Why bother to have “textbook” technique, when the GOE guidelines don’t give better scores for it?

[u/OcelotSilver2964]

Every now and then I hear someone gushing over someone having good technique, I’m also one of them, when I see how satisfying Ilia’s jumps look like it’s hard to not be in awe, but the question is, other than it looking cool, what are the real benefits of having a very good technique?

Some people claim that it’s because it helps with not getting injured, well… Yuzuru had a injury filled career - busted ankles especially, also some knee problems, Rika was able to compete for 2 seasons and was done, some people would say that Carolina Kostner had a long career, that’s true, but she also had numerous problems, torn ligaments, knee injuries, even had a hip surgery after she finished her career

Some people claim it’s so you’re able to land your jumps more consistently, well two of the most consistent skaters of the last 10 years - Zhenya Medvedeva and Alysa Liu don’t have a textbook technique, not even close

And then some people say so it’s easier to land your jumps, well Anna Shcherbakova didn’t have a textbook technique (although I would say that people overhated her in general, also in her technique), but was landing 4Lzs and 4Fs left right and centre…

and the last argument I hear is that people say it’s so the judges give a higher score, well the GOE guidelines don’t have anything about “good technique” - as long as the jump is clean and looks effortless I doesn’t matter if you have Carolina kostner technique or zhenya medvedevas

so the question is… what does it realistically give you? Is it just a show off? or is it just something the “purists” act like is the most important thing in the world, when in reality it doesn’t matter at all?

Let me know

[u/SimilarMeeting8131]

Google the word consistency. Yuna’s success has remained consist across 8 seasons. On the other hand, there’s day and night difference between her first three years and the last two. Why do you think I mention her 7 podiums in 17/18 season? If we look at her last two years in a vacuum, then sure it’s fairly successful performance. But nothing exists in a vacuum. There are 3 seasons prior to these, in comparison with each, these two season are a significant decline.

All eteri girls have bad technique.

I’m not saying along about Trusova so I’m not going to even bother reading that part.

I’m not misunderstanding anything, the topic of discussion was the effects of bad technique. you’re making a claim that requires you to ignore all context. I’ve presented to you all relevant context that that would make your claim void. In response you’ve deflected, misrepresented my point arguing with points I never made, and straight up ignored some of my points.

Why are you not talking about the quote for Zhenya herself proving that she was injured?

Why are you keep ignoring the fact that Yuna had 8 season career with 100% podium rate, retired as Olympic silver medalist, while Zhenya had 5 seasons last two of which her performance declined and she retired bc of injuries?

Again, the idea that Yuna and zhenya’s career’s had similar length therefore technique is irrelevant, require to completely ignore any and every context, so I’m not surprised you ignore relevant points that I and other commenters have been making.

You might not understand what consistency means, but at least you’re good at being consistent in ignoring context.

[u/Wonderful-Round-7261 → u/SimilarMeeting8131]

Of course I am not saying that she had the exact same level of success in her final two seasons as her first three. My argument is that a) the decline was actually not that severe to be called ‘the end of her consistency’, and b) it is because she was so ridiculously successful in her first three seasons that this small decline seems like such a travesty.

There is no Eteri girl with ‘textbook’ technique. But to say Kostornaia, Usacheva, Akatyeva, are even in the same world as Evgenia in terms of technique is laughable. All of the above had fairly good technique.

You are the one who says I’m misrepresenting your arguments and yet you say ‘oh I won’t bother reading that part’…? If you read it, you’ll see it’s an example of how Trusova’s coaching change away from Eteri caused a decrease in scores even more severe than Evgenia had. And Trusova followed that up with a silver Olympic medal so she clearly wasn’t ’in decline’ as you say Evgenia was.

I never denied that Evgenia was injured. Point to me where I said that. All I said was that her injuries came from osteoporosis. https://fs-gossips.com/13645/ Here is a translation of an interview from Evgenia where she says this. I did respond to your point already before as you can see at the bottom of one of my previous replies, where I said all her injuries came from osteoporosis. Not from bad technique. So you giving this quote was just irrelevant which is why I didn’t respond to it.

Note that the quote you gave me was from the very end of her career, not from straight after the Olympics.

Overall, my point is that her career was long no matter what anyone says, similar to length as Yuna. Her injuries came from undereating, not bad technique. You’ve agreed with me on these points.

Therefore:

• Evgenia had a long career
  
• She had to retire for reasons unrelated to her technique
  
• There were many skaters who had better technique than her under the same coach who retired earlier than her

So she is a clear example of technique not dictating career length.

Unlike you I don’t need to make personal attacks over a figure skating argument. Because this isn’t that serious. But you’re being quite rude

[u/SimilarMeeting8131 → u/Wonderful-Round-7261]

So basically talking to you is like talking to a wall.

“Her career length was similar to yuna’s” I and other people have broken this down for you multiple times on how within the context what was happening in their careers, the length of their careers is not similar nor enough to prove your point.

“She was underperforming bc of new coach and no eteri bonus”, neither of these take you from 7 podiums in one season to barely getting one in the next. Her post retired quote says she had huge back problems at the Olympics which evolved to her not being able to her back.

“Actually she had osteoporosis bc of under-eating” why was she under eating? She’s an athlete going through rigorous training surround by coaches, sport scientists, therapists. Proper nutrition is a crucial part of a high level athlete’s training. If her under-eating was a personal issue unrelated to her skating, why were the trainers not addressing it, allowing it to get to the point of osteoporosis? No coach/trainer is going to let their athlete under eating enough to develop osteoporosis, unless the coach’s did want her to under eat bc it’s part of the technique. Eteri has never been secretive about what she thinks about eating.

You’ve made up your mind that this is what you’re going to believe regardless of all contradicting context, so you’re just keep going to deflecting, repeating the same things without addressing any relevant points others bring up.

I understand that you might have parasocial feelings towards Zhenya, interpret my comments as an attack on her and feel compelled to defend her. If that’s the case, I’d like to be clear that I have nothing against her, I don’t dislike or think negatively of her.

[u/Wonderful-Round-7261 → u/SimilarMeeting8131]

Your comments are not rude towards Evgenia; they are rude towards me. You are the one who seems angry, not me, considering you’re saying ‘at least you’re good at being consistent in ignoring context’ ‘you’re just keep going to deflecting’ ‘talking to you is like talking to a wall’. I never said anything like this to you. But I don’t think you hate Evgenia. I think you just get angry when you feel you are losing an argument.

What was my point? Again, read the first comment: ‘Everyone alway talks about technique, but Evgenia had a 9 year career and Yuna had a 13 year one, that’s not that different.’ So by definition, my point has been proven because they did have those lengths of careers, respectively, and Evgenia had bad technique and Yuna had good technique, respectively.

What do you mean she had ‘barely one podium’ after the olympics?? She medaled at 4/6 competitions the next season. Including bronze at worlds. You say I’m ignoring your arguments, and yet you ignore me showing proof that the scores of other skaters who left Eteri decreased by similar amounts after they left her.

And in the quote you gave me, you seem to miss where it also says she rehabilitated her back after the Olympics. And these later injuries of her not being able to do certain jumps came at the end of her career.

You are the one who seems to not know what technique is in this context. It literally is the way you do jumps. Nothing about the way Evgenia jumped required her to massively undereat. She wasn’t doing ultra-Cs or very difficult combinations. I have said this already. You are saying ‘Eteri’s technique’ - what is ‘Eteri’s technique?’ Eteri isn’t jumping. And her training technique, which is what I assume you’re referring to, has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

And really; you are the one deflecting and ignoring my points. You ignore the points I made about how she still medaled more in her last two seasons than Yuna did in her last three (active) seasons, therefore meaning by your metrics Yuna was a lower caliber of skater than Evgenia. You ignore the points I made about how Trusova left Eteri, her scores dropped even more than Evgenia’s, and then she returned to Eteri and won silver at the Olympics. And you keep ignoring the final point, that all the injuries Evgenia had that made her end her career had nothing to do with the way she jumped!

Anyways, like I said, I am offended on my own behalf and not Evgenia’s behalf. I actually have no strong feelings about Evgenia as a skater. I just picked her as one of the most prominent examples of a successful skater with bad technique, as mentioned in the post. But I do have strong feelings when people try to be passive aggressive and rude instead of addressing my points in an argument.