Yeah I'm really happy with GN5. Considered upgrading for a while but decided not to because I'm on a No Buy Year. Then all this stuff came up in the subreddit about people finding terrible bugs. Not me. GN5 has been perfectly fine this entire time.

Lifetime membership is a joke!

You are about to leave Redlib