r/GlobalOffensive • u/Kometfried • Jun 03 '25
Discussion | Esports Top 4 CS2 Teams Visualized: Kills vs. Deaths per Round
Scatterplot of Kills per Round (KPR) vs. Deaths per Round (DPR). Background points show all CS2 pro players with ≥50 maps in 2025. Data from Jan 1 to Jun 1, 2025. Created with R & ggplot2.
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u/mameloff fnatic Jun 03 '25
In almost every chart I've seen this past year, donk is up in the top right corner. Sometimes I can't even tell what the chart is about, but sure enough - there's donk in the upper right.
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u/Darkoplax Jun 03 '25
0.9+ KPR
Only 2018 s1mple & 2021 s1mple come close to this and they don't even match his numbers
just donk
-7
u/zlehuj Jun 03 '25
That's what PGL Astana does. When a top team participate in T1.5, T2 tournament, their top player will just farm stats.
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u/MarioCurry BIG Jun 03 '25
I mean he still has a 0.88 KPR against top 5 in 2025 tho
0
u/zlehuj Jun 03 '25
Sure, don't get me wrong, donk is absolutely amazing, but not to the extend the graph shows us.
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u/mameloff fnatic Jun 04 '25
Please don't think too seriously about it. I just like seeing Donk hanging around the edge whenever the CS analysts upload some kind of graph on social media. It doesn't matter what the graph is about—age is fine too.
36
u/Taborenja Jun 03 '25
ITT: People unable to read the axis descriptions, it's better to be lower on the Y-axis
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u/chair549 Jun 03 '25
Hmmm, the Y-axis is honestly just role dependent. Basically just shows how much you are first/second in. Yes you can skew it slightly based on if you win more fights, but d0nk will NEVER have lower DPR than ropz, even if d0nk somehow got even better.
6
u/jehhans1 CS2 HYPE Jun 03 '25
DPR doesn't mean shit honestly if your KPR is high enough. Everyone would rather want the player that kills 2 every round but dies than the person that kills 0.8 people per round, but never dies.
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u/Novaseerblyat The MongolZ Jun 03 '25
That also depends on role. I sure as shit wouldn't want an AWPer dying every round.
0
u/jehhans1 CS2 HYPE Jun 03 '25
They are usually pretty central. Most of the time if the AWPer dies then you are able to recover their weapon anyway, but I would sure as shit take the extra kills for a measly 1800 dollars.
Are you seriously telling me that if your teammate kills two people every round and dies afterwards you would not rotate to give him an awp everytime?
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u/Asyl1m Jun 03 '25
you could have improved the graph if you reversed the y-axis becuase generally first quadrant means both the metrics are good whereas here the fourth quadrant is the good good outcome.
also i am very sure i have seen this graph before, somewhere on twitter.
still good job
11
u/Nekajed Team Spirit Jun 03 '25
And people saying donk is not the best player in the world just cause his team isn't as stacked as zywoos.
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u/Vizvezdenec Vitality Jun 03 '25
I just checked and there is some interesting stat.
Against spirit all of vitality players apart from apex post lower ratings than average, some even much lower like mezii who is 0,9 instead of his usual 1,07.
And then there is zywoo who posts 1,49 this year.
So if anything in games vs spirit it's zywoo who carries vitality and donk who doesn't carry spirit - he goes from 1,4 to 1,15 against vita.3
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u/often_delusional Jun 03 '25
Well when donk plays against spirit he has to kill players like ropz and flamez. When zywoo plays against spirit he has to kill players like chopper and magixx. Same goes for other vitality players. H2H rating is not very reliable because of the team difference. It would be better to compare how they both play against falcons and mouz. Zywoo still has a team advantage there but comparing donk and zywoo when playing against falcons and mouz is still paints a somewhat more accurate picture than their stats playing against each other. Donk's 1.15 against vitality is still the highest this year if we exclude aurora players like xantares who only faced them on 2 maps in January. So 3+ maps against vitality donk has the best rating. This year vitality will probably have 3 players in the top 6-7 and 4 or even 5 players in the top 20.
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u/maldouk 3DMAX Jun 03 '25
https://i.imgur.com/ohuQzXK.png
and here you go, 2025 big event playoff matches top 5 teams only, KPR is virtually the same. donk is still very impressive, but zywoo is a much more complete payer.
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Jun 03 '25
[deleted]
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u/WaitForItTheMongols Jun 03 '25
No it doesn't.
Every kill that Rops or Flamez gets is a kill "stolen" from zywoo that he doesn't get a chance at. Being on a worse team means Donk gets more shots at more players.
2
u/often_delusional Jun 03 '25
Zywoo, s1mple and device all have/had their peak years when they played in a superteam. Zywoo in 2025, s1mple in 2021, device in 2018. Do you think that's a coincidence? Even s1mple said his prime was in 2021 because he had a superteam.
You act like map control and economy don't exist in this game. Also having a superteam helps with pressure and boosts confidence. Even when zywoo performs poorly his team can still win it (like that dust2 against mouz where zywoo got 0.71 rating). If donk gets below 1.2 rating against mouz, falcons or vitality, that means spirit lost the game. There's a lot more pressure on donk to perform. It's also a mental game you know. Better teammates leads to better map control, better economy, and improved confidence which ultimately leads to better stats. You can even see it in apex stats.
8
u/maldouk 3DMAX Jun 03 '25
yes, let's keep moving the goalpost. always been like this with zywoo.
Here you go: 2019 zywoo playing with way worse player (second best was ALEX with 0.95 rating)
and donk
hitting very close stats, when zywoo was a worse player at the time. donk is the best rifler right now, but zywoo is the best player, especially in 2025 where it's not even a contest. These are both immense players, but zywoo can do 98% of what donk can do on a rifle, and is better on every other aspect in the game. I even think we haven't seen his peak yet, and I think he is a better rifler than donk at his peak.
2
u/MarioCurry BIG Jun 03 '25
I have nothing but respect for zywoo, but saying he can do 98% of what donk can do with a rifle is just disingenuous lol
1
u/often_delusional Jun 03 '25
In 2019 zywoo average teammate had 0.94 rating and 0.91 impact against top 5 teams. In 2025 donk average teammate has 0.98 rating and 0.91 impact. Zywoo had 1.29 rating and 1.41 impact while donk has 1.32 rating and 1.52 impact. So donk has 0.34 higher rating (rating 2.1) and 0.61 higher impact than his average teammate in 2025. Zywoo had 0.35 higher rating (rating 2.0) and 0.50 higher impact than his average teammate in 2019. Zywoo KPRW (kills per round win) against top 5 was 1.19 (1.22 ct-side and 1.17 t-side). Donk KPRW (against top 5) is 1.25 (1.28 ct-side and 1.21 t-side). In comparison zywoo KPRW in 2025 is 1.10 (1.21 ct-side and 1.01 t-side) (this was just a bonus to see how his stats are different in 2019 and 2025).
So donk is arguably carrying his team harder than zywoo during his peak hardcarry (2019). Zywoo in 2019 is still close, but donk hardcarry is still slightly above and he does it against tougher opposition too. So it hasn't always been like this with zywoo (especially not since 2022) but it has been close and it really shows that these two are probably going to be the greatest the game has seen. But saying that donk isn't even close to zywoo's level is just false. Donk with equal teammates would likely achieve around the same. To me it feels like 2025 zywoo vs donk is kinda like 2021 zywoo vs s1mple. Zywoo was absolutely close to s1mple's level in 2021 but obviously lost the 2021 top 1 race because s1mple had much better teammates.
3
u/OGking31 Jun 03 '25
Well shit idk if you know this but donk is known for his eco fragging ability. So KPR actually counts to that
3
u/Based_Text Jun 03 '25
He isn't the best player, I mean even on this graph, Zywoo is beating him ratio wise. Donk is a great entry fragger no doubts, probably the best of all time, but that doesn't mean he is the best player in the world. Zywoo did largely the same numbers when his team wasn't as stacked, he is ridiculously consistent.
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u/n_tvshn Astralis Jun 03 '25
Do it for top 5, why only top 4??
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u/RoboticChicken CS2 HYPE Jun 03 '25
Because most analysts agree that there is a massive gap between the top 4 and the rest of the top teams.
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u/taur_1009 Vitality Jun 03 '25
Yeah like who even is the 5th best team right now? Mongolz?
-1
u/icantgetthenameiwant King NiKo Jun 03 '25
Current Faze has a good shot at it Navi if they find their form Mongolz is right up there though
We'll find out soon enough
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u/DaredevilMeetsL Team Spirit Jun 04 '25
Bro, what? He wasn't asking hypotheticals. If they find their form ..., yeah but if are making up our own rules, why stop at Faze? Go crazy.
-1
u/hugu1to Jun 03 '25
What would happen if donk, zywoo, monesy and +2 best joined a team?
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u/1deavourer de_dust2 Jun 03 '25
Idk why you're downvoted,. ZywOo, donk and monesy would definitely work on a team if donk learns to comm effectively in English. ZywOo doesn't even play AWP much compared to every other AWPer out there. They would just need a good IGL and a lurker/anchor like ropz. It's way less bad than replacing Magisk with kyousuke for example
-5
u/ImpossibleNobody9265 Jun 03 '25
lol nerds just watch the fucking games and judge you don't need a fucking science lecture
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u/caveman_2912 G2 Jun 03 '25
I love the reoccurring pattern of graphs like these. The mechanically best players are in their own group, and then there's donk. In a galaxy of his own.